EDITORIAL: Obama's Islamic America What country is he talking about?

[Paslode]

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EDITORIAL: Obama's Islamic America
What country is he talking about?

By THE WASHINGTON TIMES


The Washington Times

7:14 p.m., Thursday, August 12, 2010

President Obama says Islam has always been part of America, which raises the question, does the president know something about American history that we don't?

It has become customary for presidents to offer greetings to various religious communities on the occasion of their most holy days. Presidents Ford and Carter both issued Ramadan messages, as did Presidents Clinton and George W. Bush. The Ramadan greeting became intensely political during Mr. Bush's tenure because he was seeking to dispel the charge that the war on terrorism was a crusade against Islam. But Mr. Obama has used the occasion of Ramadan to rewrite U.S. history and give Islam a prominence in American annals that it has not earned.

In this year's greeting, Mr. Obama said the rituals of Ramadan "remind us of the principles that we hold in common and Islam's role in advancing justice, progress, tolerance and the dignity of all human beings. Ramadan is a celebration of a faith known for great diversity and racial equality. And here in the United States, Ramadan is a reminder that Islam has always been part of America and that American Muslims have made extraordinary contributions to our country."

That Islam has had a major role in advancing justice, progress, tolerance and the dignity of all human beings may come as a surprise to Muslim women. Young Afghan girls who are having acid thrown in their faces on the way to school might want to offer their perspectives. That Islam is "known" for diversity and racial equality is also a bit of a reach. This certainly does not refer to religious diversity, which is nonexistent in many Muslim-majority states. This is a plaudit better reserved for a speech at the opening of a synagogue in Mecca.

Most puzzling is the president's claim that "Islam has always been part of America." Islam had no influence on the origins and development of the United States. It contributed nothing to early American political culture, art, literature, music or any other aspect of the early nation.

Throughout most of American history, the Muslim world was perceived as remote, alien and belligerent. Perhaps the president was thinking about the Barbary Pirates and their role in the founding of the U.S. Navy, or Andrew Jackson's dispatch of frigates against Muslim pirates in Sumatra in the 1830s. Maybe he was recalling Rutherford B. Hayes' 1880 statement regarding Morocco on "the necessity, in accordance with the humane and enlightened spirit of the age, of putting an end to the persecutions, which have been so prevalent in that country, of persons of a faith other than the Moslem, and especially of the Hebrew residents of Morocco." Or Grover Cleveland's 1896 comment on the continuing massacre of Armenian Christians: "We have been afflicted by continued and not infrequent reports of the wanton destruction of homes and the bloody butchery of men, women and children, made martyrs to their profession of Christian faith. ... It so mars the humane and enlightened civilization that belongs to the close of the nineteenth century that it seems hardly possible that the earnest demand of good people throughout the Christian world for its corrective treatment will remain unanswered."

It also is customary in the United States to search for obscure contributions made by in-vogue minority groups as a feel-good way of promoting inclusion. One of the earliest Muslims to come to the United States was a 17th-century Egyptian named Norsereddin, who settled in the Catskills and was described by one chronicler as "haughty, morose, unprincipled, cruel and dissipated." Spurned by the princess of an Indian tribe that had befriended him, he managed through a subterfuge to poison her. He was later run down by the betrayed Indians, who burned him alive. It is not the kind of tale that makes it into politically correct history books.

© Copyright 2010 The Washington Times, LLC. Click here for reprint permission.

[Utah Bob]

The more he talks, the more detached from reality he sounds.
His version of America seems to have more in common with Sesame Street than Main Street.

[rdret1]

Kind of odd reading this and watching "1984". Some of the things coming out this administration remind me of one of the lines. "The Law of Gravity is nonsense. No such law exists. If I think I float, and you think I float, then it happens."

[Richard]

Remarks by the President at Iftar Dinner

http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-...t-iftar-dinner

Being president is like being a jackass in a hailstorm. There’s nothing to do but to stand there and take it.
– Lyndon B. Johnson

1619-1800s - An estimated 10 million Africans are brought to North America as slaves. Approximately 30 percent are Muslim.

http://photos.america.gov/galleries/...lims_timeline/

The past actually happened but history is only what someone wrote down.
– A. Whitney Brown

And so it goes...

