Civil Unrest Continues to Build Around Eastern Oregon Rancher Case

[Gold Eagle]

With someone waiving off the camera, I get the impression there is/was something they did not want recorded. And the survivors were not meant to be.... survivors.

[Old Dog New Trick]

Originally Posted by Gold Eagle

With someone waiving off the camera, I get the impression there is/was something they did not want recorded. And the survivors were not meant to be.... survivors.

Which means no one in the truck fired a shot, nor were they abetted by the police. Suicide and Swiss cheese would have been the result.

If someone on the radio had said, "shots fired" at the first stop which there very likely were according to 'witnesses' then the second set of police would have already been planning to use lethal force. (Even if the only shots fired again came from the police.)

This whole thing was amateurish from the first stop to the second stop and everything in between. They wanted a fight, it appears they were planned to instigate one if it didn't happen. Self-fulfilling prophecy.

[Gold Eagle]

I have to agree. There was comment made that the attitude of L.E.'s changed a few weeks before this happened. A lot of shady federal activity has been reported in the Burns area. Psyop type activity.

[Utah Bob]

People see what they want to see in this video.

[Paslode]

Originally Posted by Bleed Green

I have to disagree with that Pas. In my experience their rangers have been really helpful in catching illegal aliens going through BLM managed lands and turning them over or calling when they see sign.

It appears it may be all for not.....

Border agent: 'We might as well abolish our immigration laws altogether'

In a shocking reversal of policy, U.S. Customs and Border Protection agents are being told to release illegal immigrants and no longer order them to appear at deportation hearings, essentially a license to stay in the United States, a key agent testified Thursday.

What's more, the stand down order includes a requirement that the whereabouts of illegals released are not to be tracked.

"We might as well abolish our immigration laws altogether," suggested agent Brandon Judd, president of the National Border Patrol Council.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/bo...rticle/2582401



On the other hand.....

U.S. eyes ways to toughen fight against domestic extremists

The U.S. Justice Department is considering legal changes to combat what it sees as a rising threat from domestic anti-government extremists, senior officials told Reuters, even as it steps up efforts to stop Islamic State-inspired attacks at home.

Extremist groups motivated by a range of U.S.-born philosophies present a "clear and present danger," John Carlin, the Justice Department's chief of national security, told Reuters in an interview. “Based on recent reports and the cases we are seeing, it seems like we’re in a heightened environment.”

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-us...-idUSKCN0VD0FG


So illegal immigration is less of a threat than Bundy, so we let illegals flow freely through the border and we plan on shooting people like Bundy.

Makes a lot of f-ing sense.

[Bleed Green]

In my experience that first article is lacking a lot of things that accurate, well written pieces generally have an abundance of, like facts. It also sounds like somebody has not been in their job long enough to know that having 40% show up for an immigration hearing is about 38% more than those that showed up for their hearings after Amnesty was forced upon this nation.

[GratefulCitizen]

Not sure what to think of any conspiracy theories.
Guessing there are many parties with differing paths and degrees of influence/authority, all of whom have there own agendas.

Pretty sure it's all a giant cluster-f*** and nobody is really in control.

Local observations WRT Finicum and related issues:
-He is the guy in one of my delivery areas out in Cane Beds, always seemed harmless.
-He went to high school here in Page.
-Some of the involved people were apparently from Kanab, one of whom is lives in another area we deliver. I think she was arrested up there (?).
-The driver delivering that area says some people in Kanab are getting worked up and ready to fight black helicopters or something.
-Noticed some odd things when I delivered the local NPS office today. The building was locked, an NPS LEO was out front in an unmarked vehicle and not in uniform (I could see he was carrying weapon/equipment concealed). He got out and unlocked the building for my delivery, the lady receiving just said they were "having issues" and didn't elaborate.
-Haven't seen any marked NPS units out and about.

Not sure what's up, but there have been some local adjustments.

[PSM]

Originally Posted by GratefulCitizen

Not sure what to think of any conspiracy theories.
Guessing there are many parties with differing paths and degrees of influence/authority, all of whom have there own agendas.

Pretty sure it's all a giant cluster-f*** and nobody is really in control.

Local observations WRT Finicum and related issues:
-He is the guy in one of my delivery areas out in Cane Beds, always seemed harmless.
-He went to high school here in Page.
-Some of the involved people were apparently from Kanab, one of whom is lives in another area we deliver. I think she was arrested up there (?).
-The driver delivering that area says some people in Kanab are getting worked up and ready to fight black helicopters or something.
-Noticed some odd things when I delivered the local NPS office today. The building was locked, an NPS LEO was out front in an unmarked vehicle and not in uniform (I could see he was carrying weapon/equipment concealed). He got out and unlocked the building for my delivery, the lady receiving just said they were "having issues" and didn't elaborate.
-Haven't seen any marked NPS units out and about.

Not sure what's up, but there have been some local adjustments.

I have been doing some Google Earth recon of the Toroweep area for future camping spots and checked out parcel info in the area. ( http://gis.azland.gov/webapps/parcel/ )The Bundy name comes up a lot. I assume that they are an old Mormon family that is well established in that part of the country.

