Who is TRAAWW??

[echoes]

May I ask a question here, from a civilian point-of view?

The person responsible for this mockery of a flag-draped casket is in the US Military, correct?

The person responsible for this act of vulgarity has shown dis-respect not just to the Military that trained her, but to America in General, correct?

So my question is this; Why would the US Military not dis-honorably dis-charge this individual(s) from its group?

For me as a simple civilian, it makes no sense. And why?

If one of my employees took photos of something as disrespectful, lewd, vulger, and OBVIOUSLY SO abhorrent, and it was directly related to me, my kitchen, my restaurant, or my employeer, they would be history before the door could hit them in the ass on the way out of my chef shoe kicking it!

Not even a question.

That's it, just a question...

Holly

[BryanK]

Originally Posted by afchic

...How many of us could go back through our pictures from when we were young and stupid and not find pictures we are glad our parents or chain of command never saw.

Teachable moments, all.

That reminded me of "this one time...at Army camp" years ago. Some fellow AIT students thought it to be a good idea to spray paint a sheet to look like it was directly sprayed onto the tube of an M198 used for training. For a photo opportunity of course. Sprayed onto said sheet/tube, was a very detailed portrait of a phallus. Along the length of the gun tube/faux phallus, it was sprayed on to read (in stencil), "Behold, the Long C*** of Freedom". A polaroid was taken of that one, but thankfully it never went past the class.

I laughed my ass off, but that kind of stuff was funny. This photo in question was not funny. I work with kids that perform Ceremonial Guard duties for the Navy, and they said these individuals' needs to be quote "curb stomped, and throat punched". Their head caller is all of 20 years old, the rest younger. If these kids don't see the humor or in this, or see this to be an excusable offense, than no other reasonable person should either. Practice casket or not, years ago or not, this is reprehensible.

[afchic]

Originally Posted by BryanK

That reminded me of "this one time...at Army camp" years ago. Some fellow AIT students thought it to be a good idea to spray paint a sheet to look like it was directly sprayed onto the tube of an M198 used for training. For a photo opportunity of course. Sprayed onto said sheet/tube, was a very detailed portrait of a phallus. Along the length of the gun tube/faux phallus, it was sprayed on to read (in stencil), "Behold, the Long C*** of Freedom". A polaroid was taken of that one, but thankfully it never went past the class.

I laughed my ass off, but that kind of stuff was funny. This photo in question was not funny. I work with kids that perform Ceremonial Guard duties for the Navy, and they said these individuals' needs to be quote "curb stomped, and throat punched". Their head caller is all of 20 years old, the rest younger. If these kids don't see the humor or in this, or see this to be an excusable offense, than no other reasonable person should either. Practice casket or not, years ago or not, this is reprehensible.

Bryan, as to the woman this thread was started for, I have to agree with you. But as to some of the other stuff that has been brought up, often times years after the fact, I still would err on the side of "teachable moment"

[Remington Raidr]

http://www.jsonline.com/news/wiscons...245918841.html

It is in Wisconsin papers and radio now. Remember, WI is not NC. I bet she gets booted.

[Sdiver]

Originally Posted by afchic

Bryan, as to the woman this thread was started for, I have to agree with you. But as to some of the other stuff that has been brought up, often times years after the fact, I still would err on the side of "teachable moment"

So then Ma'am, would it be safe to presume that if say that picture of the Marines urinating on those dead Iraqis were to be posted two or three years after the incident happened, and all those involved were still in some fashion on AD, whether active or reserve, they would not receive any disciplinary action but that it would only be known as a "teachable moment"?

These Marines would in essence receive a "slap on the wrist" and that photo would then be sent around to different units as a "teachable moment" of what not to do.

Is that correct or am I reading something different and missing your point?

[SF_BHT]

Originally Posted by afchic

Bryan, as to the woman this thread was started for, I have to agree with you. But as to some of the other stuff that has been brought up, often times years after the fact, I still would err on the side of "teachable moment"

I think we have two teachable moments in this thread.

1st. The NG service member should get slammed and out she goes. That would be a fine teachable moment.

2nd. The AF port personnel in training should get reprimands that go into their personnel file. The NCO should have been slammed and out. She was the NCO responsable for training AF personal and setting the standards so the new airmen learn how to act and work in their new job. She made it look OK to for those deplorable acts in regards as to the manor for how we treat our fallen brothers.
Her getting a heated toung lashing is not the way to set the standards. Boot her and that would have been a correct teachable moment.

3rd. The other people in the NG photo also need UCMJ as they also were there joking around with the Training. Wonder how many of them also posted stupid comments about their duty.

