A survival scenario: What do you do?

[The Reaper]

Originally Posted by JoelBlack

I read the original and reply post and here is something that crossed my mind. It would be difficult to maintain and overlook your assets if your were NG or AD. If that situation was ever at hand, wouldn't chances be that NG units nation wide would be activated? Same be it for AD. God and Country or God and Family? What would you choose?

If you are LEO, or a fireman, or a Guardsman, or a hospital worker, how long are you willing to leave your family alone to go to your job?

Look at Katrina. How many cops just walked off and then stayed home? How many came in and then couldn't get back home to their families?

If the disaster is localized sufficiently that forces from unaffected areas can be mobilized, then the plan might work. If it is nationwide, I do not see it working on anything more than a community or mutual aid force.

Just my .02, YMMV.

TR

[Richard]

God and Country or God and Family? What would you choose?

Now that's a good question to ponder - and - MOO - can only be answered individually if the time ever comes.

I certainly hope nobody is ever placed in that position by our government.

Richard's $.02

[JoelBlack]

If the disaster is localized sufficiently that forces from unaffected areas can be mobilized, then the plan might work. If it is nationwide, I do not see it working on anything more than a community or mutual aid force.

Good $.02!

[Pete]

Originally Posted by The Reaper

If you are LEO, or a fireman, or a Guardsman, or a hospital worker, how long are you willing to leave your family alone to go to your job?................

For the individuals TR mentioned - How well do you know your neighbors? If the city is crumbling over days and you're working overtime what is your neighborhood going to look like?

I look up and down my street and, other than the active duty folks, most are folks who can stay home with no questions asked - and many have NRA stickers on the cars.

[98G]

I chose to buy 40 acres bordering 40,000 acres of wilderness area, so if someone finds me, they may have skills I can use. So if anyone wants to provide security, I can keep a food supply going. I have minimal weapons/ammo for a long haul.

As for what is missing in the string, I have not seen anyone mention canning supplies (large pressure cooker, glass jars, more lids than jars and wax.) My fresh fruits and vegetable are great when they harvest, but at least for me, that is not 12 months a year. I use German raised gardens and get quite a large crop for a small piece of tilled land and have my own vegetables all winter from it.

Also, canning is a bit of an art/skill, so if you don't know how, good idea to learn and to practice before you need to depend on it. Many new farmers lose their first batches to mold.

[peshguy]

Originally Posted by nmap

Let us consider a scenario - a survival scenario.

Starting point:



Crisis:


Katrina was a short term example of this. One Second After, a novel about an EMP attack, considers a 1 year scenario. Some peak oil theorists suggest that such breakdown might result due to declines in oil availability. But whatever the reason, the web of trade and exchange has been disrupted.


TR[/COLOR]

Your neighbors in the small community are not as wise as you and have only limited supplies. Fortunately, you've been as gray as a person can be, so they don't know about what you have. You are within 150 miles of a number of cities of 100,000 population, and 1 city that has 250,000 people. They will have reverted, and they will be hungry. Your community (and you) are close to a major highway. You should expect large numbers of people to come through your area - at first by car, and later on foot. Many of them will be armed.


What do you do, and when?

At what point is it okay to go out to the interstate with a chain saw and drop trees in the road to slow the flow of refugees? I already know were to do it (on a steep cliff overlooking the road) and the time of day (night time is the right time) but when? The third day? If I drop the trees and its a minor catastrophe then I'm making things worse without any benefit...

Originally Posted by peshguy

At what point is it okay to go out to the interstate with a chain saw and drop trees in the road to slow the flow of refugees? I already know were to do it (on a steep cliff overlooking the road) and the time of day (night time is the right time) but when? The third day? If I drop the trees and its a minor catastrophe then I'm making things worse without any benefit...

Are you assuming they will be in vehicles? If that is the case, at which point do they start to walk after running out of gas. If it is an EMP, the vehicle is useless right off the bat. Therefore climing over trees is simple. It won't stop a flow anymore than a river will.

[Peregrino]

Originally Posted by peshguy

At what point is it okay to go out to the interstate with a chain saw and drop trees in the road to slow the flow of refugees? I already know were to do it (on a steep cliff overlooking the road) and the time of day (night time is the right time) but when? The third day? If I drop the trees and its a minor catastrophe then I'm making things worse without any benefit...

