SF Combat Patches for Leg Spt

[jbour13]

If I'm not mistaken, a memorandum for record must be provided to HRC that authorizes the wear of the unit SSI.

I have 3 from my time from 1st Bn, 3rd Group. Also have a few others. I also have each in my OMPF to cover my wear of it with my DA Photo.

We have had individual augmented personnel that are authorized the wear of the unit patch. Additionally, the reg states somewhere (from what I remember) that if a company or above is attached to (TACON, OPCON) another unit, they will wear their unit patch as the SSI.

I don't agree with it just being handed out. But if you supported the CJSOTF, SOTF on down to ODA, then you deserve to wear it. SSI is a unit level appointed uniform item the same as those worn on the wearer's right. But each Soldier is responsible for their own ERB, OMPF and Photo. Wear what you want, you never know who is reviewing your file.

I've seen more people this last trip wearing the Regiment's patch and that damn Commando patch. Our Commando ODA didn't wear them because they couldn't get them.......because everyone else was apparently a commando. I'm not sure if it was the same for you VG, but everyone wanted to be part of the commando brigade.

I'll look through the regs again, but what I have up top was a board question for one of my Soldiers, and we both spent time researching it to make sure since we didn't know. I know, bad SFC, bad!

[stickey]

3/20th personnel returning received them but after having correctly read and executed the proper regs.

I know leadership from 3/20th wouldn't "hand" them out. Most within the BN/SOTF understand the reg and wouldn't falsify anything...especially after such incident (a combat patch among other stuff) was dealt with very strongly ( and appropriately) with an attached Soldier during the rotation.

[BKKMAN]

Originally Posted by BRAVO-SMASH

This happens a lot with anyone attached to ODAs as well as smaller "leg like" units attached to bigger airborne units or any other unit they think is cool. It gets as bad as Army units wearing Marine unit patches for a combat patch when Marines themselves do not wear them. Sometimes it’s a appreciative gesture that the conventional guys take some pride with serving alongside an ODA.

ALARACT 178/2010 took care of people trying to wear USMC patches, although it would seem that those that have already served with a Marine unit and have been granted approval by DCS, Army G-1 would still be allowed to wear the patch:

1. SOLDIERS WHO SERVED WITH UNITED STATES MARINE CORPS (USMC) UNITS DURING OPERATIONS THAT MEET THE CRITERIA OUTLINED IN AR 670‐1, PARAGRAPH 28‐17 WHO HAVE BEEN GRANTED WRITTEN APPROVAL BY THE DCS, ARMY G‐1 OR A DELEGATED REPRESENTATIVE ARE AUTHORIZED TO CONTINUE WEARING THAT USMC LOGO PATCH AS THEIR SSI‐FWTS.

2. IN ORDER TO PRESERVE THE UNIT HERITAGE, UNITS COMPANY LEVEL OR HIGHER THAT ARE ATTACHED OR UNDER THE OPERATIONAL CONTROL OF USMC DEPLOYED UNITS WILL NO LONGER BE GRANTED AN EXCEPTION TO POLICY TO WEAR USMC LOGO PATCHES AS THEIR SSI‐FWTS. THIS POLICY IS EFFECTIVE IMMEDIATELY.

3. INDIVIDUALS WHO SERVE WITH USMC HEADQUARTERS AS INDIVIDUAL AUGMENTEES ON STAFF WILL STILL BE AUTHORIZED TO WEAR USMC LOGO PATCHES.

FYI, para 28-17. Shoulder sleeve insignia-former wartime service (SSI–FWTS) is on page 239 of AR 670-1

[Radar Rider]

I'm not seeing what the real beef is here. I was an MI leader in the MI Detachment of 3rd Group, with two separate trips to Afghanistan and CJSOTF-A. I am NOT SF and did nothing spectacular in Afghanistan, except for doing my job. I wore the SF patch on my right shoulder (I'm retired now) for the rest of my career.

The right shoulder patch doesn't allow the Special Forces Tab, just so as to define the service.

[greenberetTFS]

For those who wear the patch,ask yourself,do you really believe it's right?..........If you do than you will have to live with yourself and that decision.........

Big Teddy

[Surgicalcric]

Originally Posted by greenberetTFS

For those who wear the patch,ask yourself,do you really believe it's right?..........If you do than you will have to live with yourself and that decision.........

Big Teddy

There is nothing to wrong to live with Teddy...

The Electric Butterknife patch is a unit patch; it is worn on the left shoulder by everyone assigned/attached/TDY to one of the 7 SF Groups. The FWS-SSI (worn on the right shoulder) is given for service in a combat zone, not for the individuals in/actions during combat. However if that were the case there would still be some support personnel who deserve to wear it more than some team guys I know.

Crip

[MtnGoat]

Originally Posted by greenberetTFS

For those who wear the patch,ask yourself,do you really believe it's right?..........If you do than you will have to live with yourself and that decision.........