Apropos of nothing, really, except what I have learned of the area.

Pat

[Paslode]

Originally Posted by Bleed Green

In my experience that first article is lacking a lot of things that accurate, well written pieces generally have an abundance of, like facts. It also sounds like somebody has not been in their job long enough to know that having 40% show up for an immigration hearing is about 38% more than those that showed up for their hearings after Amnesty was forced upon this nation.

Okay so the article in your opinion is missing a lot of information, but are any of the points mentioned in the article valid?


How about this?

http://www.wsbtv.com/news/news/local...outhern/nqKry/

or this?

http://wtvr.com/2016/02/04/ms-13-gan...g-in-richmond/


Bleed Green, it just seems to me that odd folks like Bundy and Finicum are a waste of resources when we have really bad people illegally traversing our borders with near impunity. Hell we even give them room and board, and they appear to be entitled to more rights than Bundy and Finicum.

[Bleed Green]

I'll tell you what I hated about the first article. People are lying to start off with. I signed off on several NTAs the day the article came out so unless I am a rebel that is bucking the system or looking for my next suspension proposal of the year I have to call BS. Keep going from there and the lies are perpetuated and grow bolder. Stand down order, last I checked this is not Benghazi and that was hyperbole at a minimum and an outright load of BS and something that should not have come from the mouth of one who professes to believe in the Patrol's motto of Honor First. It is true that ICE is releasing illegal aliens as per the Prosecutorial Discretion memo and they, for the most part are not being tracked, other than that you take your chances.

The harsh lessons learned when Reagan was forced to sign Amnesty were long since forgotten or never learned by Mr. Judd or he would have known his comments were not based in reality. The vast majority, 94% if memory serves me correctly, of aliens issued what are now called NTAs (Warrants of Arrest/Orders to Show Cause WA/NTAs then) never showed up and not a single one of them was tracked because the technology didn't exist in the 80s and most of the 90s.

IMHO the vast number of Americans and politicians are clueless when it comes to the border as they only know of it from the news. Trump for example and his Great Wall of Mexico. Evidently he has never heard of the axiom build a 15 foot wall and I will show you a 16 foot ladder. The most misunderstood facet of these walls/infrastructure is that they are not designed to keep people out. They are meant to channel people into areas that are not urban where the odds of arrest increase exponentially the further from the end of the fence you go. Rather than having a person in a car every 100 yards we made steal into a form of multiplier and freed up agents to work the areas there the fences are not meant to be.

MS-13 in the middle of America and middle eastern illegal aliens entering the US. Those have been going on for quite a while, although the numbers of middle eastern aliens has increased. Most of America has turned a blind eye towards it though until the media really took hold of the whole gang violence narrative as well as the current situation in the middle east. Are we importing a whole list of future problems by doing this? IMHO we most certainly are. Bad people traversing our borders is not a new phenomenon as well. During the massive waves we used to experience we felt that we were arresting about 5% criminals, but today's technology has the number pinned at about 20% having a criminal record here in the US from everything to misdemeanors to rapes, child molesting and homicide.

I am not sure how many Federal resources are being devoted to the Bundy bunch since the FBI has been pretty tight lipped on how many people they have there and what resources they have. As far as being a waste of FBI resources, that is something that is in their court and not mine. Had there not been guns and armed sedition talk you may have not seen the response be nearly what it has been IMHO, but I am pretty sure they still would have wound up with federal arrest warrants.

To borrow from Billy, the opinions expressed here are solely those of the author and not of those that employ him. The do not reflect policy, standards or practices of said employer and are completely based upon the experiences of the author as well as open source material. Thanks Billy and I hope I did you justice on fair usage.

[Sdiver]

Initial reports indicate that the FBI is raiding the Refuge ...

Live call from the Refuge here ----> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cOlrSain0lk

.

... a better one here ----> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BdgfpTZvGr8

.

[Paslode]

These people sound like they ain't got all their marbles.

[Paslode]

Originally Posted by Brush Okie

You just now figuring that out.

I had FBI guy tell me last night 'Pas these clowns in Oregon are off their f-ing rockers' and it is costing us 1M a day........

I always try to give people the benfit of the doubt, but this is like Deliverance.....or like dealing with Section 8 renters. I am guessing the 4 clowns could just give up instead of all the drama.

[PSM]

Originally Posted by Paslode

I had FBI guy tell me last night 'Pas these clowns in Oregon are off their f-ing rockers' and it is costing us 1M a day.

And if everyone had just ignored them? How much would that have cost?

BLM in my neighborhood is getting weird, too. I can't tell if it's planned or a coincidence. The local hackles are up, though. BLM has been very benign until the last few months.

Pat

[Paslode]

Originally Posted by PSM

And if everyone had just ignored them? How much would that have cost?

BLM in my neighborhood is getting weird, too. I can't tell if it's planned or a coincidence. The local hackles are up, though. BLM has been very benign until the last few months.

Pat

That crossed my mind as well. Considering they aren't the brightest lot, they are more apt to harm themselves than others and their SA and OPSEC sucks......could have totally ignored them and save millions of dollars and 1 person life.