Sh!thole...

[Old Dog New Trick]

Proof that Democrats really are stupid.

Check out this article from USA TODAY:

Chicago pays tribute to its Haitian founder after Trump allegedly trashes immigrants

https://usat.ly/2msuUSX

Chicago...a shithole then and still a shithole!

[cbtengr]

Proof that Democrats really are stupid.

Check out this article from USA TODAY:

Chicago pays tribute to its Haitian founder after Trump allegedly trashes immigrants

https://usat.ly/2msuUSX

Chicago...a shithole then and still a shithole!

Regarding the term "Shithole", Shithole is a term that knows no boundaries, it is a worldwide term. If indeed Trump did use that term then I say bully for him. Finally a leader that speaks his mind and worries not as to the direction of the wind. I most certainly do not find it to be a racist term.

[ddoering]

Definitely not a racist term. What benefit do people from shithole countries bring to the US? I know we had a bed bug problem a few years ago. And mumps, cholera, typhus and perhaps even polio. Thanks a lot shithole people.

[Old Dog New Trick]

I’ve been to some real shitholes in the world. Haiti being one of the worst and it wasn’t all our undoing, the local population sold their dignity for shiny trinkets and pennies on the dollar. Some of the worst shitholes I’ve been through are right here in America and not by immigrants, at least not black, brown, or other than white immigrants.

If the President of the United States referred to a shithole as a shithole in a private meeting with government leaders of both parties and both parties and the President can agree that the world is full of shitholes and we don’t need any more people from third world shitholes coming here until we can clean up some of our own shitholes.

If any of these Senators, Mayors or other elected officials want to sponsor immigrants from countries with no standards of life or living conditions and they will donate land, housing, utilities and sustenance for the life of those immigrants from their own privately owned lands and family money than I’m all for it.

I had to go over hurdles, jump through hoops of fire with the INS to bring my wife of foreign citizenship here. I had sign so many documents of financial support and swear to the creators of federal bureaucracy that she would not come to America on a non-immigrant visa and run off the join the circus. As such she still had to disclose to the American Embassy her financial situation at home was sufficient if she had to return for reasons of my delinquency. We’ve been married almost 20 years now and she became a US citizens after the birth of our child.

We did everything the right and legal way and at no time have we accepted a handout or free service from the government or American taxpayers.

Why is that so hard for our elected government to grasp?

[RichL025]

...

If any of these Senators, Mayors or other elected officials want to sponsor immigrants from countries with no standards of life or living conditions and they will donate land, housing, utilities and sustenance for the life of those immigrants from their own privately owned lands and family money than I’m all for it. ...

Yup, WASPs said the same things about my people when we immigrated. (I'm half Irish)

You can call a country a shithole. And I agree, many of those countries ARE shitholes (whether the POTUS should be saying that is another matter).

But I think it's a seperate issue to say we shouldnt be accepting immigrants froma country because its a shithole.

Remind me again, what's written on the tablet the Statue of Liberty holds?

[RichL025]

... What benefit do people from shithole countries bring to the US? ....

Good beer, a gift for storytelling and a helluva party come St Paddy's day.

[PSM]

Remind me again, what's written on the tablet the Statue of Liberty holds?

The poem was the winner of a contest to raise funds for the pedestal. It means nothing more.

Pat

[RichL025]

The poem was the winner of a contest to raise funds for the pedestal. It means nothing more.

Pat

Oh really? Seems like generations of Americans have held those phrases to mean something more than an advertising jingle.

[Old Dog New Trick]

The New Colossus
Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.
“Keep ancient lands, your storied pomp!” cries she
With silent lips. “Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!” (Emma Lazarus)


Heck of a nice poem written in the late 1800’s and recognized in 1901 as the symbols of American ideology. Engraved on the base and pedestal of the Statue of Liberty. A far different time indeed. The beginning of the industrial revolution and meant to entice European settlers to leave their homelands and stake claim to the new Americas. It was appropriate for the times as it was not expected or anticipated that just anyone had the means to travel by sailing vessels or steamship from Europe to America - ‘cause you didn’t come from anywhere else at the time.

I mean no disrespect to any human being. I myself am the product of German/Jewish immigrants who escaped Nazi Germany in the 1930’s and Portuguese wanders who came to the shores of America in the late 1800’s or early twentieth century.

I welcome all who can make the difficult journey to America by sea, land or air in modern times. And want to be here to raise families, assimilate with our customs and provide support to our continued way of life through hard work and dedication to professional services.

