Afghanistan: Was It Worth It?

[bblhead672]

Afghanistan: Was It Worth It?
Written by Chuck Holton - a veteran Army ranger and NRATV correspondent

The above is one man's take on Afghanistan and whether or not the price paid in blood (the most important price) and our tax dollars was worth it.

I've been torn by this question even before reading the article. Has the deaths of 2,396 American men and women, the maiming of body, mind or both of thousands more made the US (the world) any safer? Has the influence of radical Islam and its foot soldiers willing to die been abated?

The gentleman writing the article says that the military has been successful in "weeding the garden" but that we should expect to return again and again to "weed the garden". Yet no one in leadership seems to be able to answer the question "Why must we do this?"

Why must we keep training special operations warriors in all military branches and send them off to merely "weed" until weariness sets into the political leaders and we pull out for a while to let the weeds grow again.

I know I'm merely a dumb old white man with not much formal education beyond high school, and incapable of understanding the intricacies of international statesmanship, business, politics, etc. and probably shouldn't even be raising such questions here. But you QP's are guys that I place a level of trust in believing you have the best interests of not just the country, but the American people as well.

Please understand that I have no reservation whatsoever that the men and women who have sacrificed and continue to sacrifice deserve respect and honor. I have shed many tears the last 16 years over the losses of so many of our servicemen and women.
Every time I see the flag covered coffins, the heartbroken spouse and children, the wounded and the broken, while the preening politicians and the talking heads dishonor themselves and the country I ask: Is it worth it?

To those who serve and to those who have - thank you. May your sacrifices never be in vain. God bless you all.

[pcfixer]

My humble opinion lies in the US Army soldier creed and I would state most likely in the QP's creed of Special Forces soldiers.

http://www.soc.mil/USASFC/SFcreed.html

https://www.army.mil/values/soldiers.html

As a retired Army soldier I'd wish to say thank you for all who served and died for our country. For those now serving Thank You for serving.

[sfshooter]

I think this great and honorable man's comments can reflect on how I think of the OEF conflict. He does mention Afghanistan but he is talking about the Vietnam war. Maybe 35 years from now there will be another great warrior stand up and give a very similar speech in regards to this conflict.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Gsmh4mPge0

We didn't, and haven't lost the war in Afghanistan!!!


P.S. for those that haven't seen this speech it is damn well worth it!!

[the squid]

The article posits "Was it worth it?" as if we're still not there. We're still there and debating another mini troop surge.

In my six and a half years active duty, I never spent any length of time there, and have not spent any sort of time studying anything more than a handful of tactical engagements from various books I've read.

From an operational and strategic standpoint, I have to wonder, what is our end state? What sort of conditions are they looking to meet with respect to friendly forces, enemy forces, and terrain that would facilitate our permanent withdrawal? How has our strategy and end states changed over the last fifteen years? Do they change every time a 4 star rotates out?

There are now 1SGs in the force who probably cut their teeth as Privates in the early days of OEF. Our senior Majors and a handful of Battalion Commanders as well. I'll be interested to see how their experiences shape the Army in the next ten years and more when these guys become Generals.

[Mustang Man]

The article posits "Was it worth it?" as if we're still not there. We're still there and debating another mini troop surge.

True, but that surge and our current occupation is only delaying the inevitable. Wasting more American lives is not worth a thing over there. Let's not succumb to the cognitive shortcut of a sunk-cost bias. Overall, we'll have to wait and see a couple years after ALL troops are home before declaring anything.

Was the initial invasion worth it and effective? Sure. Has the 10+ year quagmire been worth it? No. I can't speak for all OEF vets, but I felt pretty directionless over there. By that I mean the way of winning the war. I did my patrols, missions, ect. It seemed like we were there just to be there. I'm speaking from the 2012 time frame. I don't think I was "defending freedom," I just wanted to serve and do an honorable job. I never heard anyone discuss how we would win the war, careerists and show-boaters instead were more concerned with punching in their combat deployment ticket than actually wanting to bring the war to an end. 2014 was at least something different, I remember leadership actually following and wanting the war to "end" properly. As in have Dr. Ghani voted in and sign the troop agreement plan, which Karzai refused.

If you have the "progress/good intentions" mindset, you'll probably say it has all been worth it. Progress and good intentions are not enough. What are the RESULTS? Especially the long-term results/blow back. For those who would say keeping terror at bay, forget about asscrakcistan and look into the string pullers i.e. Saudi Arabia.

Hillary In Leaked Email: Saudi Arabia And Qatar Are Funding ISIS

Qatar and Saudi Arabia, which are providing clandestine financial and logistic support to ISIL and other radical Sunni groups in the region.

https://wikileaks.org/podesta-emails/emailid/3774

[tonyz]

Originally Posted by Mustang Man

Hillary In Leaked Email: Saudi Arabia And Qatar Are Funding ISIS
https://wikileaks.org/podesta-emails/emailid/3774

Interesting email.

[Badger52]

Originally Posted by tonyz

Interesting email.

No kidding. Someone (plural) has certainly been scrambling around looking for the source for some of those conclusions; and some source(s) are uttering their version of "holy shit are you f'n kidding me?" if they haven't already (literally) lost their head.

Separate issue but I note this:

7. (Note: A source in Tripoli stated in confidence that when the U.S. Embassy was evacuated, the presence of two U.S. Navy jet fighters over the city brought all fighting to a halt for several hours, as Islamist forces were not certain that these aircraft would not also provide close ground support for moderate government forces.)

Really. Yet they could conclude that some fast-movers over Benghazi blowing windows out would've had no effect? Need some rope.

[tonyz]

Originally Posted by Badger52

No kidding. Someone (plural) has certainly been scrambling around looking for the source for some of those conclusions; and some source(s) are uttering their version of "holy shit are you f'n kidding me?" if they haven't already (literally) lost their head.

Separate issue but I note this:
Really. Yet they could conclude that some fast-movers over Benghazi blowing windows out would've had no effect? Need some rope.

Yup, Trey Gowdy and others should have made some hay with this. Hopefully this does not die.

[pcfixer]

Originally Posted by Mustang Man

True, but that surge and our current occupation is only delaying the inevitable. Wasting more American lives is not worth a thing over there. Let's not succumb to the cognitive shortcut of a sunk-cost bias. Overall, we'll have to wait and see a couple years after ALL troops are home before declaring anything.


If you have the "progress/good intentions" mindset, you'll probably say it has all been worth it. Progress and good intentions are not enough. What are the RESULTS? Especially the long-term results/blow back. For those who would say keeping terror at bay, forget about asscrakcistan and look into the string pullers i.e. Saudi Arabia.

My opinion as a retired veteran is politics, We as a nation lack the political will to give SEC DEF and military the direction to WIN! WIN period.