Richard

[Paslode]

Originally Posted by Richard

Being president is like being a jackass in a hailstorm. There’s nothing to do but to stand there and take it.
– Lyndon B. Johnson

Very true! Of course when you promise the moon during your campaign and fall flat you should expect no less.

Originally Posted by rdret1

Kind of odd reading this and watching "1984". Some of the things coming out this administration remind me of one of the lines. "The Law of Gravity is nonsense. No such law exists. If I think I float, and you think I float, then it happens."

I 'just' caught the tail end of 1984 on HBO and see your point. However I see it more than the administration. I see it in the parties, media, education, special interest groups, government bureaucracies (to name a few) spreading their agendas. They are all floating turds and blue skies to suit their individual wants and needs.

Like my favorite whipping boy Mark Potok and the SPLC putting the 'Float' on Bill Ayers and many other people and groups.

http://21stcenturywire.com/2010/08/1...itutionalists/

[Peregrino]

Originally Posted by Richard

1619-1800s - An estimated 10 million Africans are brought to North America as slaves. Approximately 30 percent are Muslim.

And so it goes...

Richard

It would be interesting to know the percentage of Africans sold to the European traders by Muslims. In fact, IIRC, the only nations still overt engaged in the slave trade/slavery are all in East Africa - and majority Muslim.

[Richard]

In fact, IIRC, the only nations still overt engaged in the slave trade/slavery are all in East Africa - and majority Muslim.

For those who may be interested.

Trafficking in Persons Report 2010

http://www.state.gov/g/tip/rls/tiprpt/2010/index.htm

http://www.state.gov/g/tip/

And so it goes...

Richard

[rdret1]

http://www.islam101.com/history/muslim_us_hist.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Islam_in_the_United_States

http://www.muslimsinamerica.org/inde...d=14&Itemid=28

Richard's earlier post piqued my curiosity. I have spent the last few hours doing a little searching and there is really not that much out there that supports a rich history of contribution to american society. There is the occassional individual who did something mentionable. Even the sites listed above, which were only a few of what I checked, have many discrepancies among them.

Some of the Islamic specific sites list dates back to the 12th century, stating Islamic explorers came to the Americas then. They mainly say it was Central and South America but include North America among their explorations. We all know there were muslims on the ships with Spanish explorers, but were their contributions truly significant?

Many of the sites claiming 12th and 13th century, and some earlier, explorations, seem to rely on works by Dr. Barry Fell, an oceanographer and, depending on which site you check, amateur epigrapher. There are many sites which denounce Dr. Fell's work and few which try to support it. What was interesting was, all of the Islamic sites which claim Muslim exploration of the new world before the vikings cite his studies.

There were several sites which claim the percentage of muslims among slaves brought to America as anywhere between 10 - 30%. They make no mention of the percentage of muslims who were the "sellers".

For the most part, contributions listed on these sites are more toward the establishment of Islam in America and the building of Islamic mosques and communities, rather than general contributions of science, art, exploration, law and so forth. If someone can find references to specific contributions which had nothing to do with the spread of Islam in America, I would like to see them.

[Richard]

If someone can find references to specific contributions which had nothing to do with the spread of Islam in America, I would like to see them.

I would think you would have to do some deep research to answer that one using 'credible' sources - but consider the certainity of the economic and historical 'contributions' to America made by the Muslims who were nearly one-third of its slave labor force.

Cotton is terribly important, not only to the South, but to the nation. In fact, by 1815, cotton is the most valuable export of the United States. By 1840, cotton is more valuable than everything else the United States exports put together, so the value of slaves is tremendous. By the time of the Civil War, by 1860, the dollar value of slave property is greater than the dollar value of all of America’s railroads, all of America’s banks, all of America’s manufacturing put together. Slavery is no sideshow in American society. It is very much the main event, and the cotton crop that slaves produced makes America important to the world.

Do you realize that the American South by 1860 produces seven eighths of the world’s cotton. Now, that’s equivalent of OPEC today and oil. The fact is that when the Confederacy considers going independent, seceding from the United States, one of the things that encourages those people in the South to believe that a separate independent Confederacy is possible, is the fact that it controls so much of the world’s cotton, and cotton is important, not only to the cotton textile industries of New England, but also to the textile industries of England, of France, of Germany, so that cotton has very important economic and consequently, political power.

