Why Does America Have So Many 'Peter Pan' Men?

[cbtengr]

Its' just that some of us have already been taken. I read the article twice and all that I can conclude is that some people regardless of gender are not going to find what they are looking for in a mate. There is probably not a generation of women in the last 100 years who have not asked that question. I guess at this point in my life no one is going to convince me there is not someone out there for everyone, and that a person does not just have to settle.

[cbtengr]

This topic deserves its own thread, I was bullied mercilessly when I switched schools in the 8th grade, it finally ended when I had had enough and I beat the shit out of this guy in the bleachers at a wrestling meet. No kid should have to take crap off another. In the same vein what about the 6 yr old hauled out of school in handcuffs, absolutely no fear of authority and now her mommy is upset at how her little darling was treated, btw this was a lttle girl, there are issues in this country. I'm just glad that I am back side of it all now.

[Requiem]

Feminism is only part of it. I think a big part of why men are softer these days is the shift from rural living to urban living. In 1950 the rural population was 40% and urban was 60%. Today it's 20% rural and 80% urban. (Source)

Urban man is more worried about getting his suit from the cleaners and making the commute to his air-conditioned office. He gets fit in a gym, not by working hard.

I do think television and movies have done a big disservice to men. There's hardly a male role that isn't the butt of jokes, the weakling, the idiot. The female roles are strong and smart (okay, there's dumb and sexy too). The child roles are there to show just how stupid "dad" is and how clever the kid is. (The exception was television like Cosby, who was a strong male father figure and black to boot.)

I'm familiar with the water-cooler women's talk about the lack of great men. I didn't find a good one until I was 32. Where the hell are you guys?

Paslode, sir, I appreciate your post about having a strong male in the family. Absolutely! There are too many homes without real men in them. Boys learn to be men by example.

Susan

Originally Posted by MR2

"Zero tolerance" usually translates into zero thinking/judgement.

It is a form of denial. There is no need to work things out, solve or address root causes of problems, or make any progress in understanding and figurimg out what should logically be the next step. There is no need to understand and tackle problems or issues that are just lumped into an ever growing umbrella category of zero tolerance.

Laziness, and on top of that, there just isn't enough time in an eight hour day to solve all of societies plaguing issues, or to wrap things up neat, tidy and fair like they do at the end of a one hour television program.

As for video games, there are quite a few women (and girls) out there that play video games. The game makers would be fools to limit their profits to only one segment of the population. A Nintendo DS is marketed to boys and girls.

Additionally there is a growing segment of grandmas and grandpas stepping up and playing videogames as an activity to share with their grandchildren and thereby spending time doing things their grandchildren enjoy.

[Paslode]

Originally Posted by Requiem

Feminism is only part of it. I think a big part of why men are softer these days is the shift from rural living to urban living. In 1950 the rural population was 40% and urban was 60%. Today it's 20% rural and 80% urban. (Source)

Urban man is more worried about getting his suit from the cleaners and making the commute to his air-conditioned office. He gets fit in a gym, not by working hard.

I do think television and movies have done a big disservice to men. There's hardly a male role that isn't the butt of jokes, the weakling, the idiot. The female roles are strong and smart (okay, there's dumb and sexy too). The child roles are there to show just how stupid "dad" is and how clever the kid is. (The exception was television like Cosby, who was a strong male father figure and black to boot.)

I'm familiar with the water-cooler women's talk about the lack of great men. I didn't find a good one until I was 32. Where the hell are you guys?

Paslode, sir, I appreciate your post about having a strong male in the family. Absolutely! There are too many homes without real men in them. Boys learn to be men by example.

Susan

Mom was no slouch.....she just had her own priorities for setting examples.

At age 12 she put my summer dreams of hanging out at the pool and sucking face with the honey's to a to a quick end.....8 hours a day, 5 days a week of picking up tenants trash, shitty diapers out of window wells, rocks, pulling weeds, watering shrubs, mowing and all the other crap no one wanted to do...and I had to be on site by 7:30AM to set an example that family didn't mean you got any slack.

That said, based on how those of us who were required to participate in the family business versus those who weren't required to participate....those of us who did are doing fine, those that didn't not so well.


I think that might fit into the urban versus rural class.


Somethings I hear quite often during my daily grind with customers, the majority of which are women who are either self-sufficient or have married into a comfortable lifestyle.


You're like my Dad

My Dad was a carpenter, plumber, farmer, etc.

My Dad did things like that.

I wish my husband/boyfriend could do that.

My husband/boyfriend doesn't know the working end of a screw driver.

My husband/boyfriend is good at making money but he can barely put a light bulb in.


Some of them are actually kind of annoyed their better half is mechanically inept.



