12-18-2009, 09:50
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#1
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Asset
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Langley AFB
Posts: 41
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bullpup M-14/M1A concept
I was using my inferior google-fu skills and stumbled upon this.
http://www.shortrifles.com/index.html
Hit the search button and came up with nothing here.
I humbly request the opinions of the QP’s, M-14/M1A owners, and fellow gun enthusiasts on the matter of a bullpup design. I happen to like the ‘classic’ look of my squad scout in the black fiberglass stock. All I added was a scope mount with a 30mm Barska 2.5-10/56 and a replacement forgrip sling mount with picatiny rail fitted with a Nstar bipod. (hey, I do what I can with the budget I’m given) Buy the way Longrange, the website says they make a ‘sniper package’.
So, good idea or waste of time/ money?
I egress.
__________________
Sgt. V
“In England, if you commit a crime, the police don't have a gun and you don't have a gun. If you commit a crime, the police will say "Stop, or I'll say stop again."” - Robin Williams
“As long as there are guns, the individual that wants a gun for a crime is going to have one and going to get it.” - Ronald Reagan
"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin
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DbeforeD is offline
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12-18-2009, 09:54
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#2
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Area Commander
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Buckingham, Pa.
Posts: 1,746
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Looks like that rig would be loads of fun to shoot off your weakside if you're a rightie or for a leftie in general. I don't see what issue this stock supposedly cures but I suppose that someone is always out there trying to create the self licking stamp.
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rubberneck is offline
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12-18-2009, 10:00
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#3
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Area Commander
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: JBLM
Posts: 1,246
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Good concept, looks wild.
I wonder how it shoots. the M14/M1A series are good, accurate guns. Wouldn't want to degrade it from there for the cool factor.
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jbour13 is offline
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12-18-2009, 10:11
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#4
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Area Commander
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Indianapolis
Posts: 2,086
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Very interesting and seems like a work around if you already have an M14.
I was able to shoot the Kel-Tec RFB last month and really like the execution of .308 bullpup. I shoot southpaw so an ambidextrous set-up is necessary for me. The Kel-Tec ejects the the spent case through a forward tube like the FN FS2000.
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Daniel
GM1 USNR (RET)
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Streck-Fu is offline
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12-18-2009, 10:29
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#5
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Occupied Pineland
Posts: 4,701
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Another solution looking for a problem.
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Peregrino is offline
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12-18-2009, 11:08
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#6
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,811
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Exactly.
Don't you have enough Chinese junk hung on it already?
TR
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The Reaper is offline
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12-18-2009, 11:15
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#7
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Fayetteville NC
Posts: 3,533
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Trigger will suck, locktime will increase, accuracy will suffer as will your right ear.
Bull pups have a multitude of problems but the trigger problem is the greatest due to the length and flex in the trigger bar to reach the sear.
Cute and as Peregrino says a solution in search of a problem.
__________________
Hold Hard guys
Rick B.
Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit.
Wisdom is knowing it is great on a hamburger but not so great sticking one up your ass.
Author - Richard. 
Experience is what you get right after you need it.
Author unknown. 
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longrange1947 is offline
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12-18-2009, 12:44
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#8
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Asset
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Langley AFB
Posts: 41
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Thank you
Sirs,
Thank you for the input. I don’t have a need for any bullpup type rifle. The Kel-tec is out of the question because the house commander won’t give me the green light for buying a new weapon. At least not until she gets her nail kit or whatever. I can however modify the systems I already have. When I found this site, I was researching what I need for suppressing my M1A. I do need a cheek pad for the stock, other than that I am happy with it. As soon as I find a better bipod, I will replace the ‘Chinese crap’ hanging off of it. For now it’s all about fit, form, and function. I was just curious of what you gentlemen thought about the website. Personally, I think the quest of making older firearm models into a ‘tacticool’ toy is getting out of hand. A few weeks ago I found a tricked out Stoeger couch gun.
Link: http://www.stoegerindustries.com/fir...le_defense.php
As for my M1A, I am leaving it as is, with possible exception to replacing the cheap bipod.
I egress.