I have a problem when my government creates the rules (often in violation of the law), provides the incentives and pays the bills to relocate people simply for the sake of diversity. Or in the biggest misuse of power a voting base for one party over the other.

I am a Special Forces Green Beret and understand more than most about the reasons we open our hearts and our borders to people from the worst places on earth to come and live here and to prosper in our graces. Whether because of war, condemnation, or political violence. We are by our motto the protectors and liberators of oppression. And I don’t care what color you are, what religion you practice or what God you warship, what language you speak or how much wealth if any you have. Come to America and make your neighborhoods prosperous and lively. Don’t transplant your previous shithole to your new opportunity to live free and without the repression you escaped from whether you had risk everything or nothing to get here. That is a choice and to often they make the same bad choices that led to living in a crime and gang ridden shithole. Only now it used to be better for everyone who lived there prior to the new arrivals.

JMO YMMV

[Old Dog New Trick]

Oh really? Seems like generations of Americans have held those phrases to mean something more than an advertising jingle.

No, not really until sometime after 1965. Most people never been to Ellis Island and like the people who mistakenly believe the “right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness” think that’s in the Constitution somewhere. It’s not.

[RichL025]

No, not really until sometime after 1965.....

Please use your google-fu and read what FDR said about it. Quite a bit prior to 1965.

[WarriorDiplomat]

The poem was the winner of a contest to raise funds for the pedestal. It means nothing more.

Pat

Yep,

There are several phrases associated with the Statue of Liberty, but the most recognizable is “Give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to breathe free.” This quote comes from Emma Lazarus’ sonnet, New Colossus, which she wrote for a fundraiser auction to raise money for the pedestal upon which the Statue of Liberty now sits. The poem did not receive much recognition and was quite forgotten after the auction.

In the early 1900s and after Lazarus’ death, one of her friends began a campaign to memorialize Lazarus and her New Colossus sonnet. The effort was a success, and a plaque with the poem’s text was mounted inside the pedestal of the statute.

[RichL025]

I agree with most of what you wrote in that post. This part, however, does not ring true:
...
...It was appropriate for the times as it was not expected or anticipated that just anyone had the means to travel by sailing vessels or steamship from Europe to America - ‘cause you didn’t come from anywhere else at the time.
...

There was quite a bit of non-European immigration going on during this time. It just wasn't though Ellis island, so the Statue of Liberty (understandably) became associated with European immigration.

And regarding the "means to travel" - that was not a very high bar at all. Some of my ancestors came over as indentured servants because they otherwise could not afford passage.

Again, they were fleeing shitholes that happened to be European shitholes...

[WarriorDiplomat]

Please use your google-fu and read what FDR said about it. Quite a bit prior to 1965.


From 1892 til 1924 roughly 12,000,000 immigrants came through Ellis island it is of note the first immigrant recorded coming through the Island was a Irish woman


With the passing of the Immigrant Quota Act of 1921, the number of immigrants being allowed into the United States declined greatly. The passing of the bill ended the era of mass immigration.After 1924, Ellis Island became primarily a detention and deportation processing station.

[Old Dog New Trick]

Please use your google-fu and read what FDR said about it. Quite a bit prior to 1965.

I thought you said generations of Americans. :p

Not political points for a campaign, or special speech given in memorial setting.

Just saying a lot of people misquote often the peom as it was written and for whom it was written - the Statue of Liberty.

While we are here, let’s discuss the less storied and famous islands of New York Harbor. Wonder what encouraging words were inscribed for the immigrants arriving at Hoffman or Swinburne Islands? What were the government employees tasked with their Immigration Rules and Standards to determine who got to Ellis Island passed go and got a stamp in their passport or got on the little boat and sent a short distance away to hopefully get better or never be seen alive again.

Not everything we’ve done had been nice and accommodating to people deemed unhealthy, dirty, or unkempt.

ETA: if poems, memes, quotes by Hollywood actors and even Presidents exercising their 1A rights of free speech are what indicate LAWS not ratified by the Congress/States and signed into law by the appropriate official than we have some big issues.

[cat in the hat]

"Huddled masses yearning to breath free"

Does not mean people who want a free life. (Free healthcare, education, food stamps etc...)

Like many, I am all for LEGAL immigration of those who want to build a better life for themselves and their family through solid work ethic. Not people who just want an easy life at the expense of others.

[SF_BHT]

I’m still having a problem with why is it so bad to call some place a Shit Hole?

I thought it was a pretty common term.

Tooooo many special snow flakes out there.....

What will happen when he calls someone a Shit Head? Will Dems heads explode:eek:

[Old Dog New Trick]

What will happen when he calls someone a Shit Head? Will Dems heads explode:eek:

I’m sure he probably said that: “Dick (Durbin) you’re a Shit Head!”

