MacDill AFB - FBI agent shoots vet

JAGO · 05-20-2010, 04:40

Army veteran fatally shot at MacDill AFB in Tampa
By TAMARA LUSH

The Associated Press
11:32 p.m. Wednesday, May 19, 2010

TAMPA, Fla. — An Army veteran who sped away from MacDill Air Force Base security on a motorcycle was fatally shot Wednesday by an FBI agent after the man threatened him with a knife, officials said.

At about 6 p.m., base security was called to an altercation, which wasn't described, at a camping area inside the base, said Col. Larry Martin, the base commander.

The veteran who was described as a guest at the camping area was arguing with another person, but officials wouldn't name either.

"We don't have a lot of details about what went on in that altercation," Martin said.

The veteran sped away on his motorcycle and security tried to stop him, Martin said.

He evaded authorities and drove to the Dale Mabry Gate, one of the main entrances and exits to the base. Law enforcement tried to stop him and the man got off his motorcycle. He came "directly at" the agent with a knife, said FBI special agent Dave Couvertier. The agent shot more than once, killing the veteran, Couvertier said.
"This individual who was shot, approached law enforcement officers, specifically looking at agent and threatening him with a knife," Coubertier said.

Officials said the agent is a liaison officer to the base and was assisting MacDill officers.

No one else was injured. The Air Force did not release the dead man's name, nor did they release the name of the FBI agent.

"Our security forces personnel acted promptly to safeguard the base and its personnel," Martin said.

The base was not under lockdown but the Dale Mabry Gate remained closed. The RV camping area is only used by people with base access.

MacDill, located south of downtown Tampa, is home to U.S. Central Command, which oversees military operations in the Middle East and Central Asia.

___

Copyright 2010, The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

Find this article at:
http://www.ajc.com/news/nation-world...ot-531234.html

The events cited are tragic. The FBI agent is liaison to MacDill.... He's out with the Security Forces (SF) at the gate. It might be a coincidence? Welll, it might?

v/r
phil

**The Reaper** · 05-20-2010, 04:51

That Fam Camp is a wild place.

TR

JAGO · 05-20-2010, 06:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Reaper

That Fam Camp is a wild place.

TR

TR,
I've 'heard' North on Dale Mabry just beyond I-4, is too ...

v/r
phil

FILO · 05-20-2010, 06:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by JAGO

TR,
I've 'heard' North on Dale Mabry just beyond I-4, is too ...

v/r
phil

Actually not I-4 but I-275. Yes that's right, Tampa is known as the strip capital of America. When the Super Bowl hit town last year the local newspaper did a piece on all of the strippers coming in from out of town and they found plenty of places to ply their trade.

**The Reaper** · 05-20-2010, 06:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by JAGO

TR,
I've 'heard' North on Dale Mabry just beyond I-4, is too ...

v/r
phil

I have no knowledge of the Mons, 2001, or any of the other off-limits establishments reputed to be in that area.

Joe Rezner is a fiction of your imagination.

TR

akv · 05-20-2010, 11:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by TR

I have no knowledge of the Mons, 2001, or any of the other off-limits establishments reputed to be in that area. Joe Rezner is a fiction of your imagination.

Years ago when I lived in NY, the Friday before a long weekend I ended up on the 5:30pm US Air Flight to Vegas. Something was different, even my feeble SA picked up on the fact, 30% of the flight was composed of young good looking enhanced women in sweats. I mentioned this observation to friends over dinner who said, " Oh you must have caught the "ballet flight", happens every weekend. I caught a lot of guff for innocently responding "I never heard of a Las Vegas ballet..."

Utah Bob · 05-20-2010, 14:02

Never bring a knife to a gunfight.

doctom54 · 05-20-2010, 20:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Utah Bob

Never bring a knife to a gunfight.

My thought exactly

AngelsSix · 05-20-2010, 20:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Utah Bob

Never bring a knife to a gunfight.

Amen!!

Leozinho · 05-20-2010, 20:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by JAGO

The events cited are tragic. The FBI agent is liaison to MacDill.... He's out with the Security Forces (SF) at the gate. It might be a coincidence? Welll, it might?

v/r
phil

What you are implying? Why would it be a coincidence that a law enforcement officer would respond to a call?

Richard · 05-20-2010, 20:39

Quote:

Never bring a knife to a gunfight.

Unless it's an M-1917 bayonet on the end of a Winchester M-1200 like we used to carry for riot control.

Richard's $.02

**Ambush Master** · 05-20-2010, 21:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by Richard

Unless it's an M-1917 bayonet on the end of a Winchester M-1200 like we used to carry for riot control.

Richard's $.02

Unless the "Ventriloquist Watchdog" has a Muzzle on it!!!

JAGO · 05-21-2010, 06:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leozinho

What you are implying? Why would it be a coincidence that a law enforcement officer would respond to a call?

