06-14-2011, 08:00
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#1
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: 18 yrs upstate NY, 30 yrs South Florida, 20 yrs Conch Republic, now chasing G-Kids in NOVA & UK
Posts: 11,901
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Corps to Replace SAW With Automatic Rifle
Not new news,, but anyone want to opine???
Updated: I was not a fan-boy of the M249.
A 5.56 SAW never gave me a tingle.
Given the M60 & ammo weight,, to me it was worth is..
Quote:
Corps to Replace SAW With Automatic Rifle
http://www.military.com/news/article...tml?ESRC=eb.nl
Marine infantry squads will replace their M249 light machine gun with a highly accurate, auto rifle geared for fast-moving assaults. In late May, Gen. James Amos, commandant of the Marine Corps, approved a plan to field the M27 Infantry Automatic Rifle to all Marine infantry battalions.
The lightweight auto rifle, made by Heckler & Koch, is a variant of the 5.56mm H&K 416. It weighs just under eight pounds unloaded -- almost 10 pounds less than the M249 Squad Automatic Weapon.
The decision comes after the Corps fielded 458 M27s to five battalions as they prepared for upcoming deployments to Afghanistan.
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Quote:
http://world.guns.ru/assault/usa/m27-iar-e.html
Heckler-Koch HK M27 IAR Infantry Automatic Rifle (USA / Germany)
M27 IAR Infantry Automatic Rifle, as made by HK USA for US Marine Corps
Caliber: 5.56x45mm NATO
Action: Gas operated, rotating bolt
Overall length: 838 - 937 mm / 33" - 36.9"
Barrel length: 420 mm / 16.5"
Weight: 3.6 kg / 7.9 lbs empty
Rate of fire: rounds per minute
Magazine capacity: 30 rounds standard
The IAR - Infantry Automatic Rifle program was originally initiated by US Marine Corps (USMC) in an apparent intent to replace aging M249 SAW light machine guns in their "automatic rifle" (squad automatic) role. USMC sought lighter and more maneuverable weapon, still capable of at least some sustained firepower. Original contenders included guns from FN, Colt and Heckler-Koch, as well as some other, lesser known names. After extensive trials in 2009 USMC finally selected the HK IAR rifle, which, in fact, is no more that heavy-barreled version of their HK 416 automatic carbine (assault rifle), and it hardly looks like adequate replacement for a dedicated squad automatic weapon with belt feed and quick-change barrel. By all accounts, it looks like USMC played the whole IAR trick to get the replacement for their M4 carbines without entering the political hassle and budgetary debates. In May 2010 the USMC representative officially anounced the adoption of the Heckler-Koch IAR as M27 Infantry Automatic Rifle". It is not clear when HK will begin delivery of the M27 rifles, and how much rifles will be delivered to USMC.
The M27 Infantry Automatic Rifle is a gas-operated weapon which is based on the HK 416 assault rifle. It uses short-stroke gas piston that operates the 7-lug rotating bolt, and fires from closed bolt. Receiver is made from high grade aluminum alloy. Combination-type safety / fire selector allows for single shots and full automatic mode. M27 IAR retains all M16-style controls, including last round bolt hold-open device, rear-based charging handle and magazine release button on the right side of the magazine well. M27 IAR is fitted with four Picatinny rails as standard, and may accept any type of sighting devices on STANAG-1913 compliant mounts. Buttstock is of typical M4 design, multi-position telescoped. M27 Infantry Automatic Rifle can feed from standard M16-type 30 round magazines, and will also accept high-capacity double-drum magazines from Beta Co (100 rounds capacity) and Armatac (150 rounds capacity).
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Last edited by JJ_BPK; 06-14-2011 at 08:15.
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JJ_BPK is offline
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06-14-2011, 08:12
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#2
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: In transit somewhere
Posts: 4,044
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So... essentially they are going back to a 5.56 version of the BAR? Mag changes are going to be a bitch if it's the auto support for ops... SRF will drop... Getting rid of the medium weapons might not be a good idea.
Just my .02 as a washed up 18B turned 18D
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x SF med is offline
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06-14-2011, 08:22
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#3
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: May 2009
Location: AZ
Posts: 618
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5.56 BAR
WTF!!!! Guess Marines don't need supressive fire. Since they are going this way though they need to increase the weapon's weight so it can be referred to as the "pig" and guys can bitch about humping the damn thing.