[Team Sergeant]

What will happen when he calls someone a Shit Head? Will Dems heads explode:eek:

We can only hope............:munchin

[7624U]

We can only hope............:munchin

For the largest roll of toilet paper :D

[Old Dog New Trick]

RichL025, if at any point last night you felt I was not inclusive enough to know that those immigrants from the UK and specifically Ireland are not considered part of Europe my apologies. Yes, the Irish have always for some reason beyond my understanding have been excluded from social acceptance. I don’t know why. I know a great many people came to America during the late Nineteenth and early Twentieth centuries and built communities largely isolated from other ethnic groups.

My point was to show (not prove) that the US has had many different criteria’s throughout the years as to who it accepted and who it rejected for immigration purposes before the Immigration and Natralization Act of 1952.

Everything President Trump has proposed in controlling the free exchange of foreign nationals and those here for temporary reasons is within the laws of the INA and has been ignored by presidents and congress alike for political reasons. Often at a detriment of social order.

In regards to DACA many of these illegal immigrants have had many opportunities to become naturalized citizens but for reasons I do not know (understand) have chosen to remain illegal immigrants. Times up! (I secretly know these children don’t want their parents deported by registering and exposing their stories.) That’s too bad. It’s the law!

If you are unhappy with the law change the law! Don’t complain about it and do nothing.

As for St. Paddy’s day I love Guinness, a good Black&Tan with Bass Ale and Colcannon mash potatoes. Throw in some beef stew and I’m as happy as a kilt wearing Celt rebelling against conformity.

[tonyz]

Among other travels, I've been to every major city in this country and then some...all have pockets of shitholes occupied by some good folks...and certainly some shitheads.

Based on my very informal observation - we have more than enough shitholes and shitheads already right here in the good ole USA.

D.C. should seek to minimize both here at home - not import more.

On this D.C. has been a fail.

What's the definition of insanity?

[WarriorDiplomat]

Well I am not as PC their are alot of shitholes out there though I have only been on 3 continents but I would not consider Europe, Britain to be shitholes and I doubt the POTUS does either....and who cares the liberals??? they can kiss my white ass...the college kids? there opinions don't matter they don't know anything yet. Lets acknowledge that those living in and leading the governments of these shitholes know they are shitholes. I am grateful I am an American born and bred....my mother is a Swede and I am grateful I was not born in that liberal place with a wacky government and no rights to protect my self or family and worse yet no rights to even speak about it.....my mother and many Germans living where I grew up felt the same way....America is the most advanced civilization in the world.....God Bless America.

There are lesser poorer areas in America and it is still better than the shitholes out there I grew up in one.....this is America we have opportunity.....my fathers was most German and some Indian....Tribe was UNK my GGF was taken from a reservation in Oklahoma in the 1890's and given a white name so he had no idea what trail of tears his people walked.....many lines of my fathers family is traced back to every war the great world wars, civil war both sides, indian wars, and sons of the American revolution, right down to settling this country with Pocahontas and John Rolfe and one line back to the old countries to an ancestor who was a killed fighting in Jeruselum in 1095? as a templar.....oh by the way they were not wealthy they were the poor, indentured and hungry spoke of and a warrior class willing to fight for something better.....the people that came to this country are the best they are the explorers that saw man as supreme beings meant to advance and conquer.....not be content living in a tribal culture that does not advance.....they were not content with the state of existence in this world....God Bless America....

People who came here wanted more and got it....this country represents every nation on the planet and we live together in relative peace and solidarity....America...we are the evolution of the world this country is the way that the world needs to see......we figured it out the rest of the world needs to figure it out but by being the guiding light we have a responsibility to keep this country strong.....even the shitholes need a light in the darkness to advance their own societies....but fuck anyone who wants to come here not assimilate and turn this chosen nation into a shithole.....'MERICA

Being sensitive about a country that is a shithole is ignorant like I said they know it and so does everyone else if not then everyone would be going their not here. Societies and people must advance and rid ourselves of tribalism that is the meaning of America.....GOD BLESS AMERICA

https://youtu.be/q6N4zKM2cZs

[RichL025]

RichL025, if at any point last night you felt I was not inclusive enough to know that those immigrants from the UK and specifically Ireland are not considered part of Europe my apologies.

No, actually, I was referring to non-white immigrants from asia and latin america which occurred at the same time. Eliis island was only for those coming from Europe (whether you consider the Brit Isles part of it o rnot is a separate discussion <g>)




As for St. Paddy’s day I love Guinness, a good Black&Tan with Bass Ale and Colcannon mash potatoes. Throw in some beef stew and I’m as happy as a kilt wearing Celt rebelling against conformity.

