HAMAS Admits They Are Cowards

SF-TX · 01-02-2009, 13:44

In this video a member of HAMAS, Fatih Hamad, proudly states Palestinian 'men' belonging to the death cult hide behind women and children.

From the same site, the following is a 'rough' translation of the video:

Quote:

For the Palestinian people, death has become an industry

In which excel the women and all the people of this land:

The older people excel, the jihadists excel

And the children excel

Consequently, [the Palestinians] created a human shield of women, children

Older people and jihadists

Against the Zionist bombing machine

That is telling the Zionist enemy

We want death just as much as you desire life.

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/024196.php

Penn · 01-02-2009, 15:54

SF-TX, I disagree with you, they’re not cowards. The statement is: To kill us; you are going to have to kill the entire society, women, childern, old men etc, do you have the stomach for it, can you face the conquences of world opinion. They have chosen to use their society as a weapon, it’s the only thing they have left. Rather Spartan of them...

SF-TX · 01-02-2009, 16:08

I wonder. If after I have continually attacked and threatened death to my neighbor and his family, he then attacks me in self-defense, am I also a Spartan if I throw my family in between myself and the attacker?

Still seems rather cowardly to me.

I agree with you that they are counting on Israel and 'world opinion' not having the stomach to kill the 'family' in order to kill the problem.

Penn · 01-02-2009, 16:49

There is a scene in Apocalyptic Now were Col. Kurtz relates a story to Capt. Willard about horror. The story Kurtz tells is that rather than except medical treatment, shots specifically, the villagers cut off the arms of their childern and stacked them in the middle of the village for Kurtz and his team to see...Its an unconscionable horror to him...It parallels the choice the Palestinies have made don’t you think?
Edit to add; I don't think they are cowards and I think you can't win against that mentality unless you commit to fight all out war, without mercy....

SF-TX · 01-02-2009, 17:30

Again, I fail to see how sacrificing one's innocent children is anything but cowardly.

At some point, if your only choice is the destruction of your enemy (to include his family) or your own family, you are going to have to make a choice. However distasteful that choice may be.

If I recall correctly (I wasn't there), the soldiers involved in the Mogadishu battle were faced with a similar choice. Somali fighters were using women and children to shield themselves while they fired upon US soldiers and airmen. The US soldiers could either choose not to shoot and allow their attacker to continue trying to kill them, or kill the unarmed woman or child protecting the shooter in order to neutralize the attacker. Either choice was unpleasant. But, it was a choice forced upon them by their adversary.

HAMAS has put Israel in a similar conundrum. Kill our families to kill us, or we will kill you and your family.

SF-TX · 01-02-2009, 18:10

I think the root of the problem, is as Charles Krauthammer recently opined, "Israels Very Existence." Hamas and other Islamic fundamentalists will not be satisfied until Israel ceases to exist and the entire world is subservient to Islam. All the other arguments are simply a smokescreen.

More from Mr. Krauthammer:

Quote:

"...The grievance? It cannot be occupation, military control or settlers. They were all removed in September 2005. There's only one grievance and Hamas is open about it. Israel's very existence.

Nor does Hamas conceal its strategy. Provoke conflict. Wait for the inevitable civilian casualties. Bring down the world's opprobrium on Israel. Force it into an untenable cease-fire -- exactly as happened in Lebanon. Then, as in Lebanon, rearm, rebuild and mobilize for the next round. Perpetual war. Since its raison d'etre is the eradication of Israel, there are only two possible outcomes: the defeat of Hamas or the extinction of Israel..."

Mr. Krauthammer's article is posted here:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/art...ed_in_gaz.html

For commentary on the same piece by Diana West, posted by Robert Spencer (she notes that Mr. Krauthammer fails to consider the Islamic aspect):

http://www.jihadwatch.org/archives/024199.php

Penn · 01-02-2009, 18:14

SF-TX, In my mind it is simply a tactic with complete disregard for human life that Hamas has chosen in order to win, in their mind they have lost everything; land, home, family. It, the tactic, plays on the Judeo-Christian values of the Israelis and the value placed on life, which reflects the social worth of women in their society. Muslims have a different sensibility and culturally women have a different value. It places their enemy, the Israelis, at a distinct disadvantage. It’s a solid disicion on their (hamas's) part, it express’s their desperation and the willingness to sacrifice all thats left of their culture.