Big Teddy

There are a lot of Support Soldiers and NCOs out on Fire Bases and riding in the same GMVs, RG33, MATVs and even Strykers. Getting into the same fire fights with us, eating the S%!T as any SF guy. So for me I don't have an issues with them being issued a FWS-SSI Combat Patch. They don't get wear the SF Tab. Like jbour13, ever Support or attched person MUST have that Memo to be able to wear a FWS-SSI Combat Patch. If they don't have it, not to be worn. DA photos is wear they are typically found wear a SF Group Unit patch illegally.

[Don]

Originally Posted by MtnGoat

There are a lot of Support Soldiers and NCOs out on Fire Bases and riding in the same GMVs, RG33, MATVs and even Strykers. Getting into the same fire fights with us, eating the S%!T as any SF guy. So for me I don't have an issues with them being issued a FWS-SSI Combat Patch. They don't get wear the SF Tab. Like jbour13, ever Support or attched person MUST have that Memo to be able to wear a FWS-SSI Combat Patch. If they don't have it, not to be worn. DA photos is wear they are typically found wear a SF Group Unit patch illegally.

Serious question...any award of the Combat Patch for operations in the Phillipines 2008-2009? (Not necessarily for 20th Group...but in general). Have a guy I work with wearing the SF combat patch for a trip to PI in 2008.

[mcmac61]

Originally Posted by MtnGoat

Anyone assigned to a SFG during a combat rotation can get a UNIT PATCH. They must be in the unit for I think Three months in a Combat Zone.

Yes it is or the get orders for combat patches are shoulder sleeve insignia-former wartime service (SSI–FWTS)... NOT THE SPECIAL FORCES TAB just the Special Forces Unit patch which comes with ONLY the AIRBONE TAB.

I'm 18 Series not a PAC clerk so I don't know the Regs.

As a retired support troop for SF we get the patch and not the TAB that would be wrong as 2 boys f--k--g.

[PedOncoDoc]

Originally Posted by mcmac61

As a retired support troop for SF we get the patch and not the TAB that would be wrong as 2 boys f--k--g.

You clearly haven't attended sensitivity training yet - the latter is no longer considered wrong.

[BKKMAN]

Originally Posted by Don

Serious question...any award of the Combat Patch for operations in the Phillipines 2008-2009? (Not necessarily for 20th Group...but in general). Have a guy I work with wearing the SF combat patch for a trip to PI in 2008.

There was an update that came out from the Army G-1 IRT this. As long as his TDY orders had him in support of OEF-P, he is entitled to wear the SSI-FWTS. G-1 link is at:

http://www.armyg1.army.mil/hr/unifor...20Insignia.pdf

I have also attached the document.

[Pete]

Originally Posted by BKKMAN

There was an update that came out from the Army G-1 IRT this. As long as his TDY orders had him in support of OEF-P, he is entitled to wear the SSI-FWTS. G-1 link is at:

http://www.armyg1.army.mil/hr/unifor...20Insignia.pdf

I have also attached the document.

As long as he was getting CZTE status and drawing IDP - which should be covered under the TDY orders - correct?

[Eagle5US]

Originally Posted by Pete

As long as he was getting CZTE status and drawing IDP - which should be covered under the TDY orders - correct?

Negative....
Just after Sep 11 (Sep 14) we deployed to Bosnia and took out multiple AQ targets North of Sarajevo for two weeks.

Had status, drew IDP, OERs / NCOER's state Combat, no SSI-FWTS.

[BKKMAN]

Originally Posted by Pete

As long as he was getting CZTE status and drawing IDP - which should be covered under the TDY orders - correct?

As the document I provided says, he needed to be in the PI and drawing CZTE and IDP. I was on a JCET to Mindanao in the summer of 2009 which was in support of OEF-P and said so on my 1610. We checked in with and reported to the JSOTF in Zamboanga. So the person in question could have been there either directly working for the JSOTF and its subordinate elements or he could have been there on a JCET which supported OEF-P. His orders, TDY settlement, ERB, W-2, etc. should show some evidence of combat zone time or CZTE/IDP.

Originally Posted by Eagle5US

Negative....
Just after Sep 11 (Sep 14) we deployed to Bosnia and took out multiple AQ targets North of Sarajevo for two weeks.

Had status, drew IDP, OERs / NCOER's state Combat, no SSI-FWTS.

Apples and oranges. The OEF-P memorandum is a specific revision to AR 670-1 for the Philippines. I am not discounting the nature of your service in Bosnia, but the powers that be never decided to make it an SSI-FWTS eligible area.

[Eagle5US]

Originally Posted by BKKMAN

Apples and oranges. The OEF-P memorandum is a specific revision to AR 670-1 for the Philippines. I am not discounting the nature of your service in Bosnia, but the powers that be never decided to make it an SSI-FWTS eligible area.

Not so...

My response had nothing to do with your OEF-P document...

It was posted in response to:

As long as he was getting CZTE status and drawing IDP - which should be covered under the TDY orders - correct?