Should Airports Use "Smart Screening"?

[Warrior-Mentor]

Originally Posted by armymom1228

I don't know about you, but I have a Constutionally garunteed right to privacy. I don't intend on giving it up. This smacks of pervasive fear. As long as we live in fear, they have won. If you think that TSA will be not saving stuff, you are naive.
I might as well just strip on the sidewalk and then enter the terminal.

Tell me just whom is going to pay for all this ultra expensive equipment?
Dogs are cheaper, and better and less invasive.

Tell me do you want your wife to be viewed by some stranger?
AM

Do you have a constitutionally guaranteed right to fly?

Don't want to play?

Trains, cars and boats. Help yourself.

Israel's cracked this nut. Find success, imitate.

[kgoerz]

Originally Posted by CSB

For a well executed security system, you need look no farther than El-Al Israeli Airlines for international flights. You are individually taken, alone, into an interview room, where the interviewer (who has complete knowledge of your name, address, your ticket, your seatmates, how and where the ticket was purchased, luggage checked or otherwise, your passport, etc.) asks you a series of questions.

While looking you square in the eye.

That's smart screening.

I remember being questioned once by a beautiful agent who, if she had wanted to do a full body search of me would have met with no objection whatsoever (but certainly a request for equal time) and during the questioning she asked me:

"Has anyone given you anything to carry on the airplane? A package? A parcel, perhaps?"

And I said "Of course not."

And she smiled warmly and said: "You mean 'of course not' that you wouldn't take such a parcel, not 'of course not' for my asking."

We are not Isreal! It's a lot easier for them. Compare the number of Airports and daily flights to the U.S. They cover the amount of flights equal to one of our major Airports. We have one or more Airports and numbers of flights to Israel in everyone of our States.

[kgoerz]

Originally Posted by armymom1228

I don't know about you, but I have a Constutionally garunteed right to privacy. I don't intend on giving it up. This smacks of pervasive fear. As long as we live in fear, they have won. If you think that TSA will be not saving stuff, you are naive.
I might as well just strip on the sidewalk and then enter the terminal.

Tell me just whom is going to pay for all this ultra expensive equipment?
Dogs are cheaper, and better and less invasive.

Tell me do you want your wife to be viewed by some stranger?
AM

Embrace the Suck...WE ARE AT WAR.

[Richard]

Was listening to an NPR report while running some errands - the NL say they will begin full body scans for all passengers leaving Schiopol on American flag carriers in about 3 weeks - Schiopol currently has 15 full body scan machines but they are 'voluntary' use if the passenger 'wants' it done pending EU legal approval.

What a Charlie Foxtrot of a situation that is.

And so it goes...

Richard's jaded $.02

[brown77]

Originally Posted by armymom1228

Tell me do you want your wife to be viewed by some stranger?

090408_HN_bodyScanEX.jpg

[Inceptor]

Sirs,

It seems that most concerns about these scanners spawn from a fear of being exposed to a stranger.

The following is a link to the new scanner manufacturer's website, specifically the page on the "Privacy Image" feature.

http://www.as-e.com/products_solutio...ck_privacy.asp

That aside, there are still many drawbacks to the system, least of which is the cost.

It has already been pointed out that the instrument is only as good as the person running it. Unfortunately the qualifications and requirements for becoming a TSA employee -- as well as the pay rates, hours, upward mobility, and job conditions -- are not exactly drawing the Type-A bulldogs that we need in those positions.

A large scale, real-time FTIR instrument would provide better idiot-proofing by flagging a chemical match rather than requiring the operator to use visual cues.

Another possibility would be some sort of weak EMP system capable of disabling electronic detonation devices.

Then again, we could just wrap each passenger in a spectra bag, so that their outburst is contained.

Respectfully submitted,

A.W.

[nmap]

Originally Posted by kgoerz

Embrace the Suck...WE ARE AT WAR.

I guess I would find it easier to embrace that view if I knew exactly whom we are at war with, how we will know when we have achieved victory or suffered defeat, and, for that matter, what the war entails.

So far as I can tell, the war as directed by the POTUS and Congress is not against Islam, nor Iraq, nor Afghanistan, nor even Iran. There are some ever-changing umbrella organizations such as Al Qaeda that are often mentioned, and there are the Taliban...except we want to ally with the moderate Taliban...only they don't want to be our allies?

