Black militia group wants to arrest Trayvon Martin shooter

[chance]

Originally Posted by Streck-Fu

If we could get the NBPP in the same location as the KKK, would they negate each other like matter and anti-matter?

May solve 2 problems at once.

Way to think outside the box.

[alelks]

Originally Posted by chance

Way to think outside the box.

Not a bad idea at all.

Idiots vs Idiots.

We could put it on Pay Per View and make a fortune.

[lksteve]

Originally Posted by alelks

We could put it on Pay Per View and make a fortune.

So how do we do that?

[alelks]

Originally Posted by lksteve

So how do we do that?

I bet Dana White from UFC could figure it out.

[The Reaper]

Originally Posted by lksteve

So how do we do that?

Happens in prison on a regular basis.

TR

[Streck-Fu]

Is the prosecutor pushing for a plea-bargain?

LINK

How Can Overcharging Be Ethical?

In his latest Huffington Post column, former Reason writer Radley Balko notes the controversy over special prosecutor Angela Corey's decision to charge George Zimmerman with second-degree murder, as opposed to manslaughter, in Trayvon Martin's death. Given the circumstances in which Zimmerman shot Martin—during a violent struggle in which Zimmerman claims he feared for his life—it seems unlikely that he acted "from ill will, hatred, spite, or an evil intent," as Florida's standard jury instruction for second-degree murder requires. The affidavit supporting Zimmerman's arrest does not clarify that point, saying only that he "profiled" and "followed" Martin, after which "Zimmerman confronted Martin and a struggle ensued." But no matter how questionable a charging decision, Balko points out, it is completely a matter of prosecutorial discretion:

Once charged, a suspect often needs to hire expensive legal representation or, if he can't afford it (and there aren't many people who can pay for representation on a murder charge), request a public defender. It likely means at least temporary incarceration, the posting of bond, and a stigma more damaging than an arrest, but less so than a conviction.

A judge may occasionally dismiss charges due to lack of evidence, but generally speaking, the decision to charge is the prosecutor's. And while police officers can be sued for a wrongful arrest, prosecutors are protected by absolute immunity, meaning that as long as they're performing a prosecutor's duties, they can't be sued.

In a 1940 speech to a gathering of U.S. attorneys, then U.S. Attorney General and future Supreme Court Justice Robert H. Jackson called the power to charge "the most dangerous power of the prosecutor," warning that prosecutors have "more control over life, liberty and reputation than any other person in America." Charging power is an "immense power to strike at citizens, not with mere individual strength, but with all the force of government itself," he said.

Mandatory minimum sentences enhance this power, allowing prosecutors to determine a defendant's punishment by deciding how to charge him, which increases the pressure for a guilty plea in a justice system where cases are rarely resolved by trial. In her book The New Jim Crow: Mass Incarceration in the Age of Colorblindness, Ohio State University law professor Michelle Alexander notes that prosecutors routinely encourage plea bargains by "overcharging" defendants, making allegations that probably could not be proven at trial (which seems to be what Corey is doing, raising Zimmerman's maximum possible prison term from 15 years to life by charging him with second-degree murder rather than manslaughter). Alexander also observes that a prosecutor "is free to dismiss a case for any reason or no reason at all." This wide discretion, she writes, makes the prosecutor "the most powerful law enforcement official in the criminal justice system."

Prosecutors are not supposed to use this power simply to rack up guilty pleas or convictions, because they are not merely advocates for one side in an adversarial process; they are public officials charged with pursuing justice. As Supreme Court Justice George Sutherland put it in a 1935 case that Balko quotes, a prosecutor is "representative not of an ordinary party to a controversy, but of a sovereignty whose obligation to govern impartially is as compelling as its obligation to govern at all; and whose interest, therefore, in a criminal prosecution is not that it shall win a case, but that justice shall be done." In this light, how can it be ethical for prosecutors to bring charges they do not sincerely believe are justified by the facts of the case?

[tonyz]

An interesting discussion with a complete transcript and audio at link below. IMO the complete discussion is worth a read or listen.

Below is a snip to merely get an idea of content.

NPR
Legal Strategies And 'Stand Your Ground' Cases
April 12, 2012

http://www.npr.org/2012/04/12/150507...zimmerman-case

Guests
Abe Laser, former assistant state attorney, Florida
Richard Hornsby, criminal defense attorney
Geoffrey Corn, law professor, South Texas College of Law

Excerpts:
Prosecutors in the case against George Zimmerman must prove that he intentionally killed Trayvon Martin, that his actions are not protected under Florida's "stand your ground law," and convince a judge to proceed with the case. His defenders will need to show Zimmerman acted in self defense.

HORNSBY: "Well, first, I'd like to - here's the thing, the Stand Your Ground law actually modified three different statutes in Florida, and it did three different things. One, it did remove the duty to retreat whenever you're confronted with violence against you. That's the primary one that everybody talks about. The second thing it did is it implemented the pretrial hearing that we've been discussing for the last 15 minutes that allows a judge to dismiss it after hearing all the evidence.

