14 Dead, 50 Hurt In Mass Shooting Inside Aurora Movie Theater

[G]

Originally Posted by BigJimCalhoun

I think you are misunderstanding how our laws work. You cannot purchase a gun from the Internet and have it delivered to your home. The firearm must be sent to a gun dealer who runs the background check.

What is the purpose of registration and licensing? Many might think that is to they can be confiscated later.

If I were to attempt to stop an active shooter, I would rather be armed. I don't have the training that many here have, but I would rather have a firearm than a set of keys, some pepper spray or some "conflict negotiation skills"

BTW, the most unsafe I have ever felt was in Perth earlier this year.

Thanks for the clarification Jim! Of course you would rather be armed to stop an active shooter, me too!! I was just pointing out that a bunch of people with no training have done so. I'm interested to know what happened in Perth, feel free to PM me.

[GratefulCitizen]

Originally Posted by G

Let me clarify; I carry a gun for work. Have carried since 1990. I have no problem with guns. I've gone through all the psych tests, agency tests etc etc and qual monthly with it for my role. To me the issue is if absolutely anyone can get almost any gun anytime, then that opens up the potential for disaster as happens time and again.

The genie is already out of the bottle.
The guns are out there (well over 200 million in the USA) and they will never be fully controlled.

Gun laws will only disarm the law abiding.
This supposed "solution" is just like the mice trying to bell the cat.

[ZonieDiver]

Tons of illegal drugs flow across our borders each year.

If guns are illegal, the same will happen.

[fng13]

I don't want to get too far into the weeds but maybe you should look at some facts about Australian violent crimes before you jump on the ban wagon.

AUSTRALIA: MORE VIOLENT CRIME DESPITE GUN BAN

It is a common fantasy that gun bans make society safer. In 2002 -- five years after enacting its gun ban -- the Australian Bureau of Criminology acknowledged there is no correlation between gun control and the use of firearms in violent crime. In fact, the percent of murders committed with a firearm was the highest it had ever been in 2006 (16.3 percent), says the D.C. Examiner.

Even Australia's Bureau of Crime Statistics and Research acknowledges that the gun ban had no significant impact on the amount of gun-involved crime:

In 2006, assault rose 49.2 percent and robbery 6.2 percent.
Sexual assault -- Australia's equivalent term for rape -- increased 29.9 percent.
Overall, Australia's violent crime rate rose 42.2 percent.
Moreover, Australia and the United States -- where no gun-ban exists -- both experienced similar decreases in murder rates:

Between 1995 and 2007, Australia saw a 31.9 percent decrease; without a gun ban, America's rate dropped 31.7 percent.
During the same time period, all other violent crime indices increased in Australia: assault rose 49.2 percent and robbery 6.2 percent.
Sexual assault -- Australia's equivalent term for rape -- increased 29.9 percent.
Overall, Australia's violent crime rate rose 42.2 percent.
At the same time, U.S. violent crime decreased 31.8 percent: rape dropped 19.2 percent; robbery decreased 33.2 percent; aggravated assault dropped 32.2 percent.
Australian women are now raped over three times as often as American women.
While this doesn't prove that more guns would impact crime rates, it does prove that gun control is a flawed policy. Furthermore, this highlights the most important point: gun banners promote failed policy regardless of the consequences to the people who must live with them, says the Examiner.

Source: Howard Nemerov, "Australia experiencing more violent crime despite gun ban," D.C. Examiner, April 8, 2009.

Source:
http://www.ncpa.org/sub/dpd/index.php?Article_ID=17847


It's a couple of years old but you get the idea.

[The Reaper]

Originally Posted by G

To me the issue is if absolutely anyone can get almost any gun anytime, then that opens up the potential for disaster as happens time and again.

Explain to me how that has happened? Any gun, any time? Have you much experience in buying firearms in the US?

BTW, laws restricting rights and providing arms only to certain classes of people was how the Ku Klux Klan successfully oppressed black Americans for many years. Letting one class of people decide who can and cannot be armed smacks a bit too much of "1984" to me. Some animals will then be more equal than others.

Incidentally, firearms deaths in the US are at historical lows, except curiously for the cities and states with the most restrictive laws. The media just covers them non-stop now as part of their agenda.