MVP
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MVP is offline
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06-14-2011, 10:29
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#4
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Toronto
Posts: 150
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So best case scenario for rate of fire is 100-150 round drums?
I wonder if HK has a belt fed 416 upper in the works at all.
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Dohhunter is offline
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06-14-2011, 10:55
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#5
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Guest
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Who misses the (pig), M60, and should it come back?
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06-14-2011, 11:08
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#6
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: State of Confusion
Posts: 5,866
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to make sure I am reading this correctly...
giving up a belt fed 5.56 in the auto-rifle role (which accepts magazines)
adoptng a magazine fed 5.56 in the auto rifle mode
makes sense to me
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Box is offline
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06-14-2011, 12:02
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#7
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Occupied Pineland
Posts: 4,701
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Must have appeared to cost less than refurbishing the shot-out 249s. Wait until they have to buy a basic load of hi-cap magazines for them. And what will be the basic load? I'm speculating three magazines will cost about the same as one weapon (ideal gov't prices - no guesses for inevitable price gouging!). What happens when standard issue of (ultimately disposable) magazines is 7-8 each? I still prefer belt-fed. And NO! - I do not want to see a return of the M-60.
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A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear.
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Peregrino is offline
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06-14-2011, 12:08
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#8
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RIP Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: The Ozarks
Posts: 10,072
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When the M60 started barking, everybody got a good feeling and got uprange. I don't see why they did away with it in the first place.
It was a bear to hump at first, but I got used to it.
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Dusty is offline
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06-14-2011, 12:43
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#9
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: May 2009
Location: AZ
Posts: 618
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Spanish Ameli
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MVP is offline
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06-14-2011, 13:33
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#10
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Asset
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: New England
Posts: 30
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I heard about this in episode of Future Weapons, I guess it's good for mixing an M16 and a SAW and there roles in battle (since many think that the future of war is urban combat) but what if you need some serious firepower?
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Peteyboy is offline
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06-14-2011, 13:36
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#11
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Asset
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: New England
Posts: 30
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Personally I think they should just modernize the M60
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Peteyboy is offline
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06-14-2011, 13:43
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#12
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Occupied Pineland
Posts: 4,701
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peteyboy
Personally I think they should just modernize the M60 
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Please elaborate on your PERSONAL experience with M60s.
Dusty - You're suffering misplaced nostalgia!  I'll stick with a 240; the MRBF is MUCH higher.
__________________
A nation can survive its fools, and even the ambitious. But it cannot survive treason from within. An enemy at the gates is less formidable, for he is known and carries his banner openly. But the traitor moves amongst those within the gate freely, his sly whispers rustling through all the alleys, heard in the very halls of government itself. For the traitor appears not a traitor; he speaks in accents familiar to his victims, and he wears their face and their arguments, he appeals to the baseness that lies deep in the hearts of all men. He rots the soul of a nation, he works secretly and unknown in the night to undermine the pillars of the city, he infects the body politic so that it can no longer resist. A murderer is less to fear.
~ Marcus Tullius Cicero (42B.C)
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Peregrino is offline
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06-14-2011, 13:53
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#13
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Asset
Join Date: May 2011
Location: S. Florida
Posts: 40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peteyboy
Personally I think they should just modernize the M60 
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And when was the last time you humped that pig?
From what I've seen, Unqualified remarks aren't taken very seriously here.
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Last edited by Shadow1911; 06-14-2011 at 13:55.
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Shadow1911 is offline
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06-14-2011, 14:10
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#14
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RIP Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: The Ozarks
Posts: 10,072
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadow1911
And when was the last time you humped that pig?
From what I've seen, Unqualified remarks aren't taken very seriously here.
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lol Sometimes qualified ones aren't, either.
The Dustmeister won the Individual Championship Trophy for the M60 from the MTU at Ft. Campbell, KY in '78 or '79.
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Last edited by Dusty; 06-14-2011 at 14:12.
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Dusty is offline
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06-14-2011, 14:11
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#15
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Quiet Professional (RIP)
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Carriere,Ms.
Posts: 6,922
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peteyboy
Personally I think they should just modernize the M60 
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You're a young man with absolutely NO PERSONAL EXPERIENCE in carrying a M60,commenting about a weapon you've never used in your life........ 
Big Teddy
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