The third thing it did, which is one thing I do think needs to be changed, is it stated that a law enforcement officer can't arrest a person unless they determine that the deadly force used was unlawful or the force used was unlawful. And that seemed to be the thing that created all the outrage in this case is that George Zimmerman was never arrested. The way it used to be is that if you killed somebody, you were arrested, period. And then you could go before the judge, you know, and assert your affirmative defense and, you know, establish why you were justified in killing somebody or committing any crime for that matter that involved violence against somebody.

But the legislator made it to where, no, if the law enforcement has a credible claim of self-defense, they have to actually consider that before determining whether or not they can make an arrest. So that portion of the law that was implemented under Florida Stand Your Ground Act, which, again, it's actually enacted and changed three different statutes, I think, should be removed.

But let's be clear here about a few little things that I think gets lost in the uproar about Stand Your Ground. One, even under the old law, you had no duty to retreat if someone attacked you with their fists, meaning if Trayvon Martin would have come up to George Zimmerman and punched him in the face, George Zimmerman would've had no duty to first retreat. He could have responded back with physical force if he wanted to, not deadly force, just physical force. However, even under the old law, if Trayvon Martin would have gotten George Zimmerman to the ground and to a position where he no longer could retreat because Trayvon Martin is - allegedly was on top of him, beating his head into the ground, even under the old law, that would have been considered retreating to the door, meaning you had no other routes of escape, and then you can resort to deadly force.

The only catch, though, is that that would've had to have been a determination by the jury about whether or not that was true or not, not a judge. And so, you know, all this stuff about Stand Your Ground, you know, the castle doctrine, even under the old law, everything would have been implied exactly the same, except for the part about a judge can consider the issue. And, you know, and this isn't about a dog pooping on a lawn. This is about a 17-year-old kid who essentially was - if George Zimmerman is true, I'm not saying he is - was banging George Zimmerman's head in the ground, I would think of circumstances any person will have the right to use deadly force if they thought that the other person was going to kill them."

[tonyz]

Originally Posted by Streck-Fu

...prosecutors routinely encourage plea bargains by "overcharging" defendants, making allegations that probably could not be proven at trial (which seems to be what Corey is doing, raising Zimmerman's maximum possible prison term from 15 years to life by charging him with second-degree murder rather than manslaughter). Alexander also observes that a prosecutor "is free to dismiss a case for any reason or no reason at all." This wide discretion, she writes, makes the prosecutor "the most powerful law enforcement official in the criminal justice system."

Prosecutors are not supposed to use this power simply to rack up guilty pleas or convictions...

IME, there is occasionally a disconnect between real life and theory...does an IRS auditor or state tax auditor ever - "over assess" - in looking for a settlement or to gain leverage over an "uncooperative" taxpayer?

The public answer will almost always be an emphatic NO...

Toronto Star
April 12
...Who is Florida State Attorney Angela Corey?

http://www.thestar.com/news/world/ar...y-angela-corey

[Badger52]

Originally Posted by tonyz

...does an IRS auditor or state tax auditor ever - "over assess" - in looking for a settlement or to gain leverage over an "uncooperative" taxpayer?

Might depend on whose SuperPAC you donated to...

[Pete]

The 411 about the Trayvon Martin timeline

http://blogs.chicagotribune.com/news...12/04/411.html

"A key moment in George Zimmerman's cellphone call to the Police Department in Sanford, Fla., on the fateful night of Feb. 26 occurs at 7:11:41 p.m., a little more than two minutes into a call that lasts about four minutes.

"He's running," says Zimmerman, referring to the "real suspicious guy" he'd called in to report. Almost immediately you hear on the recording a car door opening and what sounds like a warning beep indicating the key is still in the ignition. Shortly thereafter comes the unmistakable sound of wind blowing into a phone mouthpiece............................"

This interesting piece from yesterday puts an overhead view of the subdivision, key locations and the timeline together - and asks some good questions.

Was walking through the living room a few minutes ago and ABC was showing a claimed picture of the bloody back of Z man's head - they said was taken by a bystander in the area at the time. Jeez - what else is out there.

Edited to add ABC news story link:

http://www.wftv.com/news/news/local/...hooting/nMdbw/

[orion5]

[LINK]


NEGROES WITH GUNS
April 18, 2012


Liberals have leapt on the shooting death of Trayvon Martin in Florida to push for the repeal of "stand your ground" laws and to demand tighter gun control. (MSNBC'S Karen Finney blamed "the same people who stymied gun regulation at every point.")

This would be like demanding more funding for the General Services Administration after seeing how its employees blew taxpayer money on a party weekend in Las Vegas.

We don't know the facts yet, but let's assume the conclusion MSNBC is leaping to is accurate: George Zimmerman stalked a small black child and murdered him in cold blood, just because he was black.

If that were true, every black person in America should get a gun and join the National Rifle Association, America's oldest and most august civil rights organization.