TR

[cjwils3]

Originally Posted by The Reaper

Now we (and more importantly the victims and their families) have to endure the murdering idiot grinning at us from the TV screen for the next six months.

Tragic. He should have been tried away from the media, his name never repeated, his face never shown, and his sentence carried out in a swift and effective manner. Now he has all of the notoriety he desired.

Prayers out to the families. RIP to the victims.

TR

I could not have said it better. Mr. Holmes obviously craves the spotlight and is undoubtedly relishing the attention currently being bestowed upon him by the media. Unfortunately, a large segment of the press seems to be playing right into his hands in this regard. His actions and behavior could be the result of a psychological ailment, though IMO that certainly would not make him any less culpable for it.

If it were up to me, he would've have been quietly taken to the gallows on Friday night and administered earthly justice, his name never to be spoken of again and his corpse turned over to his family for burial. It's probably a good thing, therefore, that it's not up to me...

[alelks]

This is a case of where it should be a SPEEDY trial.

Tons of witnesses, so there is no doubt that he is guilty.

Yea, we'll have to go through months of psychological examinations to see if he's nuts. He was sane enough to go to college, purchase firearms, learn how to make explosive devises and booby traps, and plan everything.

It take a pretty dedicated individual to plan and do what he did. Even if he is unstable it doesn't negate that fact that he meticulously plotted and carried out the murders of quite a few individuals. He fully understands what he did.

I say: Just take him out back and put a bullet in his head.

[Badger52]

Originally Posted by G

To me the issue is if absolutely anyone can get almost any gun anytime, then that opens up the potential for disaster as happens time and again.

Attempts to legislate human behavior have not been successful.

[Hand]

Would it not be very interesting to find that the AR used was one of the ones that 'walked'.

Furthermore, I seem to remember a few terrorists armed with nothing but box cutters inflicting far greater damage.

I in no way intend to minimize the loss of life and great deal of pain that this murderer has caused.

In the land of the un-armed, even the one armed man is king....

[Paslode]

Originally Posted by Badger52

Attempts to legislate human behavior have not been successful.

Bats, Knives, Hachets, Pencils, Scissors, Sawalls, Soda Pop, Candy.......there is no end what the TPTB can try to save us from.

“I don’t understand why the police officers across this country don’t stand up collectively and say we’re going to go on strike” – Michael Bloomberg

http://www.cnn.com/video/#/video/bes...erg-police.cnn

That might not be a bad idea, it could free up the jails and the court system, and it might make people think about how they are going to protect themselves now that the false security blanket is on strike. . But I doubt it would happen because of the revenue stream it generates.

[Destrier]

Actually, Ruth Bader Ginsberg expressed that a fully automatic assault rifle (the modern arm of the military today) is more likely to be protected by the 2nd Amendment than the pistol, of which only officers had at the time of the Constitution. Go figure.

[tonyz]

Taxation is legislation.

Something could be taxed to relative death.

IMO, we need to be particularly vigilant regarding proposed tax/fee increases (minor though they may seem at the outset) to most all components of the firearms industry.

[Richard]

This was in the Sunday DMN - if accurate, it would've been a tough "shoot out" to have in a sold-out movie theater with an armed and armored shooter like this.

IMO - the best opportunity for stopping this guy under the circumstances would've been an immediate tackle and dog-pile by people seated directly in front of him when he first came into the theater. Once he began shooting, though...

An ugly situation offering more 'ammo' for any number of political agendas and a sad ending.

Richard

[Destrier]

In either response it requires people that move toward the sound of gunfire.

[BOfH]

Originally Posted by Richard

This was in the Sunday DMN - if accurate, it would've been a tough "shoot out" to have in a sold-out movie theater with an armed and armored shooter like this.

IMO - the best opportunity for stopping this guy under the circumstances would've been an immediate tackle and dog-pile by people seated directly in front of him when he first came into the theater. Once he began shooting, though...

An ugly situation offering more 'ammo' for any number of political agendas and a sad ending.

Richard

QP Richard,
Correct me if I am wrong, AFAIK, most tactical vests are just that, tactical vests. Unless this one had plate carriers and the shooter used said plates, or was wearing a bullet proof vest underneath, wouldn't a center mass shot or two have ended this?