- James Oliver Horton, Ph.D., Historian, Georgetown University

http://www.wqln.org/main/Television/...omicImpact.htm

And so it goes...

Richard's $.02

[rdret1]

There is no doubt that muslims have always been a part of America. The founding fathers discussed them at length when trying to establish the freedom of religion as they saw it. Even then, there was considerable controversy over the merits of various religions. Several of our founding fathers studied the religion and commented on its practices and the ability of muslims to be productive, loyal citizens.

http://www.loc.gov/loc/lcib/0205/tolerance.html

http://www.altmuslim.com/a/a/a/the_f...ers_and_islam/

http://www.nationalreview.com/corner.../andy-mccarthy

http://marychristinalove.wordpress.c...by-famous-men/

[Richard]

A word about sources.

FWIW - I went to the American Annual Register 1827-1829, a sort of modern day year in review of affairs, cited in Mary Love's blog ( http://marychristinalove.wordpress.c...by-famous-men/ ) and searched for the claimed President Adams' quote regarding Islam...and couldn't find it.

http://www.archive.org/stream/p1amer...ge/n5/mode/2up

However, Chapter X of the Annual (in reference to the war between Russia and Turkey and having nothing to do with any statements made by any President) offers - among other things - a Christian view of "Christianity contrasted with Islamism" and the entire generic passage Ms Love erroneously claims to have been made by President Adams is to be found on page 269 of the book.

Chapter X pp. 267-286 covers the following: Russia. Christianity contrasted with Islamism. Britsh Empire in India. Holy Alliance. Russian and Ottoman Empires. Peter the Great. Catheriene. Alexander. Peace of Paris. Sultan Mahmoud. Alexander Ypsilanti. Insurrection of Greece. Death of Alexander. Accession of the emperor Nicholas. Insurrection in the army. Persian Invasions. Campaign 1827-1828. Conclusion of peace. Treaty of Turkmantchai.

And so it goes...

Richard

[craigepo]

page 269

[T-Rock]

I have spent the last few hours doing a little searching and there is really not that much out there that supports a rich history of contribution to American society.

I often imagine, as a gnat on the wall - looking down on the Congressional floor and hearing Jefferson's voice echoing off the walls of those hallowed chambers - him saying this: "Gentlemen of the Congress: It is my pleasing duty to announce to you that what these "arselifters" are doing.... is nothing new.

I disagree with my good friend Mr. Adams, I will NOT pay the Jizya. We are falling into their trap, a trap of appeasement and extortion. I have spoken to Sidi Haji Abdul Rahman Adja - and he told me that according to their "Holy Book, based on their prophet, "it was "the right and duty of every Muslim, to plunder and enslave; and that every Muslim who was slain in this warfare was sure to go to paradise" - even though our new found country, based on liberty, and our religious freedom, have done these "arselifters" no wrong - this is the reason for the purchase of my Qur'an.

Gentlemen of the Congress, we will not submit to their demands - Therefore Gentlemen, I will spend millions for the common defense of this fine union, and its welfare, and I will not spend "one cent" for the tribute, the Jizya, which is required of them by their prophet and by their "holy book" - If there is one thing Mr. Adams and I agree upon, it is this, allow me to quote you Mr. Adams: "…he [Muhammad] declared undistinguishing and exterminating war, as a part of his religion, against all the rest of mankind…The precept of the Koran is, perpetual war against all who deny, that Mahomet is the prophet of God.”

Gentlemen of Congress, make your decisions......

> http://www.usvetdsp.com/jan07/jeff_quran.htm
> http://www.andrewbostom.org/loj//content/view/18/27/

ETA: Richard Sir, the quotations of Adams are footnoted in Dr. Andrew Bostom's article in the link above.

[Paslode]

Originally Posted by T-Rock

[/I]Gentlemen of Congress, make your decisions......

In today's Congress that decision might likely be based on campaign donations.

[T-Rock]

In today's Congress that decision might likely be based on campaign donations.

Sad isn't it, so much for the "Common Defense" and general welfare...