Apparently this has occurred to no one because our excellent public education system ensures that no American under the age of 60 has the slightest notion of this country's history.

Gun control laws were originally promulgated by Democrats to keep guns out of the hands of blacks. This allowed the Democratic policy of slavery to proceed with fewer bumps and, after the Civil War, allowed the Democratic Ku Klux Klan to menace and murder black Americans with little resistance.

(Contrary to what illiterates believe, the KKK was an outgrowth of the Democratic Party, with overlapping membership rolls. The Klan was to the Democrats what the American Civil Liberties Union is today: Not every Democrat is an ACLU'er, but every ACLU'er is a Democrat. Same with the Klan.)

In 1640, the very first gun control law ever enacted on these shores was passed in Virginia. It provided that blacks -- even freemen -- could not own guns.

Chief Justice Roger Taney's infamous opinion in Dred Scott v. Sandford circularly argued that blacks could not be citizens because if they were citizens, they would have the right to own guns: "[I]t would give them the full liberty," he said, "to keep and carry arms wherever they went."


With logic like that, Republicans eventually had to fight a Civil War to get the Democrats to give up slavery.

Alas, they were Democrats, so they cheated.

After the war, Democratic legislatures enacted "Black Codes," denying black Americans the rights of citizenship -- such as the rather crucial one of bearing arms -- while other Democrats (sometimes the same Democrats) founded the Ku Klux Klan.

For more than a hundred years, Republicans have aggressively supported arming blacks, so they could defend themselves against Democrats.

The original draft of the Anti-Klan Act of 1871 -- passed at the urging of Republican president Ulysses S. Grant -- made it a federal felony to "deprive any citizen of the United States of any arms or weapons he may have in his house or possession for the defense of his person, family, or property." This section was deleted from the final bill only because it was deemed both beyond Congress' authority and superfluous, inasmuch as the rights of citizenship included the right to bear arms.

Under authority of the Anti-Klan Act, President Grant deployed the U.S. military to destroy the Klan, and pretty nearly completed the job.

But the Klan had a few resurgences in the early and mid-20th century. Curiously, wherever the Klan became a political force, gun control laws would suddenly appear on the books.

This will give you an idea of how gun control laws worked. Following the firebombing of his house in 1956, Dr. Martin Luther King, who was, among other things, a Christian minister, applied for a gun permit, but the Alabama authorities found him unsuitable. A decade later, he won a Nobel Peace Prize.

How's that "may issue" gun permit policy working for you?

The NRA opposed these discretionary gun permit laws and proceeded to grant NRA charters to blacks who sought to defend themselves from Klan violence -- including the great civil rights hero Robert F. Williams.

A World War II Marine veteran, Williams returned home to Monroe, N.C., to find the Klan riding high -- beating, lynching and murdering blacks at will. No one would join the NAACP for fear of Klan reprisals. Williams became president of the local chapter and increased membership from six to more than 200.

But it was not until he got a charter from the NRA in 1957 and founded the Black Armed Guard that the Klan got their comeuppance in Monroe.

Williams' repeated thwarting of violent Klan attacks is described in his stirring book, "Negroes With Guns." In one crucial battle, the Klan sieged the home of a black physician and his wife, but Williams and his Black Armed Guard stood sentry and repelled the larger, cowardly force. And that was the end of it.

As the Klan found out, it's not so much fun when the rabbit's got the gun.

The NRA's proud history of fighting the Klan has been airbrushed out of the record by those who were complicit with the KKK, Jim Crow and racial terror, to wit: the Democrats.

In the preface to "Negroes With Guns," Williams writes: "I have asserted the right of Negroes to meet the violence of the Ku Klux Klan by armed self-defense -- and have acted on it. It has always been an accepted right of Americans, as the history of our Western states proves, that where the law is unable, or unwilling, to enforce order, the citizens can, and must act in self-defense against lawless violence."

Contrary to MSNBC hosts, I do not believe the shooting in Florida is evidence of a resurgent KKK. But wherever the truth lies in that case, gun control is always a scheme of the powerful to deprive the powerless of the right to self-defense.

COPYRIGHT 2012 ANN COULTER

[MR2]

coin.jpg

[Dusty]

Originally Posted by orion5

[LINK]


NEGROES WITH GUNS
April 18, 2012

COPYRIGHT 2012 ANN COULTER

lol I love Ann.

[orion5]

Originally Posted by Dusty

lol I love Ann.

I probably should have said a sentence or two.....actually I am not a fan of Ann, but I found her premise in this blog interesting. (And this is about the calmest I've ever seen her write.) I posted it to see if it would provoke discussion, even though I know she is not a historian and the odds are high she has gotten some of her 'facts' wrong.

[Dusty]

Originally Posted by orion5

I know she is not a historian and the odds are high she has gotten some of her 'facts' wrong.

I've yet to read anything she's written that included "wrong" facts.

She did date Mahler, though...