View Full Version : Domestic COIN
Roguish Lawyer
08-26-2020, 22:04
It’s been needed for decades. Discuss and remember you are being watched.
Old Dog New Trick
08-26-2020, 22:28
We are a country controlled and manifested by constitutional law. Nowhere in US Code would it be allowed, in fact Posse Comitatus Act specifically forbids it.
Now, could a group of patriots go in to areas of disruption and undermine the popular culture? Well, yes but they would have no legal authority or cover of law. They would be just as guilty if not more so than the insurgents protected by the media and political leaders.
Roguish Lawyer
08-26-2020, 22:32
We are a country controlled and manifested by constitutional law. Nowhere in US Code would it be allowed, in fact Posse Comitatus Act specifically forbids it.
Now, could a group of patriots go in to areas of disruption and undermine the popular culture? Well, yes but they would have no legal authority or cover of law. They would be just as guilty if not more so than the insurgents protected by the media and political leaders.
Totally agree. But what happens when an insurgency goes totally unchecked? Do we need legislative change? Can the FBI handle it? Why or why not?
Old Dog New Trick
08-26-2020, 22:42
Totally agree. But what happens when an insurgency goes totally unchecked? Do we need legislative change? Can the FBI handle it? Why or why not?
1) We end up having (subversive) groups like BLM, Antifa and other well funded underground forces.
2) Yes, we need to change the law so that it gives local and federal law enforcement and law makers the tools to properly protect lives and property from unlawful behavior and assembly.
3) No! The FBI is not the best tool in the DHS toolbox.
4) Needs more discussion of why/why not.
frostfire
08-26-2020, 22:48
Totally agree. But what happens when an insurgency goes totally unchecked? Do we need legislative change? Can the FBI handle it? Why or why not?
So the ballot box is still the only mean average joes can legally counter subversive groups?
https://www.hsaj.org/articles/3555
https://measured.design/c3-counter-criminal-continuum/
To much SWAT like in USASOC, more Special Warfare.
Our enemies know our inability to handle an IW fight what better than to help one along that is internal to the US.
How about those automatic sears for AR-15 smuggled from a Chinese address that was busted by CBP. 10,000 sets.
Not to mention their trolls. doing their MISO on social media.
Totally agree. But what happens when an insurgency goes totally unchecked? Do we need legislative change? Can the FBI handle it? Why or why not?
There is this: "...or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.
The First Amendment is a Federal Document and there doesn't seem to be a chain-of-command clause.
Old Dog New Trick
08-27-2020, 00:15
I like that ^^^ (Uman’s Post) but then again duh! Modifying a tool to work for a different purpose is one thing but having a tool specifically designed for the task would be better.
Task and Purpose - Need to identify what those are and develop a strategy that can be quickly deployed based on local conditions and supporting factors. Each being somewhat different, and a moving target.
I’d like to see more use of NG as a defensive and protective posture so that local uniformed police can go mobile to protect and preserve property and life. If it’s necessary than armed police should be tasked with protecting firefighters to limit property damage. But, before that the police should be making arrests of those conducting property damage and larceny. Or, worse, assault and battery!
If federal assets are available then have both UC and uniformed to blend in with and conduct both infiltration and intelligence collection and make arrests of “conspiracy to commit violence crimes” even working their way up the chain of command to funding sources and C2.
Always lots of speculation but little facts about who pulls the strings and who funds it. As I’ve said elsewhere, there are lots of collegiate level sponsors of the terrorism being directed to dismantle our country. They should be perp walked right out of their university classroom during the middle of a lecture and the financial supporters should be “Stoned or Madoff’d” at 05:00 by an FBI HRT team with CNN tipped off.
Since none of that ever happens and hasn’t ever happened then we should just expect 17 year old kids to be incarcerated for doing what the grown ups should have been doing.
ETA: I think we really know how to do this, it’s just a matter of ruffling the political feathers and allowing the anvil to fall where it lands. Counter espionage is something practiced by every local gang task force and federal authority since before the Russians posed a threat.
And with that...good night. The red pill or the blue pill?
Trapper John
08-27-2020, 08:05
https://www.hsaj.org/articles/3555
https://measured.design/c3-counter-criminal-continuum/
To much SWAT like in USASOC, more Special Warfare.
Our enemies know our inability to handle an IW fight what better than to help one along that is internal to the US.
How about those automatic sears for AR-15 smuggled from a Chinese address that was busted by CBP. 10,000 sets.
Not to mention their trolls. doing their MISO on social media.
Exactly!
Rather than COIN (Do we really know what that means in this case?), I think many of us FOGs have experience with "winning the hearts and minds" of indig in violence oppressed environs. We can go into urban areas to create opportunity zones, build a "counter-culture" and deny the enemy their "human capital".
Just a thought, YMMV :D
(1VB)compforce
08-27-2020, 08:51
Exactly!
