Phoenix VA salaries

[PedOncoDoc]

Originally Posted by DocIllinois

Ah, no.

Foreign doctors are essential for meeting the demand for all types of physicians in the U.S., which has been experiencing a doctor shortage for quite some time.

The shortage has been created through higher and higher medical education costs with lower and lower return on investment. It is not financially responsible to pursue a career as a physician in the US. Many foreign medical graduates have no educational debt and are happy to come to America to work as physicians.

American medical students will have $150-$200k in debt from medical school alone (and may have more from undergraduate and/or graduate degrees before medical school). Upon graduation, MDs spend 3+ years in residency, making $35-$40k per year while working 60-80 hour work weeks with 3 weeks vacation per year. Physician salaries continue to decline due to decreased reimbursement for services (which will only get worse with the "affordable" care act), and the physicians have to pay back their loans which continue to accrue interest.

[Ape Man]

Originally Posted by PedOncoDoc

The shortage has been created through higher and higher medical education costs with lower and lower return on investment. It is not financially responsible to pursue a career as a physician in the US. Many foreign medical graduates have no educational debt and are happy to come to America to work as physicians.

American medical students will have $150-$200k in debt from medical school alone (and may have more from undergraduate and/or graduate degrees before medical school).

My sister is looking at 200k of debt to become a physical therapist. All the way until very recently, all you had to have was a master's degree to be a physical therapist. Now they require a doctorate.

Why the change? Was there some lack that previous PTs had that will be fixed with the additional education? Some study that shows that PTs with a doctorate have better recover rates?

For what it is worth, the answer to my sister's inquiries was that the change was made to raise the prestige of the profession.

[Ape Man]

Originally Posted by DocIllinois

All true.

Another factor is outright salary difference. Average VA doc salary is $177,664, after the aforementioned starvation period.

http://www.glassdoor.com/Salary/US-D...ies-E41429.htm

Docs working in the civilian sector earned an average of about $15,000 more annually.

http://money.usnews.com/careers/best...ysician/salary

While doing maintenance, I saw a list of doctors who were not board certified but who were working at the hospital I work at. They take advantage of loops holes in state law that allow them to work for a while on a temporary licenses without taking their boards. They leave the hospital for a while until the regulatory time period "resets" and then they are back at our hospital working with passing their boards. It is almost all foreign born doctors pulling this trick. Since we are State run hospital we pay our housekeepers far above what housekeepers would make on the outside but we pay our doctors far less then what they would make on the outside. So the hospital plays along with this skirting of the law.

I ask my local union president how he can support the government taking over health care when he sees how the state does it. And his reply was "I would think that the feds would do it better." From the sounds of how the Feds run the VA I would say not so much.

[Sdiver]

Originally Posted by PedOncoDoc

The shortage has been created through higher and higher medical education costs with lower and lower return on investment. It is not financially responsible to pursue a career as a physician in the US. Many foreign medical graduates have no educational debt and are happy to come to America to work as physicians.

American medical students will have $150-$200k in debt from medical school alone (and may have more from undergraduate and/or graduate degrees before medical school). Upon graduation, MDs spend 3+ years in residency, making $35-$40k per year while working 60-80 hour work weeks with 3 weeks vacation per year. Physician salaries continue to decline due to decreased reimbursement for services (which will only get worse with the "affordable" care act), and the physicians have to pay back their loans which continue to accrue interest.

Someone recently asked me why I wasn't going "all the way" and become an MD instead of just going on and becoming a P.A. ?

This, plus the insurance aspect of being an MD as opposed to be a P.A., is what I told them.

[PedOncoDoc]

Originally Posted by Sdiver

Someone recently asked me why I wasn't going "all the way" and become an MD instead of just going on and becoming a P.A. ?

This, plus the insurance aspect of being an MD as opposed to be a P.A., is what I told them.

Malpractice insurance and medical-legal liability certainly play a role in that. I see US health care going to more and more PAs (phyisician's assistants) and NPs (nurse practitioners) with few overseeing doctors.

The PAs and NPs at my institution make as much money as I do, work fewer hours, and are not typically those liable for medical error. It's a win-win-win for them.

[NurseTim]

Originally Posted by PedOncoDoc

Malpractice insurance and medical-legal liability certainly play a role in that. I see US health care going to more and more PAs (phyisician's assistants) and NPs (nurse practitioners) with few overseeing doctors.

The PAs and NPs at my institution make as much money as I do, work fewer hours, and are not typically those liable for medical error. It's a win-win-win for them.

Really? You make $85,000 a year? Geez, you're getting taken for a ride. We make anywhere from 1/2 - 1/5 of what the MD makes, depending on specialty. When I was working primary care, we did the same job as our MD, same. Granted, I'd turf my more complicated Pt. To him/her, but it always figured I was there to take the pressure off of the MD and see the less acute run of the mill stuff.

Ape Man, same in nursing only we have freaking 3-4 doctorate degrees.
What other freaking "profession" has that many? NONE, that's how many! makes us look like a bunch of histrionic neurotic ninnies. I love what I do, but I'm still trying to find my niche, I miss primary care but grinding out the numbers is brutal and not serving the Pt. Very well. Cardiology was fun, but I needed more time in. Hospice/palliative care, to beaurocrat driven rules.

[PedOncoDoc]

Originally Posted by NurseTim

Really? You make $85,000 a year? Geez, you're getting taken for a ride. We make anywhere from 1/2 - 1/5 of what the MD makes, depending on specialty. When I was working primary care, we did the same job as our MD, same. Granted, I'd turf my more complicated Pt. To him/her, but it always figured I was there to take the pressure off of the MD and see the less acute run of the mill stuff.

Ape Man, same in nursing only we have freaking 3-4 doctorate degrees.
What other freaking "profession" has that many? NONE, that's how many! makes us look like a bunch of histrionic neurotic ninnies. I love what I do, but I'm still trying to find my niche, I miss primary care but grinding out the numbers is brutal and not serving the Pt. Very well. Cardiology was fun, but I needed more time in. Hospice/palliative care, to beaurocrat driven rules.

Our NPs/PAs make more than that, and physiciansin pediatric/pediatric subspecialty medicine at an academic center make less than docs in the public sector.