07-28-2009, 17:17
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#1
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 22
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PRE CDQC
Hello everyone. Been mostly a lurker the past few months, just trying to soak up what knowledge i can without looking like too much of an idiot on here haha. Anyways after a bit of searching i really didnt come up with too much about Pre CDQD or PRE-SCUBA, on the this forum. Well recently I had the chance to attend this course, here at Ft Benning.
First and foremost i had the chance to work with an amazing Quiet Professional whos name is SFC H****, who i believe mentioned he did his time with 10th Group. He was a great influence and an awesome teacher.
Back on track. About 2 weeks ago i was unable to pass Pre CDQD  : (Great course!! Highly recommend anyone who gets the chance to GO!) It was a very hard thing for me to accept as failure is mainly never an option for me (im very hard on myself) and it was pretty much one of the hardest and most grueling courses i've ever attended. As i was saying i failed and was unable to complete the 50 meter subsurface swim. Pretty much the reason I am posting is i am seeking ANY advice I can get. I just cant seem to get past 35 meters subsurface no matter how hard I practice. I must go back and succeed! I know there are some members on dive teams out there that have passed Dive School. Any advice or tips would be greatly appreciated. Thanks in advance!!
Tom
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"Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends" John 15:13
There is no other quality so essential to the success of any kind as the quality of perseverance. Even in the face of certain failure, it overcomes almost everything..
Last edited by Eagle5US; 07-28-2009 at 17:27.
Reason: PERSEC
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adidasboy1186 is offline
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07-28-2009, 17:31
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#2
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Tampa
Posts: 2,519
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Swim more...breathe less.
As stupid as it sounds, the only way you are going to get better at being underwater doing work (swimming), is being underwater doing work. The following can improve your capability:
Improve your aerobic capacity (run, bike, swim, swim underwater while holding your breath, etc...)
Most importantly - RELAX. The more relaxed you are, the less oxygen your body will pull from your lungs.
Lastly, hug the bottom of the pool.
Good luck.
Eagle
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Primum non Nocere
"I have hung out in dangerous places a lot over the years, from combat zones to biker bars, and it is the weak, the unaware, or those looking for it, that usually find trouble.
Ain't no one getting out of this world alive. All you can do is try to have some choice in the way you go. Prepare yourself (and your affairs), and when your number is up, die on your feet fighting rather than on your knees. And make the SOBs pay dearly."
The Reaper-3 Sep 04
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Eagle5US is offline
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07-28-2009, 17:41
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#3
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eagle5US
Swim more...breathe less.
As stupid as it sounds, the only way you are going to get better at being underwater doing work (swimming), is being underwater doing work. The following can improve your capability:
Improve your aerobic capacity (run, bike, swim, swim underwater while holding your breath, etc...)
Most importantly - RELAX. The more relaxed you are, the less oxygen your body will pull from your lungs.
Lastly, hug the bottom of the pool.
Good luck.
Eagle
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I have been swimming my legs off lately. Recently i ran about an 11:30 on my 2mi. Shouldn't I be doing better than most? There were soldiers there who barely ran a 14:30 and could knock out the 50m. This is so frustrating.. 
__________________
"Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends" John 15:13
There is no other quality so essential to the success of any kind as the quality of perseverance. Even in the face of certain failure, it overcomes almost everything..
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adidasboy1186 is offline
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07-28-2009, 18:56
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#4
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: 18 yrs upstate NY, 30 yrs South Florida, 20 yrs Conch Republic, now chasing G-Kids in NOVA & UK
Posts: 11,901
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Quote:
Originally Posted by adidasboy1186
Shouldn't I be doing better than most? There were soldiers there who barely ran a 14:30 and could knock out the 50m. This is so frustrating.. |
Can you dance??
swimming under water or for that mater on the surface takes a lot of practice. Anyone can swim,, it's the flow and synchronization of your arms, hands, legs, feet, head & breathing that improves efficiency. Bad timing can burn 3-4 times the energy yet you end up at the back of the lie..
You need to find someone that can audit your swimming style to see if you need improvement in your timing.
A topic you need to read up on is O2 deprivation & apnea training. It's tricky and you need pro help with it. In very simple terms, one holds their breath until they can't. I'll not go farther. There is also the topic of Shallow Water Back-out. Another dangerous topic.
Net Net, Find a local pro and get help with your technique...
One of our locals, Mehgan Heaney-Grier is pretty good at free diving and uses apnea training to condition her mind & body. Watch her stroke at 1:10 and at 1:15 she is apnea training. This girl can dance with the fishes...
www.youtube.com/watch?v=18-NxjKfwN8
Warning: We get at least one(1) floter a month in the Florida Keys. Most are FOG's with scuba, but we have a fair share of freedivers that run into SWBO. The only "good part", because our water is so hot,, they float in two(2) days or less and are easy to recover, if the sharks don't get there first...