And Pakistan is our ally. Except a lot of its people seem to hate us, and appear to at least sympathize with the Taliban and Al Qaeda, but we're sending them aid...and the government is our friend, except it tells us not to do certain things, but that's OK because they don't really mean it...

And Iraq and Afghanistan are getting ready to stand on their own, but there are reports that suggest the contrary...and then there's Yemen...except the latest terrorist came from Nigeria...

I sense a classic castle defense - we have a castle (actually, many castles), and we're trying to craft a perfect defense of each and every one of them. The other side can and will probe endlessly. This sounds like a strategy that cannot win.

Please forgive me for being rather dense. If an all-out no-holds-barred war is what's needed, along with rationing, travel documents, and so forth, then let's define the war and win it. If we don't really want to win, then I don't understand why we have to make life ever-more unpleasant for ourselves.

No doubt there are important things I don't understand. But in all my reading, here and elsewhere, the war remains ambiguous to me. My apologies for any offense given.

[Soak60]

Originally Posted by Brush Okie

All joking aside it would not be the first time people used pigs to sniff out things. I remember a program where they talked about people in the UK using pigs to sniff out truffles. I cant remember all the details but that it was done. Give people the choice. The pig or the body scan.

Yeah, I wasn't joking at all. Pigs have an excellent sense of smell and are very intelligent(maybe even too intelligent for this). And pigs and dogs could be used as just another subliminal factor (subliminal to the terrorists) in deciding whether or not a full search is justified.

Originally Posted by Brush Okie

All joking aside it would not be the first time people used pigs to sniff out things. I remember a program where they talked about people in the UK using pigs to sniff out truffles. I cant remember all the details but that it was done. Give people the choice. The pig or the body scan.

Here piggy piggy! I never did have a problem with a dog sticking its nose in my crotch. It is just doing what dogs do...pigs, well...,mmmm, what DO pigs do?

Out of curiousity why are shepards used mostly? I remember reading somewhere that bloodhounds have better smellers. Then again, they drool. Sorta like some of my recent dates.

Seems to me that pretty much everything seems unclean to Muslims. Its a wonder they can survive in this infidel ridden world.
AM

[Gypsy]

How long will these images be stored?

Where will they be stored?

What's going to happen when they get posted on the internet, and you just know they will.

Underage kids will go through that scan, what about the kiddie porn laws?

Lots to ponder. At what point is the line drawn between personal safety and personal liberties? And yes, I know we're at war.

[greenberetTFS]

Originally Posted by brown77

Attachment 14029

I'm coming out of retirement to do my duty and volunteer as a Smart Screening screener.......... We all need to do our bit.......... It's not the ideal job but someone has to do it. ...........

Big Teddy

[Richard]

I'm coming out of retirement to do my duty and volunteer as a Smart Screening screener...

Teddy,

I'm not sure that (1) your wife would allow it and (2) you heart could take it.

Now me, on the other hand...

Richard's $.02

[craigepo]

"granny panty"
Armymom, I was wanting to have a serious conversation, but now I can't get granny panties out of my mind. Big ones, like small parachutes.

"Scanners won't work. Neither will dogs."
I would have to respectfully disagree with the notion that dogs wouldn't work in this situation. We used military dogs some in Kosovo, and they worked well. Additionally, a friend of mine works bloodhounds for the missouri department of corrections---I have heard some amazing stories about these dogs. Also, I just get back from working my bird dogs, two german shorthaired pointers. Like many hunting breeds, these dogs have been bred to improve many qualities, including their sense of smell, for centuries. On a good day, these dogs can find where a quail was hours ago, track it down, point it, and not move until I get there.(a couple of weeks ago they pointed and fought a skunk, but that story will have to wait).
In Missouri, the highway patrol used to set up drug interdiction checkpoints on the interstates. They would walk drug dogs by the stopped vehicles. The dogs' noses were sensitive enough to detect drugs by walking close to the vehicles. As to whether those dogs' noses are sensitive enough to detect explosives in a terrorist's rectum, I will let somebody else determine.

[nmap]

Originally Posted by craigepo

We used military dogs some in Kosovo, and they worked well.

I have heard it said that one should always respect the views of those who have real-world experience in an area. Thank you for your insights.

[dr. mabuse]

Someone on this forum that has experience with flying in and out of Israel update me please.

El Al seems to have a pretty good record.

Specifically, how do they manage it and is it scalable?