__________________
Sgt. V
“In England, if you commit a crime, the police don't have a gun and you don't have a gun. If you commit a crime, the police will say "Stop, or I'll say stop again."” - Robin Williams
“As long as there are guns, the individual that wants a gun for a crime is going to have one and going to get it.” - Ronald Reagan
"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin
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DbeforeD is offline
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12-18-2009, 14:21
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#9
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Nashville
Posts: 956
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To Damn Bad...
Is it Chinese?
I like it. and as to the trigger returns concerns and such...it's not going to be used as a sniper weapon. i think I'm really going to look at this on more.
__________________
The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.
Thomas Jefferson
To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.
Thomas Jefferson
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Blitzzz (RIP) is offline
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12-18-2009, 22:05
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#10
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Area Commander
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Lone Star
Posts: 2,153
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Quote:
Originally Posted by longrange1947
Trigger will suck, locktime will increase, accuracy will suffer as will your right ear.
Bull pups have a multitude of problems but the trigger problem is the greatest due to the length and flex in the trigger bar to reach the sear.
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hmmm, the review mentioned "feels like your original two stage trigger" and "to be accurate (out to a couple hundred yards)" and "eases handling and shooting offhand." I'd like to know what their standard of accuracy. It'd be great if they would convert a match M1A, M118LR and then compare the 100 yards group side-by-side from before and after. The barrel length is unchanged, but can a bull-up design afford a free-floated barrel? If they can deliver all these (2-stage, sub-MOA,etc.), then I'm sold.
Master Rick, by how many db do you think is the difference for the right ear?
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frostfire is offline
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12-18-2009, 22:12
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#11
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Fayetteville NC
Posts: 3,533
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I don't know how many Db the change would be but all the bull-pups I have fired have sounded louder as the chamber is closer to the ear. As far as a two stage trigger, the trigger bar will have to be magic as the biggest problem with bull pups is the long reach from trigger to sear. usually gets junk in them and flexes as it gets more and more grime in the mechanism.
Know it is not a sniper rifle but even the battle rifles that I have played with have suffered some as a bull pup ergonomically. As far as accurate out to a couple of hundred yards, daaaammmmmm, most guys can do that with an M4 offhand.
Oh well, I look at it as another toy to play with. 
__________________
Hold Hard guys
Rick B.
Knowledge is knowing a tomato is a fruit.
Wisdom is knowing it is great on a hamburger but not so great sticking one up your ass.
Author - Richard.
Experience is what you get right after you need it.
Author unknown.
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longrange1947 is offline
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12-18-2009, 22:33
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#12
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Nashville
Posts: 956
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__________________
The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government.
Thomas Jefferson
To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.
Thomas Jefferson
Last edited by Blitzzz (RIP); 12-19-2009 at 07:17.
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Blitzzz (RIP) is offline
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12-19-2009, 15:08
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#13
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Asset
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: 1700ft. above sea level in Germany
Posts: 11
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Looks to me like it is either adapted to the SA SOCOM16/II Series M1A. Judging by the tritium front sight and the well thought compensator along with the top rail that replaces the old fiberglass heat shield commonly found on that style of rifle. I am a big fan of my SOCOM II in its mostly stock form. I don't think it would operate as well in bullpup configuration due to the long trigger mechanism, etc... If they have over come those problems it would make a great platform for target interdiction out to 400 meters or so due to the short length of the SOCOM series barrel (16.25in). Is it just me or does the whole pistol grip/trigger guard look to over the top and large. None the less it looks like it would be a fun one to shoot.
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Sabre2G is offline
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12-19-2009, 16:01
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#14
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Area Commander
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Buckingham, Pa.
Posts: 1,746
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Last year at the range we had one of our guys have is AR's go kaboom from some bad surplus ammo (iirc it was Radway). He was shaken up and his jaw hurt enough to go and have X-rays taken. I wonder what would have happened to his face if he was shooting a bullpup and his cheek was right above the chamber as opposed to six inches behind it.
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rubberneck is offline
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12-19-2009, 20:28
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#15
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Area Commander
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Indianapolis
Posts: 2,086
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Kel-Tec addresses those issues:
Quote:
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The RFB is also the safest Bullpup ever developed because the breech is separated from the shooters face by two layers of 1.6 mm steel. In the highly unlikely event of a case rupture, gas expansion is directed downwards through the magazine well to protect the shooters head and face.
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Daniel
GM1 USNR (RET)
Si vis pacem, para bellum
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Streck-Fu is offline
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