My take......if you can provide financial security along with a big house, fancy dinners, vacations and new cars, and you can accomplish this getting dirty with a touch of savagery and you know proper etiquette.....You maybe the perfect man.

[GratefulCitizen]

So young single women are wondering "where are all the men?"
They are responding to the signals they're sent.

If a women communicates that she doesn't need him, can take care of herself, and has no interest in an interdependent relationship with complimentary roles, the "men" will take them at their word.
Then, these "men" will go find a woman who communicates that she actually does need him.

All that will be left is overgrown adolescents looking for a wife/mommy.
A woman who doesn't "need" him would be a real catch for such a man-child.

[Requiem]

Originally Posted by Paslode

My take......if you can provide financial security along with a big house, fancy dinners, vacations and new cars, and you can accomplish this getting dirty with a touch of savagery and you know proper etiquette.....You maybe the perfect man.

Gosh. You should write romance novels. That's exactly what the lusty heroines are looking for. (You forgot that he also has to be Highly Skilled in the bedroom.)

Kudos to your mother for raising you to be responsible, honorable and hardworking. Those qualities go along way with women. It's what we want, with kindness, a little adventure and... adoration.

You hit on something - some girls DO look for a guy who is like their daddy. Especially if daddy was their hero. It's hard to find a guy who lives up to that hero status. (Same could be said for men looking for someone that lives up to mom's standards.) But there we are - back to square one: where are all the real guys these days?

Susan

[GratefulCitizen]

Originally Posted by Requiem

Gosh. You should write romance novels. That's exactly what the lusty heroines are looking for. (You forgot that he also has to be Highly Skilled in the bedroom.)

Kudos to your mother for raising you to be responsible, honorable and hardworking. Those qualities go along way with women. It's what we want, with kindness, a little adventure and... adoration.

Could've swore that I overheard women saying something about a sharp wit and a quick tongue.

[Requiem]

Originally Posted by GratefulCitizen

If a women communicates that she doesn't need him, can take care of herself, and has no interest in an interdependent relationship with complimentary roles, the "men" will take them at their word. Then, these "men" will go find a woman who communicates that she actually does need him.

True. You're describing a dyed-in-the-wool feminist. Feminists don't need anyone and a smart guy would set off to find another woman.

But there are women who aren't feminists who earn a good living and can take care of themselves who want to share that with a man who is her equal or better.

For instance: I've got a 30 y/o beautiful, red-headed, long-legged cousin who put herself though college, earned two degrees, delivered babies in Chad as a rookie nurse and is now a nurse-anesthetist. She paid off her $70k school loan in 2 years. She rides dirt bikes, shoots guns, climbs mountains and skis down them. She writes and takes photographs. She wake-boards, water skis barefoot, kayaks down rapids, has her ham radio license, rides horses, was a gymnast, travels the world, is sweet, smart and comes from a close-knit family. She has a hell of time finding a man who can keep up with her. She's not going to settle for a momma's boy. The guy who wins her heart won't just walk away because he thinks she doesn't need him because the irony is she doesn't need him for his money, or even his sense of adventure. She'll need him because he brings something else to the deal. A real man will figure out what that is and stick around to make sure she knows what it is too.

Originally Posted by GratefulCitizen

A woman who doesn't "need" him would be a real catch for such a man-child.

Indeed. Most of us huddled around the water cooler are wary of those guys.

Susan

[Requiem]

Originally Posted by GratefulCitizen

Could've swore that I overheard women saying something about a sharp wit and a quick tongue.

[Richard]

PPSD - Peter Pan Stress Disorder. Swell.

Real men don't fret over such lifestyle choices - they just live life. Just sayin'...

And so it goes...

Richard

[Dusty]

Originally Posted by Richard

PPSD - Peter Pan Stress Disorder. Swell.

Real men don't fret over such lifestyle choices - they just live life. Just sayin'...

And so it goes...

Richard

A trait which is obviously being bred or trained away by lib educators and parents.

[Oldrotorhead]

There may be some hope. As they watch the economy and large parts of the world deteriate both of my son-in laws( in their late 30s) have asked me to teach them to shoot. One requested a pistol for Christmas and the other wants to buy a shotgun. I can teach them safety and basic skills so I now have two students. Only one of the two has even shot a bb gun . Both are increasingly aware that they need to be more self sufficient.

Now if they will just let us take a 10 year old grandson to Europe without either parent we will have made real progress.

[33army]

My mother in law gets angry when I tell her that Im going to have my daughter under cars, in the woods, shooting, riding motorcycles, and learning to drive a manual transmission. Not sure why but I think its a skill set she definatley needs. As well as cooking and the other skills females are typically taught.


If I'm lucky my little girl will be a Marine Infantry officer.