Leozinho,

Nothing to imply - it is unusual for a Bureau agent to respond to a call on a military installation. Perhaps your experience is different/greater than mine?To me the facts (or lack thereof) is quite noteworthy. As you know, the MOU between DoJ and DoD is such that the military is responsible for all law enforcement activities on DoD installations. After the military sorts it all out - a determination is made that persons detained who are not subject to the UCMJ is then released to civilian Law Enf authorities. Even with the MOU, the Bureau still has jurisdiction for federal crimes on the installation, and rarely the Bureau can, and does come on installations with unique matters in which they inform the Law Enf desk (or a MCIO) that the Bureau has a warrant - and they serve it after such coordination.

Furthermore, as a taxpayer I can question the benefit of an FBI agent assigned to a uniformed security force, given the difference in mission. The liaison program is much different and usually involves something much more complicated.

I've been removed from it all for several years, but the issues of military LNOs to the Bureau as well as Bureau LNOs to certain military commands was/is clearly defined. I suspect the LNO position is to one of the unified/specified 4 star commands at MacDill? Again, things may have changed and FBI agents are assigned to MP desks on Army bases?

As I posited, the Agent could have been at the gate (perhaps) waiting for an official visitor, he could have been talking to a Security Force friend, or he could have been their with a "real world" scenario.

But given his role as an LNO it is highly unusual that he is responding to incidents or taking direct action on a military installation.

Drunk Vets on a motorcycle leaving a mliltary camp ground are the sort of things that (at least from 1970 - 1997) the Bureau agents I worked with were trained to avoid.

This is unusual. I suspect there is a story here beyond what the PAO is putting out. Either this Vet was a "person of interest" or they were expecting a higher forece protection level that evening - or perhaps, this Vet and the agent had met before?

v/r
phil

Defender968 · 05-21-2010, 06:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by JAGO

Leozinho,

Nothing to imply - it is unusual for a Bureau agent to respond to a call on a military installation. Perhaps your experience is different/greater than mine?To me the facts (or lack thereof) is quite noteworthy. As you know, the MOU between DoJ and DoD is such that the military is responsible for all law enforcement activities on DoD installations. After the military sorts it all out - a determination is made that persons detained who are not subject to the UCMJ is then released to civilian Law Enf authorities. Even with the MOU, the Bureau still has jurisdiction for federal crimes on the installation, and rarely the Bureau can, and does come on installations with unique matters in which they inform the Law Enf desk (or a MCIO) that the Bureau has a warrant - and they serve it after such coordination.

Furthermore, as a taxpayer I can question the benefit of an FBI agent assigned to a uniformed security force, given the difference in mission. The liaison program is much different and usually involves something much more complicated.

I've been removed from it all for several years, but the issues of military LNOs to the Bureau as well as Bureau LNOs to certain military commands was/is clearly defined. I suspect the LNO position is to one of the unified/specified 4 star commands at MacDill? Again, things may have changed and FBI agents are assigned to MP desks on Army bases?

As I posited, the Agent could have been at the gate (perhaps) waiting for an official visitor, he could have been talking to a Security Force friend, or he could have been their with a "real world" scenario.

But given his role as an LNO it is highly unusual that he is responding to incidents or taking direct action on a military installation.

Drunk Vets on a motorcycle leaving a mliltary camp ground are the sort of things that (at least from 1970 - 1997) the Bureau agents I worked with were trained to avoid.

This is unusual. I suspect there is a story here beyond what the PAO is putting out. Either this Vet was a "person of interest" or they were expecting a higher forece protection level that evening - or perhaps, this Vet and the agent had met before?

v/r
phil

I would tend to concur with you JAGO that it is very unusual to have an FBI agent at the gate. My guess would be that this was a case where the agent was at the right place at the wrong time, had his badge on his belt along with his gun (as most agents do) and became involved either at his own decision or that of the Vet...time will tell but I'm sure there are many details about this that we're not privy too yet.

Also any federal crimes that occur on an AF Base are generally handled by OSI,.... on most normal bases at least in my experience. Now with that being said the things that are located at McDill make it a different beast altogether than a normal run of the mill AF base. At the run of the mill bases I've never seen an FBI agent on based at, all let alone actually attached to Security Forces.

JAGO · 05-21-2010, 07:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Defender968

At the run of the mill bases I've never seen an FBI agent on based at, all let alone actually attached to Security Forces.

1974-1976 in Bldg 2203, Ft Hood TX. Ft Hood Field Office US Army CID and the Killeen resident agency of the FBI shared that building. We had over 30 CID agents and they had 3 FBI agents (Ed J***s, Pat Cr****y, and Tom B***n) along withtheir clerical support staff and a radio technitian assigned to the Resident Agency (subordinate to the San Antonio office).

Ft Hood at that time was an "open post". Ranchers leased portions of the post from the Army. Ranges were litterally mined for brass. Hookers/Pimps would end up dead on the post. Many, many cases were handed over to the Bureau after the initial CID work up lead to civilian suspected. The Bureau readily accepted the cases after consulting with the US Attorney's Office in Waco, generally after about 0900 hrs.

The Killeen RA covered an area of responsiblity greater than the all of Ft Hood and they agents were away from their office, a fair portion of the time.

And years later - it was not at all unusual to have (a) members of the FBI's HRT at Bragg.. I'm just sayin....

v/r
phil