ISIS Threatening to behead former US Army Ranger.

[YM Cating]

It appears IS has captured a former Ranger who, after leaving the service, formed his own aid company and went back to the middle east. How and when he was captured appear to be unknown at this time.

Let's see if Obama can live up to No Man Left Behind! Correction, let's pray that he can.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nati...icle-1.1962652

http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/...cca_story.html

http://isisstudygroup.com/

[cbtengr]

I appreciate his prior service however that being said, he was over there on his own and obviously had not prepared for his own personal security. I liken this to the ebola situation if you are an adult and you choose to put yourself in harms way and end up in a less than desirable situation why is that our problem?

[Flagg]

Originally Posted by cbtengr

I appreciate his prior service however that being said, he was over there on his own and obviously had not prepared for his own personal security. I liken this to the ebola situation if you are an adult and you choose to put yourself in harms way and end up in a less than desirable situation why is that our problem?

Well, he IS an American.

So it is an American problem isn't it?

Just a question of to what degree of a problem it is, and to what extent efforts are made to recover him, hopefully alive and intact.

I would agree that IF "Big Boys Rules" are applied at the micro level in this specific case, then they should apply to the enemy as well at both the micro and macro levels.

I'm guessing the October 3rd announcement by ISIS seems more than just coincidental in this particular case.

[YM Cating]

Originally Posted by cbtengr

I appreciate his prior service however that being said, he was over there on his own and obviously had not prepared for his own personal security. I liken this to the ebola situation if you are an adult and you choose to put yourself in harms way and end up in a less than desirable situation why is that our problem?

That may be so, or his arrangements were overpowered. Clearly they know who he was. This is our problem because they have made it our problem. Their intentions are clear. And any American taken hostage by a terrorist organization in any part of the world deserves the full support of this nation. Especially when that organization means to see us all burn.

They are making a statement. "We can take your people without consequence." How long do you really think it will be until they come to our land to take us from our homes? How long? How many more beheading's in Oklahoma? Bombings in Boston? Or buildings being brought down in New York?

If we allow them to kill our citizens, and our soldiers unmolested than we as a country have failed.

[cbtengr]

Originally Posted by YM Cating

That may be so, or his arrangements were overpowered. Clearly they know who he was. This is our problem because they have made it our problem. Their intentions are clear. And any American taken hostage by a terrorist organization in any part of the world deserves the full support of this nation. Especially when that organization means to see us all burn.

They are making a statement. "We can take your people without consequence." How long do you really think it will be until they come to our land to take us from our homes? How long? How many more beheading's in Oklahoma? Bombings in Boston? Or buildings being brought down in New York?

If we allow them to kill our citizens, and our soldiers unmolested than we as a country have failed.

They cannot take our people without consequence, of course we do get to decide the consequences. I do not have to wonder how long it will be before they are in our land, they are here. As far as taking our land goes we are not going to sit back and rollover like they are used to. They are a pretty brave bunch when it comes to going up against an under armed populace of women, children and old men. They have underestimated us as a country.

[Oldrotorhead]

Originally Posted by Flagg

Well, he IS an American.

So it is an American problem isn't it?

Just a question of to what degree of a problem it is, and to what extent efforts are made to recover him, hopefully alive and intact.

I would agree that IF "Big Boys Rules" are applied at the micro level in this specific case, then they should apply to the enemy as well at both the micro and macro levels.

I'm guessing the October 3rd announcement by ISIS seems more than just coincidental in this particular case.

This might be true and if it is true why is there a Marine in jail in Mexico with very little active help from the US Government? Clearly this treatment has been well below what would be afforded a Mexican in a US jail.

At what point do the consequences fall on the person that created the situation?

[YM Cating]

Originally Posted by cbtengr

They cannot take our people without consequence, of course we do get to decide the consequences. I do not have to wonder how long it will be before they are in our land, they are here. As far as taking our land goes we are not going to sit back and rollover like they are used to. They are a pretty brave bunch when it comes to going up against an under armed populace of women, children and old men. They have underestimated us as a country.

And yet they are. They anticipated airstrikes and adapted accordingly. We're barely scratching them. They feint one way, and strike targets in another. They've had terror cells in multiple countries start pledging their allegiance. They fluidly move from insurgent warfare, to maneuver, back to insurgent. They have a propaganda campaign so effective this Al Baghdadi could be the new Hitler. And here we sit, in shock, waiting to see what they do next.

We have allowed the enemy to dictate our actions, our tempo. It is us who have underestimated them. If they were to try to apply the same tactics here they would surely fail, we are far too well armed and organized. But if they were to get in with the gangs, use the prison system to convert violent gang members to Islam, and then use that to take gangs and essentially turn them into terror cells...Well then we would have a very serious problem.

Insurgency is the biggest threat. The infrastructure (gangs) is in place. Given their success with social media and this guy Nolen, who was in the prison system, converted to Islam, and bought into their pitch. I'd say that served as an excellent test case. Now all they have to do is intentionally do it.

I think we need a serious show of force. We should start by finding this Ranger and getting him out, and wasting every IS mofo in the AO.

Playtime is over, let's go kick some ass.

[YM Cating]

Originally Posted by Oldrotorhead

This might be true and if it is true why is there a Marine in jail in Mexico with very little active help from the US Government? Clearly this treatment has been well below what would be afforded a Mexican in a US jail.

At what point do the consequences fall on the person that created the situation?

True accept for one thing...If the Mexican were Illegal, he wouldn't be in a jail. He'd be at the local strip club spending your money.

Remember, it's racist to throw illegals in jail.

[Oldrotorhead]

Originally Posted by YM Cating

True accept for one thing...If the Mexican were Illegal, he wouldn't be in a jail. He'd be at the local strip club spending your money.

Remember, it's racist to throw illegals in jail.

I wouldn't think of throwing them in jail....................the river maybe, but not jail! And I MIGHT THINK about not giving them welfare.
Isn't is racist for thise greasers to keep an Italian American in jail?

[cbtengr]

Originally Posted by YM Cating

And yet they are. They anticipated airstrikes and adapted accordingly. We're barely scratching them. They feint one way, and strike targets in another. They've had terror cells in multiple countries start pledging their allegiance. They fluidly move from insurgent warfare, to maneuver, back to insurgent. They have a propaganda campaign so effective this Al Baghdadi could be the new Hitler. And here we sit, in shock, waiting to see what they do next.

We have allowed the enemy to dictate our actions, our tempo. It is us who have underestimated them. If they were to try to apply the same tactics here they would surely fail, we are far too well armed and organized. But if they were to get in with the gangs, use the prison system to convert violent gang members to Islam, and then use that to take gangs and essentially turn them into terror cells...Well then we would have a very serious problem.

Insurgency is the biggest threat. The infrastructure (gangs) is in place. Given their success with social media and this guy Nolen, who was in the prison system, converted to Islam, and bought into their pitch. I'd say that served as an excellent test case. Now all they have to do is intentionally do it.

I think we need a serious show of force. We should start by finding this Ranger and getting him out, and wasting every IS mofo in the AO.

Playtime is over, let's go kick some ass.

And your MOS and the unit you are assigned to is ?? What ultimately happens to ISIS is not up to us. There is no WE here that I can see this is all in the hands of? Yes that's right the POTUS and he is no Harry Truman.

[The Reaper]

I have to say, if I were a guest of IS, I am pretty sure I would rather be hit with a JDAM than have my head sawed off on video.

YMMV.

TR

[Flagg]

Originally Posted by Oldrotorhead

This might be true and if it is true why is there a Marine in jail in Mexico with very little active help from the US Government? Clearly this treatment has been well below what would be afforded a Mexican in a US jail.

At what point do the consequences fall on the person that created the situation?

http://www.latimes.com/local/la-me-m...002-story.html

It sounds like he MIGHT be coming home soon.

And it sounds like he may have lacked situation awareness for weapons carriage so close to a foreign and hostile country.

Aren't folks at risk of going to jail if they are pulled over legally carrying weapons in one state and illegally in the next?

What happens if someone accidentally crosses from Pennsylvania into New Jersey with a pistol and gets pulled over?

Does this differ from getting pinched by the Mexicans in Mexico?

While I agree with the "big boys rules" and I would think someone who served in Ranger Regiment( even just for a reasonably short period of time ) would have a better idea than most, I'd think a former Ranger working in a semi-to-non permissive area is probably going to be more effective at their role and less likely to be pinched by the bad guys than the average Peace Corps or NGO type.

So if those assumptions are reasonable, I'd be thinking he's worth investing FAR more in recovery than a piece of rubbish like Harmeet Singh Sooden.

[YM Cating]

Originally Posted by cbtengr

And your MOS and the unit you are assigned to is ?? What ultimately happens to ISIS is not up to us. There is no WE here that I can see this is all in the hands of? Yes that's right the POTUS and he is no Harry Truman.

I am a citizen of this country, that makes it as much my problem and my responsibility as anyone else. I don't need to be in the military to understand that I have a duty to this country. So yes, there is a we. The preamble to the constitution states quite clearly that we the people are responsible for providing for the common defense of this nation, among many other things. This country was founded on "we." When push comes to shove it's everyone's fight. And that's not a choice.

Yes our POTUS is weak, but that doesn't mean we must follow in suit. We can still make demands of our government. Whether they go unheeded is another matter, but we must make those demands, if for no other reason than to act when they are not met.

Allowing an American, especially one who has served this nation, to die by the hand of an enemy because we did nothing, makes all of us responsible, you, me, the neighbor down the street. Everyone. We don't have to succeed in getting our government to fight for the principle that no man shall be left behind, but we have to try.

[Richard]

MOO, but any Westerner who willfully travels to such a conflicted area not on official "We, the people" governmental business, and in spite of the numerous reports and warnings, knowing full well the historical situation there and our limited influence and access, is telling our collective governments:

"Thank you very much for the information; I fully understand the risks but I'm checking the block which waives those reasonably implied 'guarantees' of my personal safety, absolving y'all of any responsibility in the matter, and going to do what I want to do anyway."

So be it.

RE: #4, #7 and #13. I may be in error, but it sounds to me as if the "we" being tossed around so freely, used in the context of such statements, means somebody else.

That being said, based upon my experiences, the supposition that "we" are doing little to nothing to attempt to resolve the dire straits in which this particular citizen placed himself, even if he checked that waiver box, is naive in the extreme.

Richard

[The Reaper]

Originally Posted by Flagg

http://www.latimes.com/local/la-me-m...002-story.html

....And it sounds like he may have lacked situation awareness for weapons carriage so close to a foreign and hostile country.

Aren't folks at risk of going to jail if they are pulled over legally carrying weapons in one state and illegally in the next?

What happens if someone accidentally crosses from Pennsylvania into New Jersey with a pistol and gets pulled over?

Firearm Owners Protection Act of 1986, "Safe Passage" provision theoretically protects citizens briefly transiting states with a secured and unloaded firearm.

Originally Posted by Richard

MOO, but any Westerner who willfully travels to such a conflicted area not on official "We, the people" governmental business, and in spite of the numerous reports and warnings, knowing full well the historical situation there and our limited influence and access, is telling our collective governments:

"Thank you very much for the information; I fully understand the risks but I'm checking the block which waives those reasonably implied 'guarantees' of my personal safety, absolving y'all of any responsibility in the matter, and going to do what I want to do anyway."

So be it.

RE: #4, #7 and #13. I may be in error, but it sounds to me as if the "we" being tossed around so freely, used in the context of such statements, means somebody else.

That being said, based upon my experiences, the supposition that "we" are doing little to nothing to attempt to resolve the dire straits in which this particular citizen placed himself, even if he checked that waiver box, is naive in the extreme.

Richard

Richard, I tend to agree with you on this one.

Same for our citizens or residents traveling to Ebola infested areas.

Daniel Pearl was the wake-up call. Everyone since has known the potential consequences.

TR