OMG - Not Another Translation?

[Richard]

The Conservative Bible Project aims to rewrite parts of the Bible to suit conservative needs: This won't be conducive to interfaith dialogue.

Jesus H Christ.

Richard's $.02

Translating the Bible is no joke. But what's in a political 'translation'?
James F. McGrath, CSM, 7 Dec 2009

The Bible, it turns out, is too liberal.

At least the Conservative Bible Project thinks so. The group has set itself the task of "translating" the Bible in a more conservative way, so as to eliminate liberal "misinterpretations" and prevent liberal "misconstruals."

This is not a joke. Consider Conservapedia, the conservative perspective Wikipedia site that features this translation project.

When it first started, it was difficult to tell if it was an authentic conservative phenomenon or a parody along the lines of "The Colbert Report." Attempts to parody an extreme group often simply end up resembling an even more extreme, possibly very fringe, but equally real group.

But it has become clear that what looks like an attempt at satire is a real project proposed by people who don't seem to grasp the irony of their endeavor.

Now, with similar irony, the Conservative Bible Project plans to replace text in the Bible, which is often open to more than one interpretation, with new text that will be in accord with how the members of the project interpret the text; in some cases, what they think it really ought to say even though it doesn't.

Don't get me wrong: "Rewriting" the Bible has a long and illustrious heritage, one that begins within the pages of the Bible itself.

The book of Chronicles retells the stories found in the books of Samuel and Kings. One Gospel retells stories found in another. There have been Midrashes that expand, Targums that paraphrase, and Gospel harmonies that combine multiple stories into one big story.

There is plenty of precedent for taking biblical material and doing creative things with it, and one could even argue that it is "biblical" to do so.

But when people set about to radically rewrite the Bible and call it "translating," or deny that what they really are doing is rewriting the Bible, it's misleading and dishonest. Where in the past we have seen debates over the meaning of the Bible, we may see less healthy and educational communication on it as various groups begin to forgo discussion and adopt a Bible "translated" to suit their needs. Of course, in one sense this has always been done – but not usually to the extent that the Conservative Bible Project proposes.

Perhaps most important is that the "Conservapedia Version" of the Bible isn't what it claims to be in one particularly important respect: It is not a translation. Translation involves rendering a text in one language into another, not rewriting existing translations so as to make them say what you want them to, without any knowledge of the languages in which the underlying texts are written.

A good example is the discussion on the Conservative Bible Project page about whether the manager in Luke 16:8 should be referred to as "shrewdly dishonest."

The discussion on the Web page suggests that he should rather be considered "resourceful," a "better conservative term, which became available only in 1851." No mention is made of what the actual Greek term might mean, much less of whether relevant linguistic parallels or cultural evidence might provide clarification of the Greek term's meaning.

The meaning of words in the underlying languages is simply ignored, and the "translators" make clear that their interest is to make the English text mean what they believe a conservative Bible ought to mean.

The fact that the Greek text in the same verse explicitly calls the manager "unrighteous" or "unjust" is likewise never mentioned. It seems that for a project like this, all one has to do is "translate" that word as meaning something else, and the problem is solved.

Why not go even further and add a parable in which Jesus praises employers who pay their workers as little as possible, or one that extols Caesar Augustus for not providing universal healthcare, while they're at it?

These "translators," if they are serious about what they are proposing to do, are exalting themselves above the Bible and, from the perspective of conservative Christianity, above God.

If nothing else, the project illustrates the fact that "conservative" and "Bible-believing" are not the same thing, despite what you'll often hear.

http://www.csmonitor.com/2009/1207/p09s04-coop.html

[ZonieDiver]

What does the "H." stand for? No seriously, I've always wondered!

[Dozer523]

Originally Posted by ZonieDiver

What does the "H." stand for? No seriously, I've always wondered!

Huh? Stephen Colbert is a parody?
Well according to http://wiki.answers.com/Q/What_does_...Jesus_H_Christ

