11-02-2014, 20:39
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#1
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Area Commander
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Lone Star
Posts: 2,153
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PMPDW
Poor Man's PDW!
An inch longer than MP5, shoot the groups below with iron sights and three different ammo brand (50 yards from car hood, long story!), all rounds touching at 25 yards standing with red dot at 2 sec/shot, sub moh (minute-of-heart  ) at 100 yards, and sub mol (minute-of-lungs ) at 200 yards. Cost 1/2 to 1/3 of PDW's and SBR's out there. Care to guess 
__________________
"we also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope" Rom. 5:3-4
"So we can suffer, and in suffering we know who we are" David Goggins
"Aide-toi, Dieu t'aidera " Jehanne, la Pucelle
Der, der Geld verliert, verliert einiges;
Der, der einen Freund verliert, verliert viel mehr;
Der, der das Vertrauen verliert, verliert alles.
INDNJC
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frostfire is offline
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01-11-2015, 13:37
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#2
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Ft. Polk
Posts: 264
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Zastava M92?
My guess is something on the AK Platform.
__________________
You can change what you are and where you are by changing what you put into your life. -Zig Ziglar
"Nothing is more dangerous than an NCO or Officer who has been taught a technique or method, but doesn't understand the underlying principles or the "why" behind it." -MtnGoat
"How can someone improve their ability to lead? Die to self.
The most rewarding thing a leader will receive is having someone place their life in your hands and say, I will follow you." -SGT Gary Beikirch
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Toaster is offline
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01-11-2015, 19:33
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#3
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: State of Confusion
Posts: 5,880
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A poor mans MP5 ???
...is it a high point carbine ??
THAT is a poor mans MP5 !!!
...or a KelTech
__________________
Opinions stated in this post are solely those of the author, and in no way reflect the opinions or policies of The Department of Defense, The United States Army, The Royal Canadian Mounted Police, The Screen Actors Guild, The Boy Scouts, The Good, The Bad, or The Ugly. These opinions are provided purely as overly sarcastic social commentary and are not meant to be used for mission planning or navigation.
"Make sure your own mask is secure before assisting others"
-Airplane Safety Briefing
Last edited by Box; 01-11-2015 at 19:35.
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Box is offline
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01-11-2015, 20:06
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#4
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Guest
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i will second toasters reply and say zastava
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01-11-2015, 20:44
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#5
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Occupied Pineland
Posts: 4,701
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Probably not an M92. I've got one; it's a cool toy but even with an "arm brace" used as a butt stock, it isn't that accurate. MOO, YMMV.
__________________
A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear.
~ Marcus Tullius Cicero (42B.C)
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Peregrino is offline
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01-11-2015, 21:36
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#6
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Area Commander
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Lone Star
Posts: 2,153
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bladeenthusiast
i will second toasters reply and say zastava
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you guys are too smart for your own good...
The white background is using red dot and the bottom of bullseye using the iron sight at 100 yards. Also length comparison with the venerable OBR. Note the Bushnell TRS 25 on both platforms. I'm going to group it at 200 yards next since I had enough of the online gurus saying it's useless beyond 100.
It shoots stupid accurate too with this round: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrS-kya8xVA Outperforms the Hornady ballistic tip/AMAX at less than 50% cost! If I were to explain why the accuracy, it's probably along the line of what Todd H. said about short, thick, and stiff better than long, thinner, and freefloating....
The manticore muzzle break is almost a must. This video describes the performance best when the guy shoots full auto with one hand with no cheekweld and the muzzle barely rises https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6Q9eUnBbpoU
The PMPDW is an absolute hoot to shoot. Near zero recoil and you'd blaze through CSAT (or any) standards. Take the brace off, just push/pull with sling and it performs just as well and extremely mobile in vehicle. The international SOF students loved it! Thanks to ATF and CAI, only in the US this thing is called a pistol Did drill with a buddy and his MP5. While I give him the edge in speed+accuracy (less then 1 sec difference), he was lobbing 5 rds 9mm to COM versus 5 .30 cal rounds (at over 2050fps)!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Peregrino
Probably not an M92. I've got one; it's a cool toy but even with an "arm brace" used as a butt stock, it isn't that accurate. MOO, YMMV.