Good Luck...
__________________
Go raibh tú leathuair ar Neamh sula mbeadh a fhios ag an diabhal go bhfuil tú marbh
"May you be a half hour in heaven before the devil knows you’re dead"
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JJ_BPK is offline
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07-28-2009, 19:23
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#5
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JJ_BPK
Can you dance??
swimming under water or for that mater on the surface takes a lot of practice. Anyone can swim,, it's the flow and synchronization of your arms, hands, legs, feet, head & breathing that improves efficiency. Bad timing can burn 3-4 times the energy yet you end up at the back of the lie..
You need to find someone that can audit your swimming style to see if you need improvement in your timing.
A topic you need to read up on is O2 deprivation & apnea training. It's tricky and you need pro help with it. In very simple terms, one holds their breath until they can't. I'll not go farther. There is also the topic of Shallow Water Back-out. Another dangerous topic.
Net Net, Find a local pro and get help with your technique...
One of our locals, Mehgan Heaney-Grier is pretty good at free diving and uses apnea training to condition her mind & body. Watch her stroke at 1:10 and at 1:15 she is apnea training. This girl can dance with the fishes...
www.youtube.com/watch?v=18-NxjKfwN8
Warning: We get at least one(1) floter a month in the Florida Keys. Most are FOG's with scuba, but we have a fair share of freedivers that run into SWBO. The only "good part", because our water is so hot,, they float in two(2) days or less and are easy to recover, if the sharks don't get there first...
Good Luck... |
Ill look into this. Much appreciated..
__________________
"Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends" John 15:13
There is no other quality so essential to the success of any kind as the quality of perseverance. Even in the face of certain failure, it overcomes almost everything..
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adidasboy1186 is offline
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07-28-2009, 20:15
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#6
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LA
Posts: 1,653
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Swim faster
__________________
Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
Still want to quit?
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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07-29-2009, 04:03
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#7
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Fayetteville
Posts: 13,080
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Relax
Relax, learn to swim smoother, exhale a touch of air when you feel the need to inhale and do pushups while holding your breath during commercials.
While watching TV at night every time a commercial break comes on take a few deep breaths and then do as many pushups as you can while holding your breath. When you can't do any more - while still holding your breath - move to a sitting position and tie two knots. No cheating yourself.
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Pete is offline
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07-29-2009, 05:38
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#8
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete
Relax, learn to swim smoother, exhale a touch of air when you feel the need to inhale and do pushups while holding your breath during commercials.
While watching TV at night every time a commercial break comes on take a few deep breaths and then do as many pushups as you can while holding your breath. When you can't do any more - while still holding your breath - move to a sitting position and tie two knots. No cheating yourself.
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Ill give that a go. Those knots kicked my ass too haha.
Thanks everyone for all the advice. Much appreciated 
__________________
"Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends" John 15:13
There is no other quality so essential to the success of any kind as the quality of perseverance. Even in the face of certain failure, it overcomes almost everything..
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adidasboy1186 is offline
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07-29-2009, 10:49
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#9
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Area Commander
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Lone Star
Posts: 2,153
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Had a chance to do pool work with a 20th group soldier (initial W.M.) few weeks ago. He was heading to Key West. We were working mainly to smooth out side stroke, but we also did drown proofing, and underwater swim. I showed him the "key hole" stroke, paying special attention to feet kicking as hands are by the ears (timing!). Here are good visuals of the technique:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMwpNHof0hM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxpNqGDY-F0
By the 2nd day, he was pulling 50 yards+ going back and forth right after entering the pool, no warm up, nothing, which made my jaw literary dropped  . Keep in mind he is not a good swimmer, hardly ever swim, and at this point, he's been swimming for only about 2, 30 min sessions. Last year, a PJ trainee did 75 yards plus which was impressive, but he spent 30 min+ warming up and building up the lung capacity. The SF guy told me the last 30 yards was pure will power. Such testament of mind over matter is an ever-present motivation for my journey towards SF.
Eagle is right, hug the bottom. A Marine Recon instructor told me it's got something to do with water density, and how you're almost literary pushing off the bottom (solid surface as opposed to just fluid), which equals greater propulsion.
__________________
"we also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope" Rom. 5:3-4
"So we can suffer, and in suffering we know who we are" David Goggins
"Aide-toi, Dieu t'aidera " Jehanne, la Pucelle
Der, der Geld verliert, verliert einiges;
Der, der einen Freund verliert, verliert viel mehr;
Der, der das Vertrauen verliert, verliert alles.