Rather than COIN (Do we really know what that means in this case?), I think many of us FOGs have experience with "winning the hearts and minds" of indig in violence oppressed environs. We can go into urban areas to create opportunity zones, build a "counter-culture" and deny the enemy their "human capital".
Just a thought, YMMV :D
You mean something like this?
If Cutone's choice of words sounds familiar to Iraq and Afghanistan veterans, that shouldn't be a surprise. "C3" means Counter Criminal Continuum and it's basically the application of the Army Special Forces' counterinsurgency tactics used in the Global War on Terror to violent crime and gang activity in American cities.
https://www.military.com/veteran-jobs/former-green-beret-has-real-solution-us-policing-problem.html
mark46th
08-27-2020, 09:07
Everything is in place to put the bad guys out of business. The only thing missing is leadership with the will and courage to implement it.
Trapper John
08-27-2020, 10:10
You mean something like this?
BINGO!!
We need VSO here in our potential No-Go zones. it is more counter gang/counter narcotics and in civilian cloths vs tooled up SWAT.
Irregular Warfare = War By Wisdom
tom kelly
08-27-2020, 12:45
Everything is in place to put the bad guys out of business. The only thing missing is leadership with the will and courage to implement it.
The bad guys are the leaders of the liberal cities that are & have been in control of the Democrat Party, The ENTIRE Democrat Party is corrupt from Joe Biden, Pelosi, Schumer, on down to the local democrat party workers in the liberal progressive cities. Why does a 17 year kid have to take on the "Peaceful Protestors" and when he defends his life from the mob, is charged with murder...There is no murder in a WAR. The winner of the WAR decides what the rules and laws of war are. The progressive democrat District Attorney's funded by George Soros pick & choose what rules & laws are applied in their failing progressive cities...
If federal assets are available then have both UC and uniformed to blend in with and conduct both infiltration and intelligence collection and make arrests of “conspiracy to commit violence crimes” even working their way up the chain of command to funding sources and C2.
I am completely shocked at the apparent level of support within the specific orgs of the "peaceful protests" and BLM. Anarchists in Portland seem to be using GMRS (according to videos) radios yet ARNG air assets cannot be used to support.
That seems very odd...or intentional? :confused:
Badger52
08-27-2020, 20:34
I think many of us FOGs have experience with "winning the hearts and minds" of indig in violence oppressed environs. We can go into urban areas to create opportunity zones, build a "counter-culture" and deny the enemy their "human capital".
I just read this, exactly when I was listening to Kenosha command report back to dispatch about reports of some guys with long guns that "we've been up there several times, they're Ok, they live there. They're just protecting their sub-division."
So... CIDG?
We don't need guns for this insurgency we need the Geek Squad ! Target all the cell phone's on the battle field. Without them the mob has no way to organize or record training video's. They would think again if that cell phone in their pocket went boom no work anymore :confused:
frostfire
08-28-2020, 00:56
We don't need guns for this insurgency we need the Geek Squad ! Target all the cell phone's on the battle field. Without them the mob has no way to organize or record training video's. They would think again if that cell phone in their pocket went boom no work anymore :confused:
We need th3j35t3r !!! :lifter
Wish there's a search light with jester silhouette on it.
I am completely shocked at the apparent level of support within the specific orgs of the "peaceful protests" and BLM. Anarchists in Portland seem to be using GMRS (according to videos) radios yet ARNG air assets cannot be used to support.
That seems very odd...or intentional? :confused:
Just my two cents...
BUUUUT
If you have a city (or state) that is world renowned for its ridiculously obscene level of woke-ness then "citizen math" suggests that those working for the PD as well as those serving in the NG are subject to that same level of wokeness...
The Portland PD is NOT manned by police officers from Omaha.
It's manned by citizens of Portland
The Oregon National Guard is NOT recruiting their manpower from Wyoming of Tennessee.
Consider....
Seattle PC Carmen Best is a liberal democrat.
She has always been a liberal democrat.
She was part of the decision to ban the use of tear gas to quell the rioting that led to her Police Department surrendering to the anarchists.
It wasn't until they were literally being overrun and forced to evacuate their precinct that they resumed use of tear gas - essentially to help cover their cowardly fucking retreat...
...she said it was because she wanted to look at different approaches to "reduce their footprint" in the Capitol Hill neighborhood.
Then began the 'summer of love' in the Democratic peoples Republic of Chaz-istan.
THAT is why shit is crazy in places that are notoriously liberal.
That is why none of us should be surprised that certain places in America are still on fire while the local governments and CNN stand in front of a blazing structure fire while describing the peaceful protest taking place behind them.
...its why a violent criminal with a knife is referred to as being "otherwise unarmed"
Dont be shocked - it will only give you a migraine.