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Peregrino,
how much for the used "toy" ? I have 2 buyers line up already who can't find it anywhere anymore. How's $500?
Alright, I understand M92 QC may not be the best, but what rounds are you shooting? If it's FMJ or SP, then it's no bueno. HP all the way. The most accurate is the Brown-Silver-Golden bear 123gr HP variant, as well as (if you can find it) the Sapsan M83 124gr HP devastating hunting rounds. Also, IMHO a bit trigger work is necessary to squeeze that mechanical accuracy from the short barrel-ammo combo.
As you can see, mine underwent quite some mods. Trigger polishing, shaved and drilled the wood to fit piccatiny rail, Ultimak rail to cowitness irons with red dot, even some home-made heat sink between the barrel and guard....
The best part is now that I'm familiar with the process, I can just bring the parts downrange and convert any battlefield recovery into a redneck-engineered  Avtomat Kalashnikova
__________________
"we also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope" Rom. 5:3-4
"So we can suffer, and in suffering we know who we are" David Goggins
"Aide-toi, Dieu t'aidera " Jehanne, la Pucelle
Der, der Geld verliert, verliert einiges;
Der, der einen Freund verliert, verliert viel mehr;
Der, der das Vertrauen verliert, verliert alles.
INDNJC
Last edited by frostfire; 08-02-2015 at 22:47.
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frostfire is offline
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01-11-2015, 21:42
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#7
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: State of Confusion
Posts: 5,880
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those are nice looking...
...they dont look "poor" at all
__________________
Opinions stated in this post are solely those of the author, and in no way reflect the opinions or policies of The Department of Defense, The United States Army, The Royal Canadian Mounted Police, The Screen Actors Guild, The Boy Scouts, The Good, The Bad, or The Ugly. These opinions are provided purely as overly sarcastic social commentary and are not meant to be used for mission planning or navigation.
"Make sure your own mask is secure before assisting others"
-Airplane Safety Briefing
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Box is offline
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01-12-2015, 04:36
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#8
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: 18 yrs upstate NY, 30 yrs South Florida, 20 yrs Conch Republic, now chasing G-Kids in NOVA & UK
Posts: 11,901
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Billy L-bach
those are nice looking...
...they dont look "poor" at all
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Agreed, A lot of aftermarket addies... BUT very tacticool and looking practical..
How is the forearm setup working?
A lot of exposed hot bits out by the gas port..
It looks like you need a good set of oven mitts??
Has the red-dot suffered from the heat??
I can't stand on my head,, so I flipped the pic..
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Go raibh tú leathuair ar Neamh sula mbeadh a fhios ag an diabhal go bhfuil tú marbh
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JJ_BPK is offline
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01-12-2015, 12:46
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#9
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Area Commander
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Lone Star
Posts: 2,153
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JJ_BPK
Agreed, A lot of aftermarket addies... BUT very tacticool and looking practical..
How is the forearm setup working?
A lot of exposed hot bits out by the gas port..
It looks like you need a good set of oven mitts??
Has the red-dot suffered from the heat??
I can't stand on my head,, so I flipped the pic.. |
The forearm works great. I originally intended the angled grip to deal with the heat where I can hook 2 fingers in the triangle space and push the index towards the front notch, and never touch the lower forend. Instead, I can do a full C-clamp like with the AR platform. Granted I don't do 1000rds mag dump like some folks on youtube. Turned out heat is not much of a problem in comparison to other AK's I've shot with wood, plastic, or metal forend, at least with 3 mags back-to-back-to-back. No mitts so far. I wonder if this is because:
- The short barrel throws some of unburned powder out before it gets to burn and pass the heat,.
- The ultimak is not a full enclosure like original gas tube, thus allowing hot gas to escape (heat transfer via convection occurs more than conduction t)
- The homemade heat shield works as intended....
No effect so far on the red dot. I went with this option after asking those who did hundreds of mag dump if their TRS experienced any effect.
__________________
"we also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope" Rom. 5:3-4
"So we can suffer, and in suffering we know who we are" David Goggins
"Aide-toi, Dieu t'aidera " Jehanne, la Pucelle
Der, der Geld verliert, verliert einiges;
Der, der einen Freund verliert, verliert viel mehr;
Der, der das Vertrauen verliert, verliert alles.