INDNJC
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frostfire is offline
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07-29-2009, 12:20
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#10
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frostfire
Had a chance to do pool work with a 20th group soldier (initial W.M.) few weeks ago. He was heading to Key West. We were working mainly to smooth out side stroke, but we also did drown proofing, and underwater swim. I showed him the "key hole" stroke, paying special attention to feet kicking as hands are by the ears (timing!). Here are good visuals of the technique:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qMwpNHof0hM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jxpNqGDY-F0
By the 2nd day, he was pulling 50 yards+ going back and forth right after entering the pool, no warm up, nothing, which made my jaw literary dropped . Keep in mind he is not a good swimmer, hardly ever swim, and at this point, he's been swimming for only about 2, 30 min sessions. Last year, a PJ trainee did 75 yards plus which was impressive, but he spent 30 min+ warming up and building up the lung capacity. The SF guy told me the last 30 yards was pure will power. Such testament of mind over matter is an ever-present motivation for my journey towards SF.
Eagle is right, hug the bottom. A Marine Recon instructor told me it's got something to do with water density, and how you're almost literary pushing off the bottom (solid surface as opposed to just fluid), which equals greater propulsion. |
Nice! Those are very helpful videos and some even better tips. One of my problem areas is the frog kick, I just cant seem to get good form down. I will be heading to the pool later today. Hopefully i can get past 35 meters today. Thanks!
__________________
"Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends" John 15:13
There is no other quality so essential to the success of any kind as the quality of perseverance. Even in the face of certain failure, it overcomes almost everything..
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adidasboy1186 is offline
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08-11-2009, 19:31
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#11
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: United States
Posts: 22
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Was able to achieve 40 meters today. Seems to be easier now with all the tips ive received. Thanks everyone.
__________________
"Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends" John 15:13
There is no other quality so essential to the success of any kind as the quality of perseverance. Even in the face of certain failure, it overcomes almost everything..
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adidasboy1186 is offline
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08-12-2009, 07:54
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#12
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Lower Alabama
Posts: 654
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::45 - ::50 is the average 50m time. That is it. The 50m is only about 2 things, being relaxed and putting out. If you "can not" do 50m, it is because you are giving up on yourself. Gut it out. I know it sucks, BTDT. It sucked every single time I have done it but I got micro lungs & don't practice breath holding. I am relaxed, I hug the bottom, I kick less & glide more, and I suck it up. Oh, and BTW, a lot of guys fail Pre-SCUBA.
x/S
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If not us, than who?
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exsquid is offline
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08-12-2009, 07:56
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#13
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,804
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What unit is sending you to pre-SCUBA?
TR
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"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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08-12-2009, 12:54
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#14
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Area Commander
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Lone Star
Posts: 2,153
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Quote:
Originally Posted by exsquid
::45 - ::50 is the average 50m time.
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exsquid,
is that in a 50 meter, 25 meter, or 25 yards pool?
I found that the 50m is much easier in a 50 meter pool with equal depth all the way. Doing 50 meter in a 25 yards pool with increasing depth from 5ft to 12 ft is still a no go for me so far. Sitting relaxed I can hold my breath for 3:63. Perhaps it's a mental block and I need to gut it out some more, even though hugging the bottom = longer distance in a pool with uneven depth.
__________________
"we also rejoice in our sufferings, because we know that suffering produces perseverance; perseverance, character; and character, hope" Rom. 5:3-4
"So we can suffer, and in suffering we know who we are" David Goggins
"Aide-toi, Dieu t'aidera " Jehanne, la Pucelle
Der, der Geld verliert, verliert einiges;
Der, der einen Freund verliert, verliert viel mehr;
Der, der das Vertrauen verliert, verliert alles.
INDNJC
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frostfire is offline
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08-12-2009, 15:00
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#15
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Georgetown, SC
Posts: 4,204
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Quote:
Originally Posted by frostfire
exsquid,
is that in a 50 meter, 25 meter, or 25 yards pool?
I found that the 50m is much easier in a 50 meter pool with equal depth all the way. Doing 50 meter in a 25 yards pool with increasing depth from 5ft to 12 ft is still a no go for me so far. Sitting relaxed I can hold my breath for 3:63. Perhaps it's a mental block and I need to gut it out some more, even though hugging the bottom = longer distance in a pool with uneven depth.
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If you can hold your breath for that time, I'd suggest your problem is mostly in your mind. Train your mind. Take a small weight with you on a swim. Swim as far as you can. Place the weight there. Next time - "do or die" - swim past the weight. Move the weight to the new spot. Repeat as needed.
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"I took a different route from most and came into Special Forces..." - Col. Nick Rowe
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