Arghhh, yer killin me! :eek:

Kilts are Scottish, not Irish (although to be fair some Irish national-identity types started wearing them in the late 1800s / early 1900s, but there is no history before that of Irishmen wearing kilts. Irishmen wearing kilts is basically trying to piggyback on the successful brand from the scotts)

And not only is a "Black and Tan" a waste of a good stout, the name stems from a Protestant paramilitary organization accused of multiple civil rights abuses, some would say terror, against the Catholics. Most of the US Irish diaspora are catholics, so this is like celebrating the KKK on MLK day!

Well, OK, I'm being a _little_ melodramatic and just a touch pedantic. Pet peeve of mine. And I freely admit I am in the annoying minority when I remind most Americans of the above facts.

Still, the "Black and Tan" thing kills me....

Back on track, I agree with you that "dreamers" should not be granted automatic citizenship because their parents broke the law. And I actually agree with what POTUS is doing in trying to force congress to make laws regarding immigration policy, instead of governing by fiat like his predecessor. But justice must also be tempered with mercy, and we have to find a way to not punish innocent people while at the same time not encouraging future lawbreakers (or line-jumpers, if you prefer).

And even if we use the term "lawbreakers" to describe illegal immigrants (they DID break immigration laws after all), I have more than a little sympathy for people trying to escape the 'shitholes' they live in just so they can WORK and provide for their families. Again, my ancestors came here to escape famine and political opression. Ireland was a SHITHOLE in the 18th/19th centuries, as were many other European countries.

[Requiem]

What irks me is that so many people are now speaking up about being from one of those shithole nations. "I was from X, but now I'm a doctor. Now I'm a genius scientist. Now I'm a teacher. Now I'm a computer geek, etc." The point being, they've done well here in America and are not a burden. The U.S.A. is still the best place for anyone to improve their lot in life if they study, work, save, live a good, clean life. Welcome.

What kills me is that NONE of these critical immigrants, upon hearing their former country called a shithole, think to go back to their shithole nation and with their experience as a doctor, scientist, teacher, etc, help their shithole nation improve itself. They're here in America for good, which is fine, but don't criticize anyone for calling your former country a shithole if you're not wiling to go back and fix it. You left it because it IS a shithole.


S.

[PSM]

People who came here wanted more and got it...

There you go, they went through selection! Half of my line came on the Mayflower (and half of them died in the first winter) and the other half were Irish and came much later. It was a tough road for both sides.

Pat

[WarriorDiplomat]

There you go, they went through selection! Half of my line came on the Mayflower (and half of them died in the first winter) and the other half were Irish and came much later. It was a tough road for both sides.

Pat

The whole immigration thing is the Dems really only want to bring an underclass that increases voter base....most people here to work and seize opportunity see through it l....liberals need to bring in those who seek to benefit from their policies which just reduces this nation to a shithole....we want to allow people in also but we want value added work ethic, honest progression, future leaders and productive loyal.citizens who appreciate the opportunity......if we allow this country to deteriorate into a welfare state we will be of no value to the world and the hope for those who want more will be extinguished......

[Razor]

"There once was a man from Nantucket..."

I dare say more folks know that poem than the one on the Statue of Liberty. Since this poem is so popular, are we then to hold true without question that there's an above average incident rate of auditory canal trauma in Rhode Island?

[RichL025]

"There once was a man from Nantucket..."

I dare say more folks know that poem than the one on the Statue of Liberty. Since this poem is so popular, are we then to hold true without question that there's an above average incident rate of auditory canal trauma in Rhode Island?

The limerick you are referring to is not engraved at the base of what is probably the most recognizable symbol of America.

The poem by Pound is.

[spaike97]

I think his point is not that America should really stop accepting immigration from these countries, but to propose a merit-based system to make sure that America gets people who are actually skillful or educated.

[PSM]

The poem by Pound is.

It was Emma Lazarus, not Ezra Pound, mi amigo. ;)

Pat

[rsdengler]

I’m still having a problem with why is it so bad to call some place a Shit Hole?

I thought it was a pretty common term.

Tooooo many special snow flakes out there.....

What will happen when he calls someone a Shit Head? Will Dems heads explode:eek:

LOL....Every time I have to drive through the City of Baltimore the first thing I say is "What a Shit Hole".....:D

Really, aren't some of those 3rd World Countries "Shit Holes"? Seriously, they need to get over it....


