09-08-2005, 09:54
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#1
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Consigliere
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland (at last)
Posts: 8,836
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Leeches
Docs and 18Ds only, please.
Would you, under any circumstances, use leeches to treat a patient? Under what circumstances?
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Roguish Lawyer is offline
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09-08-2005, 10:51
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#2
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: San Diego
Posts: 231
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Can I provide info?
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mumbleypeg is offline
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09-08-2005, 11:06
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#3
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,816
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by mumbleypeg
Can I provide info?
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RL:
Say yes.
Trust me on this one.
TR
__________________
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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09-08-2005, 11:55
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#4
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: San Diego
Posts: 231
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Sticking my head out of the Leech pond
Hirudo medicinalis: is parasitic and the adults feed on the blood of mammals. It attaches to the host by means of its two suckers and bites through the skin of its victim. Simultaneously, the leech injects an anaesthetic so that its presence is not detected, and an anticoagulant in order for the incision to remain open during the meal. It has three jaws, which work back and forth during the feeding process, which ususally lasts about 20 to 40 minutes and leaves a tripartite star-shaped scar on the host. After a full meal of 10ml to 15 ml of blood, the medicinal leech may increase 8 to 11 times its initial body size. Leeches only feed about once every six months, this is about how long the blood meal takes to be fully digested. Certain bacteria keep the blood from decaying during the long digestion period. H. medicinalis may even go longer than six months without food by digesting its own tissues.
Hirudin: is the active principle in the salivary secretion of leeches. The name hirudin is from Hirudo medicinalis, the name of the medicinal leech..
In 1884 John Haycraft in Strasbourg found that leeches contained a substance with anticoagulant properties. This anticoagulant in leech saliva was isolated in the 1950s and found to be an antithrombin. The primary chemical structure of hirudin was determined in 1976.
The anticoagulant drugs desirudin and lepirudin (brand name: Refludan) are genetically engineered forms of hirudin.
Leeches are not field expedient medicine. Leeches are used post reconstruction to relieve pressure and increase venous circulation in tissue grafts. There is often constriction and or seepage in smaller blood vessels. Leeches will pull pooled blood out of the effected area, Hirudin will cause the blood flow to increase, this fosters tissue growth and helps prevent infection.
I have seen Leeches used to great effect on appendage reattachment and large tissue flap reconstruction such as burns and post-cancer reconstruction.
case studies:
http://www.leechesusa.com/LEECHESUSA/case1.asp
http://www.leechesusa.com/LEECHESUSA/case1.asp
Last edited by mumbleypeg; 09-08-2005 at 12:00.
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mumbleypeg is offline
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09-08-2005, 12:14
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#5
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Area Commander
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,355
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This thread needs photos!
__________________
"Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave whither Thou goest." - Ecclesiastes 9:10
"If simple folk are free from care and fear, simple they will be, and we must be secret to keep them so." - JRRT
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jatx is offline
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09-08-2005, 13:01
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#6
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Bladesmith to the Quiet Professionals
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Oregon, Land of the Silver Grey Sunsets
Posts: 3,886
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Good job Mumbleypeg.
RL, Reaper made the correct call.
There is much more to Mumbleypeg than we know. 
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Bill Harsey is offline
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09-08-2005, 16:04
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#7
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Consigliere
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland (at last)
Posts: 8,836
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I know MP's views. Still waiting to hear from a doctor or an 18D. 
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Roguish Lawyer is offline
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09-08-2005, 16:58
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#8
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Area Commander
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: JBLM
Posts: 1,246
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by jatx
This thread needs photos!
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The 3 jaws of said leech MP spoke of. NumNumNum!!!!!
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jbour13 is offline
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09-09-2005, 11:02
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#9
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Consigliere
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland (at last)
Posts: 8,836
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OK, so there seem to be no docs or 18Ds on this board who would use leeches on their patients, is that right?
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Roguish Lawyer is offline
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09-09-2005, 11:28
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#10
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 20,929
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I'm not a doc but I have stayed at a Holiday Inn.....
Who you need to ask are "VASCULAR SURGEONS" or you could go to this site http://www.vascularweb.org/ and run a search for leeches..... I'll do you one better... here's the article:
FDA Clears Medicinal Leeches for Marketing
The Food and Drug Administration (FDA) has for the first time cleared the commercial marketing of leeches for medicinal purposes.
Leeches can help heal skin grafts by removing blood pooled under the graft and restore blood circulation in blocked veins by removing pooled blood.
Leeches have been used as an alternative treatment to blood-letting and amputation for several thousand years. They reached their height of medicinal use in the mid- 1800’s. Today they are used in medicine throughout the world as tools in skin grafts and reattachment surgery.
Medicinal leeches (Hirudo medicinalis) are bloodsucking aquatic animals that live in fresh water.
Ricarimpex SAS, a French firm, is the first company to request and receive FDA clearance to market leeches as medical devices. The firm has been breeding leeches for 150 years. They are handled in a certified facility that tracks each lot.
Revised June 28, 2004
Hell next post you make will be putting down maggots for medical use!!!! 
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Team Sergeant is offline
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09-09-2005, 11:43
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#11
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Castle Rock, CO
Posts: 2,531
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Roguish Lawyer
OK, so there seem to be no docs or 18Ds on this board who would use leeches on their patients, is that right?
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a lawyer asking for a doctor's advise about the use of leeches on their clients...i mean, patients...? 
__________________
""A man must know his destiny. if he does not recognize it, then he is lost. By this I mean, once, twice, or at the very most, three times, fate will reach out and tap a man on the shoulder. if he has the imagination, he will turn around and fate will point out to him what fork in the road he should take, if he has the guts, he will take it.""- GEN George S. Patton
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lksteve is offline
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09-09-2005, 11:54
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#12
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Consigliere
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland (at last)
Posts: 8,836
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by lksteve
a lawyer asking for a doctor's advise about the use of leeches on their clients...i mean, patients...? |
Actually, I'm looking for alternative careers.
Still no docs or 18Ds endorsing usage . . .
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Roguish Lawyer is offline
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09-09-2005, 11:56
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#13
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Area Commander
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,355
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RL, I think you should keep some in a jar on your desk. You know, kind of like Reagan with his jelly beans...
__________________
"Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave whither Thou goest." - Ecclesiastes 9:10
"If simple folk are free from care and fear, simple they will be, and we must be secret to keep them so." - JRRT
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jatx is offline
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09-09-2005, 12:03
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#14
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Consigliere
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland (at last)
Posts: 8,836
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by jatx
RL, I think you should keep some in a jar on your desk. You know, kind of like Reagan with his jelly beans... |
Nah, I keep a big huge one on my chair.
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Roguish Lawyer is offline
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09-09-2005, 12:37
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#15
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Guerrilla Chief
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 880
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so, what do you want to know...we use them on finger/hand re-plantations,
I've used maggots on necrotic tissues that we can't surgically debride...yes, I have pics, just ask......
ss
__________________
'Revel in action, translate perceptions into instant judgements, and these into actions that are irrevocable, monumentous and dreadful - all this with lightning speed, in conditions of great stress and in an environment of high tension:what is expected of "us" is the impossible, yet we deliver just that.
(adapted from: Sherwin B. Nuland, MD, surgeon and author: The Wisdom of the Body, 1997 )
Education is the anti-ignorance we all need to better treat our patients. ss, 2008.
The blade is so sharp that the incision is perfect. They don't realize they've been cut until they're out of the fight: A Surgeon Warrior. I use a knife to defend life and to save it. ss (aka traumadoc)
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swatsurgeon is offline
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