Being shocked is liked being disappointing in frogs for bumping their asses on the lilly pad when they jump...
mark46th
08-28-2020, 09:02
I agree, Tom. I was referring to their thugs in the street, they could be dealt with quickly. Voting the dems out is the only means available to remove them at this time.
Speaking of thugs in the street...when democrats attack...violence, intimidation...
Senator Rand Paul and his wife are attacked by BLM mob as they leaves the White House following RNC and he thanks cops for 'saving out lives' after protesters earlier tried to silence Trump's speech with air horns
Kentucky senator Rand Paul and his wife were attacked by protesters as they left the White House Thursday
Video shows him being nearly knocked down, before being escorted away from the scene by police
Protesters were seen accosting and heckling other guests leaving the Republican National Convention
Hundreds of protesters gathered to chant and blow horns in an effort to drown out Trump's speech
Horns could be heard in the background of the televised broadcast, while firecrackers were also set off
By MARLENE LENTHANG FOR DAILYMAIL.COM and CHRIS PLEASANCE FOR MAILONLINE
PUBLISHED: 00:06 EDT, 28 August 2020 | UPDATED: 10:12 EDT, 28 August 2020
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8672681/BLM-protesters-gather-outside-White-House-Trumps-RNC-speech.html
RNC attendees are attacked by BLM mob after being left with NO police protection: Elderly man is punched in the back of the head and knocked to the ground while balaclava-clad protester threatens to 'f*** up' RNC committeeman and his wife
Hundreds of activists gathered in the streets around the White House during the final day of the RNC
Those leaving the event were confronted, heckled, and in at least one case assaulted as they walked out
One man was filmed being punched in the back of the head and knocked to the ground, leaving him bloody
Protester threatened to 'f*** up' RNC committeeman Chris Ager and his wife as they tried to get into a hotel
While some videos showed some protesters scuffling with police, officers were completely absent in others
By CHRIS PLEASANCE FOR MAILONLINE
PUBLISHED: 06:25 EDT, 28 August 2020 | UPDATED: 08:47 EDT, 28 August 2020
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8673417/RNC-attendees-attacked-BLM-mob-left-NO-police-protection.html
ETA Rand Paul interview the morning after (today) video interview embedded in story.
Rand Paul: Threats from DC Mob Were ‘F— You Up,’ ‘Kill You’
Breitbart
JEFF POOR28 Aug 2020
Friday on Fox News Channel’s “Fox & Friends,” Sen. Rand Paul (R-KY) rehashed his experience from a night early having been confronted by a mob of protesters near the White House in Washington, D.C. after the conclusion of the Republican National Committee.
Paul explained his reasoning for his decision to walk to his hotel, and what he felt might have happened if there had been no police nearby.
“The threats were to f— you up, to you know, to kill you,” he said. “The threats were if they could get ahold of you, and I truly believe with every fiber of my being, had they gotten at us, they would have gotten us to the ground. We might not have been killed. We might just have been injured by being kicked in the head or kicked in the stomach until we were senseless. You’ve seen the pictures. Most of the networks will not show the pictures of this. This is happening in all of our cities. Its got to stop and thank God for the police.”
“Had we not gotten to the police, I truly leave that the police saved our lives, and we would not be here today, or we’d be in a hospital today had the police not been there,” Paul continued. “And I’d like to thank them if they’re watching this. We thanked them last night, but it was still. It was still a melee. They were trying to get people, you know, away from us even in the hotel. People were following us into the hotel.”
https://www.breitbart.com/clips/2020/08/28/rand-paul-threats-from-dc-mob-were-f-you-up-kill-you/
prosecute under Title 18
https://uscode.house.gov/view.xhtml?req=granuleid:USC-prelim-title18-section351&num=0&edition=prelim
This article would confirm that China's doctrine of Unrestricted War is actively seeking to undermine the USG, supporting/employing/financing BLM. Lay this on top of other linked acts, China has planned and executed well.
https://www.heritage.org/progressivism/commentary/blm-co-founder-and-pro-communist-china-group-are-partnering-heres-why
Trapper John
09-18-2020, 12:04
I just read this, exactly when I was listening to Kenosha command report back to dispatch about reports of some guys with long guns that "we've been up there several times, they're Ok, they live there. They're just protecting their sub-division."
So... CIDG?
Vewy interestink! I don't know nuttin. :p
tom kelly
09-18-2020, 14:57
BLM, DNC, + "The Deep State" in the U S Gov. are being USED as tools for the CCP. and when the CCP is finished with them, they will be liquidated as is other trash in CHINA. Joe Biden is a prime example of Democrat Politicians & their families being used to promote CCP principals, ideas, and goals to make CHINA the number 1 and only super power in the world.... It only took 18 people to overthrow the Czar of Russia and replace it with communism.
Badger52
09-18-2020, 17:10
Vewy interestink! I don't know nuttin. :pBut you'd know it if you saw, wouldn't ya?
:cool: