Army OKs Women as Spec Ops Aviators

[The Reaper]

Looks like the 160th is going coed.

Without lowering the standards, of course.

Green Platoon will never be the same.

TR

Army OKs women as spec ops aviators

By Joe Gould - Staff writer
Posted : Friday Jan 11, 2013 12:14:48 EST

http://www.armytimes.com/news/2013/0...ators-011113w/

Women have been cleared for Army special operations.

The Army is recruiting women to become pilots and crew chiefs for the 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment for the first time as part of its ongoing effort to expand roles for women in the service.

The move by the 160th is the result of an appeal by Army Chief of Staff Gen. Ray Odierno to expand combat roles for women.

“We are looking for women to serve in the cockpit, we’ll start with a pilot [trial] program, and assuming there’s no significant issues, we’ll integrate women,” said Brig. Gen. Clayton Hutmacher, the commander of Army Special Operations Aviation Command. “We plan on going out and actively recruiting women. We’re fully supportive of this initiative.”

Women would serve as pilots of 160th aircraft and non-rated women would serve as crew chiefs in the backs of those aircraft, said Col. John Evans, the regimental commander.

Conventional aviation units are typically employed downrange frequently over longer periods, while special operations aviation units are often deployed heavily over shorter periods and in more austere conditions, with less support. Much of what the 160th does are dangerous and highly classified missions in support of special operations forces.

Women already serve as aviators and on air crews within conventional units in the aviation branch. Since the early 1990s, women have served in cavalry and attack missions that were closed to them up until that point, Evans said. Though Evans would not discuss specifics, he said women are already “doing lots of operational things in SOF.”

“This will certainly be one of the first forays for Army Special Operations Command, putting them in this type of role,” Evans said.

Hutmacher emphasized that there will be one standard for both men and women as the assessment and selection process becomes gender-agnostic.

Evans said he has informed his troops.

“As we bring these very talented female candidates into the 160th, they will understand up front that there is but one standard, and they’re going to have to meet that to be a part of the organization,” Evans said. “As I’ve talked to senior female officers in the Army, they say they would expect no less. They don’t want special consideration.”


Candidates must complete an application packet, kicking off a process that takes several months. The expectation is that by summer the 160th will assess its first female candidates.

Both Evans and Hutmacher said women will be recruited first in limited numbers and that they expect them to be fully integrated into the formation after the pilot program.

Odierno had issued broad guidance for leaders to examine which roles could be opened to women, and the question of female special operations aviators filtered down from Army Special Operations Command to Army Special Operations Aviation Command and the 160th itself.

“We’ve had them in Apaches and OH-58Ds for twenty years now. What is it about the 160th mission set you believe is unsuitable for them, and our answer is ‘Well, there’s nothing,’ “ Evans said.

Hutmacher described Army senior leaders as “very supportive” of the move. He said it was inevitable and that he was “very excited” by it.

The move is expected to aid pilot shortages, increasing the pool of available candidates, Hutmacher said.

Both Hutmacher and Evans said they have not heard any signs of displeasure from the ranks in reaction. Hutmacher said he assembled warrant officers and commanders to prepare them for the move.

“I haven’t gotten any push-back,” Hutmacher said. “If you think about it, we have already integrated gays into the military, and that, I don’t see it as a problem. We represent the values of the American people.”

“Militaries go through evolutions,” Evans said. “We have homosexuals serving in the military and there was a lot of consternation about that, it’s come to pass, and lo and behold we’ve seen little impact.”

[MR2]

So approximately how many women have gone through the SERE course?

[Dozer523]

Originally Posted by MR2

So approximately how many women have gone through the SERE course?

Counting the time I was sobbing like a little girl?

[MR2]

Originally Posted by Dozer523

Counting the time I was sobbing like a little girl?

LOL - you and me both my brother.

[PSM]

Originally Posted by MR2

So approximately how many women have gone through the SERE course?

Hmmm. I thought all combat aircrew had to. There are women F-16 and A-10 drivers.

Pat

[SF18C]

Originally Posted by PSM

Hmmm. I thought all combat aircrew had to. There are women F-16 and A-10 drivers.

Pat

I am not 100% sure but I think AF SERE and Army SERE are a tad different.

[ZonieDiver]

Originally Posted by Dozer523

Counting the time I was sobbing like a little girl?

Replies like this one are precisely WHY you have not been banned here, my Brother!

[PSM]

Originally Posted by SF18C

I am not 100% sure but I think AF SERE and Army SERE are a tad different.

Ah! I was under the impression that some of the AF C-130s were part of the 160th. I see that they are not. Thanks.

Pat

[koz]

I had a female in my SERE class. She was a Civil Affairs Veterinarian I think. Oh and since she was a Major, she was the class leader.... She had a hard time but made it thru.

[Pete]

Many females have gone through the Army SERE course.

And at least since the late 80's.

Every other class or three would have at least one. While not common it was not unusual.

Before the reorganization our company handled the in/out processing for SERE so I got to see the class on the first and last day.

[Surgicalcric]

Female aviators attend SERE-C at Ft Rucker along with their male counterparts. The males dont attend SERE again when they are assigned to the 160th so the different standard for SERE doesnt really apply here.

[Dusty]

I may be anachronistic about most things, but females in traditionally male jobs don't bother me as long as they're able to hack the same standard as the males.

[Richard]

I hope they can read map coordinates and terrain features better than the S**thook crew from the 11th AVN we dealt with on REFORGER once.

It was an all female crew - 2 female pilots and 2 female crew chiefs. We were playing the role of Spetznaz and had a blindfolded and hog-tied two star from V (US) Corps which we'd kidnapped from a forward TOC near Bad Hersfeld, and were being extracted at daylight to bring him back to Camp Worden and the "People's Pond" for questioning. V Corps security elements were hot on our tails and we could see the s**thook flying circles looking for us across the moutain range over in the wrong valley. We were enforcing radio silence and - finally - the CH47 gave up and came flying near enough to us on their way back to their airfield that we nearly hit 'em in the nose with a couple of star clusters to gain their attention before they saw our panels and came for us.

And so it goes...

Richard

[The Reaper]

Originally Posted by Dusty

"...as long as they're able to hack the same standard as the males....

Therein lies the rub.

Why do we have two sets of PT test standards again?

TR

[Dusty]

Originally Posted by The Reaper

Therein lies the rub.

Why do we have two sets of PT test standards again?

TR

Exactly my point, 'mano.