USS Fitzgerald Rammed by ACX Crystal

[JJ_BPK]

Interesting bit of information. The Crystal did a U turn to come back to ram the Fitzgerald,, then another U turn to leave the area,, without offering any assistance..

Have ISIS terrorist taken to upping their game of using vehicles to further their cause??

We are helping the Filipinos fight the muzzy insurrections.

The collision occurred near Yokosuka, a Japanese port city that is home to the US 7th Fleet, which comprises up to 80 submarines and ships and including the USS Fitzgerald.

It is unclear where the 154-metre (505ft) guided missile destroyer ship was heading at the time.

The ACX Crystal, a 222-metre (730ft) Filipino-flagged container ship, was travelling between the Japanese cities of Nagoya and Tokyo.

Marine traffic records suggest the ACX Crystal made a sudden U-turn roughly 25 minutes before the collision with the USS Fitzgerald. It is not clear why it changed course.

Marine traffic records suggest it was travelling at 14.6 knots (27km/h) at the time of the collision.

https://citifmonline.com/2017/06/17/...ing-off-japan/

Data point: The Crystal is 50% longer and 5X the tonnage of the Fitz.. I'm surprised it did not cut the Fitz in half..

[PSM]

I've seen several maritime tracking sites showing the same thing. What bother's me is that a US Navy Destroyer should be able to not only track but to easily out maneuver a lumbering container ship.

Pat

[Old Dog New Trick]

RIP to the fallen Sailors may their families find solace and pride in their service.

Now, having seen pictures of both. Someone's head on board the Fitzgerald should roll.

Container ship had right of way. Also size matters - even if in doubt yield to the bus.

[Team Sergeant]

Originally Posted by PSM

I've seen several maritime tracking sites showing the same thing. What bother's me is that a US Navy Destroyer should be able to not only track but to easily out maneuver a lumbering container ship.

Pat

Yeah..... someone was NOT doing their jobs............ someone needs to go to prison for the deaths of 7 sailors. I hate, hate, lazy, complacent military leaders.

Has no one told the navy we are at war?

Any bets the container cpt was a muslim?

[echoes]

What happened to the folks in charge of the vessel?



Prayers out!


Holly

[The Reaper]

Preliminary reports look a lot like a deliberate act by the Crystal.

I will reserve judgement until the facts are all in.

The Captain appears to be among the casualties.

TR

[CSB]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melbou...vans_collision

Remember this?

Junior officers at the helm, loss of situational awareness. Turned, then turned again until they put their vessel squarely into the path of an aircraft carrier, said aircraft carrier cut them in half.

Or this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SS_Andrea_Doria

A "radar assisted collision" of navigational solution #2, below.

I suspect the problem may have been a combination of the two, and reminds
us all -- whether on land, at sea, or in the air:

IF THE BEARING BETWEEN YOU AND ANOTHER VESSEL REMAINS CONSTANT
OVER TIME, THERE CAN BE ONLY ONE OF TWO NAVIGATIONAL SOLUTIONS:

1 - You are on a parallel course.

2 - You are on a collision course.

The distinction requires the navigator to note the change of range that exists in the situation of a collision course.

[PSM]

Similar collision of USS Porter and MV Otowasan: Bridge Audio

Pat

[Divemaster]

Might need to update the Ramadan Killathon thread.

[LarryW]

Originally Posted by The Reaper

Preliminary reports look a lot like a deliberate act by the Crystal.

I will reserve judgement until the facts are all in.

The Captain appears to be among the casualties.

TR

Yes, sir. I concur. I'm just this old hump-backed fire horse-fart full of more opinion and piss than patience and brains. Just can't ignore the frustrating decline in Command-at-sea leadership with corruption and immorality that we've seen lately, but what-the-hell, this may not be anything new either. I just rage inside over the waste of it all and I'm not proud of my rage. I've served in ships where the wardroom was terrified to call their CO in the middle of the night and on others where they wouldn't call because they had become arrogant and thought they could figure out any problem on their own. There's a philosophy maybe an assumption of leadership and Command, but there is likewise assumptions in follower-ship. Either or both can fail, and always seem to fail when the timing is at it's worst. I can't imagine the absolute grief of the families of those lost, and likewise the agony and collapse of spirit the CO and crew feels right now. I have every confidence that the Navy will wring out every fact in the JAG. The CO will surely be relieved for cause at the very least, and others will face Courts Martial's, but none of that will console the grieving loved ones. In those ships where morale is high and the crew confident so much success is the result of consistent training and damned good leadership, but almost as much from pure dumb luck.