It is not a cowardly act to use ones own family as a weapon, if fact, it may be the tougest disicion one could make.

Remember prior to the ending second world war Israel did not exist. The country was created as a compromise to solve the concept of place/home for the European Jewish population that survived the war.

In some respect, the genocide of native people which began with the age of exploration is not that far removed from the treatment of the Palestinies people.

SF-TX · 01-02-2009, 18:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Penn

SF-TX, In my mind it is simply a tactic with complete disregard for human life that Hamas has chosen in order to win, in their mind they have lost everything; land, home, family. It, the tactic, plays on the Judeo-Christian values of the Israelis and the value placed on life, which reflects the social worth of women in their society. Muslims have a different sensibility and culturally women have a different value. It places their enemy, the Israelis, at a distinct disadvantage. It’s a solid disicion on their (hamas's) part, it express’s their desperation and the willingness to sacrifice all thats left of their culture.
It is not a cowardly act to use ones own family as a weapon, if fact, it may be the tougest disicion one could make.

If they completely disregard human life and, culturally, value their women differently (lesser value than men and boys), is that decision really all that tough?

Surgicalcric · 01-02-2009, 20:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Penn

...I disagree with you, they’re not cowards. The statement is: To kill us; you are going to have to kill the entire society, women, childern, old men etc, do you have the stomach for it... ...They have chosen to use their society as a weapon, it’s the only thing they have left. Rather Spartan of them...

Men who hide among their women and children or use them for their own goals are cowards. Men who talk children into becoming suicide bombers are cowards.

Using all the men would be Startan of them, using the women and children is cowardice, IMNSHO.

**Box** · 01-02-2009, 21:08

less than men... no matter how cowardice is defined
nothing more than savages

rourke · 01-02-2009, 21:30

http://www.blackfive.net/main/2006/0..._virtues_.html

I am unsure if this article has been posted before and I do not wish to jump into the middle of a QP discussion. I am merely looking to elicit opinions from you gentlemen as to the relevance of said article in this situation. Thanks in advance. Back to grey.

Paslode · 01-02-2009, 21:54

Even mother natures wild animals protect their young, but not these schmucks they use them for bait which puts them below the title of Animal imo.

From what I understand they not only use others for human shields and human bombs but herd them into areas to create mass casulaties for the media to grab and flash over our evening news. Maybe if the media didn't take the bait of easy to get shocking news they would cease to have venue and the cycle would end.

It doesn't take heroics to knowingly, with sinister intent to put innocents in harms way, it takes a coward.

Penn · 01-02-2009, 22:23

It’s a different value system, in their mind Allah has forgiven their actions. There is no contrition; they and their human shields are Allah’s will, they act in the belief that the Koran permits all for the sake of the religion, but you already know that, what I am trying to say is: it has nothing to do with labels like coward, pure and simple it’s a tactic and as a tactic, it should be addressed accordingly, it has to be taken into consideration and understood in order to combat the guilt involved and the judgment call afterwards that are inherent in our value system.

SF-TX · 01-02-2009, 23:06

Quote:

Originally Posted by Penn

...it has nothing to do with labels like coward, pure and simple it’s a tactic and as a tactic, it should be addressed accordingly, it has to be taken into consideration and understood in order to combat the guilt involved and the judgment call afterwards that are inherent in our value system.

Good point.

SF-TX · 01-02-2009, 23:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by rourke

http://www.blackfive.net/main/2006/0..._virtues_.html

I am unsure if this article has been posted before and I do not wish to jump into the middle of a QP discussion. I am merely looking to elicit opinions from you gentlemen as to the relevance of said article in this situation. Thanks in advance. Back to grey.

My head hurts after reading that, but it is relevant to the discussion at hand.