INDNJC
Last edited by frostfire; 01-12-2015 at 12:49.
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frostfire is offline
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01-12-2015, 19:59
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#10
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Occupied Pineland
Posts: 4,701
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frostfire - I've taken steps to mitigate the initial accuracy issues with mine. As a result, your buddies probably wouldn't be that interested in it. And yes, I'm using the cheap Wolf 124 gr. After all, it's a "truck gun" and for that I'm not looking for SPR accuracy.
Side note - I don't know where your friends are looking but I've seen a number of M92s in the $500 range. Check out CDNN, Atlantic, J&J and others or take them to the Raleigh Gun Show this weekend. It will cost a little extra to get the arm brace version but in my experience they are readily available.
__________________
A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear.
~ Marcus Tullius Cicero (42B.C)
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Peregrino is offline
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01-13-2015, 01:38
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#11
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Area Commander
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Lone Star
Posts: 2,153
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peregrino
frostfire - I've taken steps to mitigate the initial accuracy issues with mine. As a result, your buddies probably wouldn't be that interested in it. And yes, I'm using the cheap Wolf 124 gr. After all, it's a "truck gun" and for that I'm not looking for SPR accuracy.
Side note - I don't know where your friends are looking but I've seen a number of M92s in the $500 range. Check out CDNN, Atlantic, J&J and others or take them to the Raleigh Gun Show this weekend. It will cost a little extra to get the arm brace version but in my experience they are readily available.
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hmmm, I wonder if you turned yours to an actual SBR. $$$ but worth it I guess
The online websites are all out to include J&g, centerfire, buds, you name it. Thanks for the gun show tip, I'll send them that way.
I'm hijacking my own threat, but would a "truck gun" be just about the same as "zombie gun"? Unless one is defending against assasination attempt by a the cartel, I don't see how justifying use of platform like M92 from/in a car would fly in the court, even in that case of 20+ punks on motorcycles versus a man and his family in his car. "Your honor, I was in fear of my life and my family, so after the first rider broke my glass I ventilated him and his 19 buddies in the face with 7.62...." Hence, it's hardly anything more than as you said, a toy
__________________
"we also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope" Rom. 5:3-4
"So we can suffer, and in suffering we know who we are" David Goggins
"Aide-toi, Dieu t'aidera " Jehanne, la Pucelle
Der, der Geld verliert, verliert einiges;
Der, der einen Freund verliert, verliert viel mehr;
Der, der das Vertrauen verliert, verliert alles.
INDNJC
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frostfire is offline
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01-13-2015, 06:18
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#12
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Location, Location
Posts: 4,073
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frostfire
I don't see how justifying use of platform like M92 from/in a car would fly in the court, even in that case of 20+ punks on motorcycles versus a man and his family in his car.
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It just might make the difference and give you the opportunity to explain your side in court verses the alternative...
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The two most powerful warriors are patience and time - Leo Tolstoy
It's Never Crowded Along the Extra Mile - Wayne Dyer
WOKE = Willfully Overlooking Known Evil
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MR2 is offline
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01-14-2015, 09:34
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#13
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Guest
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That is pretty badass man. that's a lot of money in one gun and I'll tell you by that shot group and the fact it's not a class III it's worth it, it's pretty sweet.
Last edited by Bladeenthusiast; 01-14-2015 at 11:35.
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01-14-2015, 10:44
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#14
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 20,929
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bladeenthusiast
That is pretty badass man. that's a lot of money in one gun and I'll tell you by that shot group and the fact it's not a class III it's worth it, it's pretty sweet. Tacticool as fuck  |
Really? Seriously? Do you think you're on AR-15.com?
Do we have to ban you?
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"The Spartans do not ask how many are the enemy, but where they are."
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Team Sergeant is offline
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01-14-2015, 10:59
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#15
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 20,929
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brush Okie
In the state of WA you can NOT have a loaded rifle in your vehicle. You can however have a loaded pistol with a CCW. I have been thinking about getting a pistol such as this with the Sig arm brace for a truck gun. good post.
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Whew, that's right.
(Stole this image from AR15.com)
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