"Sleep thou lightly, O Nakoda...it has not been told to me that the sea has ceased to be the sea." I guess Kipling had a valid point.

[LarryW]

Originally Posted by Team Sergeant

Yeah..... someone was NOT doing their jobs............ someone needs to go to prison for the deaths of 7 sailors. I hate, hate, lazy, complacent military leaders.

Has no one told the navy we are at war?

Any bets the container cpt was a muslim?

Sir, nothing the Muzzies do should surprise anyone. No doubt some know we're up against an enemy with resolution, and some have their heads up their collective asses, and still others are morally ill equipped to fight. You're right, of course, that someone wasn't doing their job. Probably more than one. Operational ships at sea are like any semi-large fighting force, and when SHTF there are heroes and dumb shits. Failures are almost always a cascade of failures in training or materiel failures, or just lousy luck. Rarely a single point of failure. There are sadly elements in all our military who haven't heard that we are indeed at war. It's not unique to the Navy, but right now the Navy sure appears in the dark. I share your hatred of "lazy complacent leadership".

[Streck-Fu]

If the information is correct, It appears that the MCX Chrystal first made a right turn just before the collision, then after, returned to an easterly direction before U-turing to return to area of the a collision.
It seems that such a right turn is consistent with an avoidance maneuver if the Chrystal was heading east and the Fitzgerald heading south.
The Chrystal did fail to report the collision for an hour or so which added confusion to the timeline. It may answer why the collision was thought to have occurred after the U-turn when it actually happened before.

[Old Dog New Trick]

Originally Posted by Streck-Fu

If the information is correct, It appears that the MCX Chrystal first made a right turn just before the collision, then after, returned to an easterly direction before U-turing to return to area of the a collision.
It seems that such a right turn is consistent with an avoidance maneuver if the Chrystal was heading east and the Fitzgerald heading south.
The Chrystal did fail to report the collision for an hour or so which added confusion to the timeline. It may answer why the collision was thought to have occurred after the U-turn when it actually happened before.

I haven't done more than read about this in the newspapers (not much there) the pictures of damage to both ships is consistent with the GPS track of the Crystal making an abrupt right turn assisted by the Fitzgerald. (Container ships don't make 90-degree turns) - surprised it has its cargo. I'd bet the Philippine crew had their hands full just figuring out what the hell just happened.

If the Fitzgerald was running dark and there were lots of other ships at the time I could see the Crystal crew not fully understand what happened.

The US or the Japanese governments are telling us the Crystal never reported the collision for an hour. What's the Captians log book contain?

There needs to be and will be an investigation and as CSB pointed out sometimes radar has its faults (humans).

Again, I'll say it again. The MCX Crystal had right of way and the Fitzgerald was responsible to avoid the collision. This is based solely on the points of impact - wouldn't matter if the Crystal was heading east or west or north or south. The Crystal was starboard of the Fitzgerald at a crossing or overtaking angle. Fitzgerald should have yielded. Unless there was an active operation to stop the Crystal at sea for boarding and this happened...there had better be some documentation to to support that...not crew and Captain sleeping in their berths.

[bblhead672]

Having been on board a submarine at periscope depth that collided with another submarine which was on the surface, I can agree that most likely junior officer of the deck failed to understand the situation and act appropriately. In my case the junior officer, recently qualified to stand officer of the deck, confused the running lights and failed to recognize that the other submarine was coming at us instead of away from us.

Whether or not the cargo ship was attempting to ram the destroyer or not, the superior maneuverability of the warship should have allowed it to evade a collision.

[Old Dog New Trick]

I started sailing at 14 and later racing sailboats as a Captain of the boat at 16 and then by chance spent three years on a MAROPS team before retirement. Of all the times I nearly died on the water it was at night navigating by lights, sound, and instruments.

Complacency, distraction, overconfidence or just ignorance will get you into trouble fast.