The answer is that although there is an h there, it's not really an h; nor is it the middle initial of Jesus Christ. This is a story full of twists.
The central character in the story is the Christogram. This is a short acronym, usually three letters long, signalling the name Jesus. Jesus probably spoke Aramaic, and his name was probably Yeshua. We can't be sure, because by the time anything was written down it was done quite a lot later and in Greek.
The Greek for the first three letters of His name were iota-eta-sigma. The Christogram that appeared on the tunics of priests of the Roman church was the Latin transliteration of the Greek one. At the time iota became I or J, eta became H and sigma became C or S. The actual letters in the Christogram could be IHC, IHS, JHC or JHS according to when and where.
This may seem strange to us, but remember that we are moving from language to language, and two of the letters here are still fluid even today. "Ja" in German or Nordic languages sounds like "Yah" to us; "sent" and "cent" sound identical. Eta becoming H has no real justification except that Greek eta and the Latin H have similar shapes.
So far so good; we can easily see that JHC is just a representation of the Greek letters which say "Yesh" (or maybe"Yes"), that Yesh is a diminutive of Yeshua, and that was Jesus's first name. Why then do members of Christian congregations say things like "Jesus H. Christ", not necessarily intending any disrespect and fully believing that this is what JHC is short for ?
We must remember that for a thousand years or more of the Christian church, the majority of the congregation knew nothing of Greek, understood only a little of the Latin they heard at Mass, and were totally illiterate. They saw the Christogram on the priests robe. They had been told "this is Jesus's name" and to those who could read a little it was obvious what J and C were, so of course the H was His middle initial.

. Well. If His name really is Yeshua, there are going to be a lot of really pissed off baseball players!

SERIOUSLY, THOUGH. For insightful answers to important questions http://www.everystudent.com/features...FQoeDQod7TthsQ

[Richard]

What does the "H." stand for? No seriously, I've always wondered!

Hxxxx - my family name - 13th cousin twice removed - the black sheep of the family.

Richard

[GratefulCitizen]

This is disturbing.
Seems like they're missing the point.

The Almighty doesn't belong to conservatives.
According to the Scriptures they're re-translating, they belong to Him.

So what if liberals misquote the Bible?
At least they're talking about the Bible.

Can say with 100% surety that I am not 100% correct in my understanding...nor will be in this lifetime.
Will trust that the grace of the Almighty is sufficient to cover for any lack of understanding on the part of myself or others.

Not sure what they're trying to accomplish.

[Richard]

Not sure what they're trying to accomplish.

Ye olde story - the power of language to control and to yield - what else - power and wealth.

And so it goes...still...

Richard's jaded $.02

[nmap]

Why not go even further and add a parable in which Jesus praises employers who pay their workers as little as possible, or one that extols Caesar Augustus for not providing universal healthcare, while they're at it?

Actually, I was thinking of a commandment or two...

Thou shalt not restrict gun ownership; nay, neither semi-automatic, nor full auto, and with no limitations of barrel length or caliber.

Thou shalt not create collateralized debt obligations, nor notional securities, nor credit default swaps, nor permit those who create such abominations to remain among thee. Thou shalt cast them out!

[Paslode]

Originally Posted by nmap

Actually, I was thinking of a commandment or two...

Thou shalt not restrict gun ownership; nay, neither semi-automatic, nor full auto, and with no limitations of barrel length or caliber.

Thou shalt not create collateralized debt obligations, nor notional securities, nor credit default swaps, nor permit those who create such abominations to remain among thee. Thou shalt cast them out!

You forgot other dangerous devices...Thermite Grenades...M203's and RPG's

Originally Posted by Richard

Hxxxx - my family name - 13th cousin twice removed - the black sheep of the family.

Richard

Would that be 'in-laws' and 'out-laws' as well?

WD

p.s., I'll some day tell the story of Robert Leroy Parker, a.k.a. "Butch Cassidy" and my grandmother.

[FirstClass]

people should just stop being lazy and learn Greek, Aramaic and Hebrew. You have to seek truth, truth does not seek you.

[Dad]

First, I learn from the History Channel that Moses came down from the mountain with 600 or so commandmants. I had trouble with the ten so I figure I am in deep poop. Now you tell me they are going to change the New Testament. I'll never get out of this hole I have dug for myself. They keep changing the rules!

[greenberetTFS]

Originally Posted by FirstClass

people should just stop being lazy and learn Greek, Aramaic and Hebrew. You have to seek truth, truth does not seek you.

A very long time ago I studied all 3...... Former graduate from Moody Bible in Chicago.. But just what is you point?

Big Teddy

[Pete]

I think there is much debate over the meaning of some of the original Greek words.

Such as "Thou shalt not kill". Is it "kill" or is it "murder"?

Vary how you translate a given word by even a little bit and it canchange the intended meaning.

Remember way back to the 70s when the "Good News for Modern Man" version of the Bible came out?

[Richard]

But just what is you{r} point?

Teddy,

I think he is talking about the value of being able to read the original source documents and interpreting them yourself vs the many translated versions which have been continuously edited and altered for any number of reasons over time.

...וכך זה הולך

Richard's $.02

[plato]

Originally Posted by ZonieDiver

What does the "H." stand for? No seriously, I've always wondered!

Cheesh! That's an easy one. He's named after his REAL Father.

The H stands for Harold.

Listening to my kid Sis when she was around six years old......

"Our Father who art in heaven..... Harold be thy name......."

Kids!