I always thought it was a privelage to participate in funeral services for our departed brothers. It was always a pain getting ready but we were always 200%+ professional from A to Z as they deserved it. I have had the Honor on several occasions to pay our last respects and this attitude that has been displayed the other day and years ago is discusting.

Just my 2 cents as I see it.

[afchic]

Originally Posted by Sdiver

So then Ma'am, would it be safe to presume that if say that picture of the Marines urinating on those dead Iraqis were to be posted two or three years after the incident happened, and all those involved were still in some fashion on AD, whether active or reserve, they would not receive any disciplinary action but that it would only be known as a "teachable moment"?

These Marines would in essence receive a "slap on the wrist" and that photo would then be sent around to different units as a "teachable moment" of what not to do.

Is that correct or am I reading something different and missing your point?

No where did I say they shouldn't be punished. I just believe that court martial may not be the correct punishment. I can think of ways to make their lives miserable for quite some time. I think losing a stripe, cleaning barracks with a toothbrush, spending time in a military mortuary doing menial tasks, as well as an LOR and UIF would be appropriate. Then you allow them to "move out" from their mistake, and hopefully become a better person, soldier, sailor, airman or marine. The "teachable moment" being they are a dumb ass, but unless it is a pattern of behavior, maybe not a dumb enough ass to usher out of the service. That also teaches those around them what happens to dumb asses, and they don't want to be one.

[Team Sergeant]

It's going viral and receiving national attention.....

Tonight I'll bet Fox news has it front and center......

Now those brain dead morons will receive their 15 minutes of "fame".....


http://latino.foxnews.com/latino/new...parks-outrage/

http://www.armytimes.com/article/201...ation-launched

http://www.wxow.com/story/24748642/2...ted-by-soldier

http://www.postcrescent.com/article/...sparks-outrage

http://www.wbay.com/story/24751867/2...ternet-outrage

http://www.cbs58.com/news/local-news...245950801.html

http://wtkr.com/2014/02/18/photos-of...investigation/

http://www.wisn.com/news/south-east-...nline/24532238

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/n...photo/5579065/

http://americanlivewire.com/2014-02-...erans-funeral/

http://www.wrn.com/2014/02/guard-mem...draws-outrage/

http://www.marinecorpstimes.com/arti...ation-launched

http://www.jsonline.com/news/wiscons...246003331.html

[Streck-Fu]

That will be a righteously pissed off chain of command.

[echoes]

Originally Posted by afchic

I can think of ways to make their lives miserable for quite some time. I think losing a stripe, cleaning barracks with a toothbrush, spending time in a military mortuary doing menial tasks, as well as an LOR and UIF would be appropriate.

May I make a comment, from a civilian standpoint?

I'll just be clear, as any cook who has ever worked for me knows I have Standards. VERY, VERY high Standards as to what I expect from each and every one of them. Personally. Peroid.

Of course if they violated those, they know they would be doing dishes, scrubbing the floors, and organizing the walk-in Freezer...without a coat.

My point is, I have yet to have to result to any of those things, and why?

Respect. Plain and simple Respect for the job, respect for the title.

The THUGS in this disgusting tribute have none, IMHO.

Holly

[PRB]

Their immediate leader should be given some form of punishment...UCMJ or an art.15.
They had a mission and the primary leader lost his/her focus allowing the unit to embarrass themselves, their units and the serving military.
Their mission statement was to 'render honors' to the fallen or passing.
They rendered dishonor.
Failed mission by design/poor leadership and you pay the price.

[SF_BHT]

Originally Posted by PRB

Their immediate leader should be given some form of punishment...UCMJ or an art.15.
They had a mission and the primary leader lost his/her focus allowing the unit to embarrass themselves, their units and the serving military.
Their mission statement was to 'render honors' to the fallen or passing.
They rendered dishonor.
Failed mission by design/poor leadership and you pay the price.

Very well said Brother......
CoC sets the tone......

[head]

Any other "job", she would be out of work no questions asked. I don't know why there is even a debate regarding keeping her in the service. Yes, some times we all do stupid things, but "stupid" does not mean lack of values or character. When you are put in positions of great responsibility, there should be great consequences for failure.

With the current RIF, many good Soldiers will be looking to transition into the Guard. Free up a paragraph and line number.

[Javadrinker]

I've had the honor and privilege to be on many an Honor guard, as a member and as an NCO. At no time was any member that I was with disrespectful or make fun of the duty. But then we also we had leadership, and also pride.
In my opinion, not only should the young lady in question get sacked, but that whole group, and the NCOIC should be answering for his/her lack of attention and detail.

[echoes]

Originally Posted by head

When you are put in positions of great responsibility, there should be great consequences for failure.

Very Well Said, SIR!!!

Holly