Might want to try reading "One Second After". What happens to water when you dam the stream? Unless you have a plan and the resources for dealing with a "quantity" of refugees, slowing their evacuation will just cause you more problems. NTM - I can tell you what I and most of my peers would do if somebody interupted our evac plan. Once they recovered from the shock, your heirs would appreciate having fewer mouths consuming scarce resources.

[peshguy]

Originally Posted by armymom1228

Are you assuming they will be in vehicles? If that is the case, at which point do they start to walk after running out of gas. If it is an EMP, the vehicle is useless right off the bat. Therefore climbing over trees is simple. It won't stop a flow anymore than a river will.

I'm assuming that they will be in vehicles (at first) and that the local community will throw up roadblocks once they get organized e.g. Gretna Louisiana.

Running out at night and dropping trees onto a choke point will simply by time for (lawful) authorities to do the same thing.

As far as an EMP attack goes, the attack may not be as powerful as the one depicted in "One Second After" but still capable of causing a major system disruption and refugee floods.

[peshguy]

Originally Posted by Peregrino

Might want to try reading "One Second After". What happens to water when you dam the stream? Unless you have a plan and the resources for dealing with a "quantity" of refugees, slowing their evacuation will just cause you more problems. NTM - I can tell you what I and most of my peers would do if somebody interupted our evac plan. Once they recovered from the shock, your heirs would appreciate having fewer mouths consuming scarce resources.

I've read "One Second After" While I think my community can probably get their act together, it may take them a few days to get roadblocks up, organize a plan to handle refuges etc.

As far as upsetting other peoples evac plans goes; I'm not worried about getting caught (or shot) since I know the local terrain and in one or two places it favors this type of move. The major route cuts through a ridgeline, leaving the road between steep rock embankments on each side. If I get above the road on the trail that parallels the road I can cut the trees with a chain saw, since you cant see the base of the trees from the road, Ill be safe.

I am worried about the morality of slowing down the flood of refugees and about knowing when to drop the trees. If its a biological attack, then I should drop them right away, if its a dirty bomb panic then I shouldn't drop them at all.

[Sten]

Originally Posted by peshguy

I am worried about the morality of slowing down the flood of refugees

It strikes me as relatively psychopathic to planing on disrupting and possibly injuring and killing 1000s of people.

[Pete]

Originally Posted by peshguy

.... As far as upsetting other peoples evac plans goes I'm not worried about getting caught (or shot) since I know the local terrain and in one or two places it favors this type of move..........l.

peshguy - there are a couple of thoughts on your question. The way you have posted gives the idea that you want to keep people "out" of an area.

How you do that will take organization, much more depending on the size of the area. Is everone in your "area" in agreement with your plans - what keeps people out also keeps them in? Things run out in your area and the people will want to go looking for supplies - and they'll look around them first.

Basic military planning requires obstacles to be under observation - do you have enough people to watch the obstacles and maintain order in your area? 24 hours a day?

But if you are in a small out of the way area blocking a road will only say "Something is up here."

[ACE844]

Why not make your 'area' appear as unappealing as the rest and have multiple caches of resources well hidden and spread out. That way you 'have nothing for them to take'. By outwardly appearing to be in the same situation as the 'refugees' you aren't giving them an impetus to stay or take anything from you. Just some thoughts from an uninitiated guest.

[Pete]

Originally Posted by ACE844

.... That way you 'have nothing for them to take'....

You always have something someone wants. Your life and the life of the others around you are the most important things. You let strangers get close enough to check you out and they are too close.

A face to face could turn into a quick draw contest- winner gets to look around at their leisure.

[peshguy]

Originally Posted by Pete

peshguy - there are a couple of thoughts on your question. The way you have posted gives the idea that you want to keep people "out" of an area.

How you do that will take organization, much more depending on the size of the area. Is everone in your "area" in agreement with your plans - what keeps people out also keeps them in? Things run out in your area and the people will want to go looking for supplies - and they'll look around them first.

Basic military planning requires obstacles to be under observation - do you have enough people to watch the obstacles and maintain order in your area? 24 hours a day?

But if you are in a small out of the way area blocking a road will only say "Something is up here."

More like delay access to the area rather then deny access to the area.

As far as having an agreement on doing this or forces to keep a tree barrier in place I have neither. But if the road is blocked near a major intersection I would imagine that people would back up and go around bypassing the area I live in.

When I read "One Second After" I was struck with the similarities between were I am living and the description of the town in the novel.