Hee, Hee.....it would be a nice YouTube Video if he called someone a Shit Head and the entire section where the Dems sit on the Senate floor erupts with that "popping sound".....Dem Splatter.....:lifter

[tonyz]

Those legal immigrants who yearn to assimilate and become Americans are an asset.

Those who do not wish to assimilate and instead essentially convert (intentionally or unintentionally) America to the wretched place (the shitholes) which they fled - are a liability - a liability which we simply can no longer afford.

We have reached a point in our nation where a merit based system with tiers for low skilled needs and high skill needs (and there will always be special cases) might make more sense.

[Old Dog New Trick]

No, actually, I was referring to non-white immigrants from asia and latin america which occurred at the same time. Eliis island was only for those coming from Europe (whether you consider the Brit Isles part of it o rnot is a separate discussion <g>)

This thread was inclusive to all immigrants from ‘shitholes’ it was you who made it about the Statue of Liberty and The New Colossus. From their we focused in immigrants from European countries and their arrival at Ellis Island and elsewhere in New York. As there really was no other or extremely low levels of “immigration” from any other countries in the world to the USA. There were some Asians (Japanese and all others) that came through San Francisco or Seattle but most Asians coming from China might just have been blacks coming from Africa. They were slaves not immigrants, and they wouldn’t have ever seen the Statue of Liberty nor heard of the poem inscribed at the base. The southern border at the time of the great migration would have seen more Hispanic and Latin persons traveling south than those coming here from South/Central America. We had pretty much just kicked them all out from Texas to California and closed the border with armies and forts.

Today we don’t have an immigration problem with Europe. Europe has an immigration problem with North Africa, the Mediterranean and West Asia. Some day they will recognize this but for now it’s already too late. They may not think of themselves as a ‘shithole’ but give it time and the small festering cesspools will eventually spill over and consume all that once was Europe and the UK.

Arghhh, yer killin me! :eek:

Kilts are Scottish, not Irish (although to be fair some Irish national-identity types started wearing them in the late 1800s / early 1900s, but there is no history before that of Irishmen wearing kilts. Irishmen wearing kilts is basically trying to piggyback on the successful brand from the scotts)

You didn’t see the tongue in cheek humor in that? “kilt wearing Celt railing against conformity.”

And even if we use the term "lawbreakers" to describe illegal immigrants (they DID break immigration laws after all), I have more than a little sympathy for people trying to escape the 'shitholes' they live in just so they can WORK and provide for their families. Again, my ancestors came here to escape famine and political opression. Ireland was a SHITHOLE in the 18th/19th centuries, as were many other European countries.

Did your people bring their “SHITHOLE” with them when they settled in the new America? No, that’s the point of the discussion. Most every immigrant before the last 30-years came to America to escape a shithole and build a new and better life. They who succeeded did it the right way. Whether from Asia, Africa, the Middle East or South America. They waited in line and paid the fees.

[TOMAHAWK9521]

I don't understand the horror and hostility towards the concept of legal immigration and merit-based immigration. If I recall, NZ requires you to have skills or some other desirable traits/assets (successful company) in order to qualify for citizenship, and Wales used to require you to learn the Welsh language within a year in order to continue living there.

And I apologize if my American history is rusty, but didn't the US put a lengthy hiatus in place for taking in large numbers of immigrants in order for them to fully integrate into the fabric of the nation? That is until, TK, the failed amphibious car driver of Chappaquiddick introduced legislation to allow massive numbers of immigrants to enter the country for the specific intent of beefing up the number of registered democrap voters. That's been the MO of the DNC and DC establishment (socialist family tree) ever since. I realize I'm stating the obvious, but by allowing hole-shitters unfettered access to this country, a majority of them illegally, the nightmare of the DNC controlling the policies of our country becomes very real. If this nation is to survive, perhaps we should revisit the idea of reducing the flow of all immigration and make it strictly merit-based.

It's not just the politics that are at stake, foreign hole-shitters are like Kalifornians (not Californians). They allow their state to turn to shit in one form or another, usually economically, decide it's no longer the "diverse/multicultural/inclusive" paradise they "intended" it to be and move to states with less intrusive governments and more available resources (cheaper real estate). But they don't like how those states don't cater to their selfish interests so they push the failed ideas they brought with them until the states they moved to become as big a shit hole as the one they abandoned. And they call this "progress".

[RichL025]

It was Emma Lazarus, not Ezra Pound, mi amigo. ;)

Pat

:eek:

[Old Dog New Trick]

TOMAHAWK9521 - Whole Post!

That’s about it right thar.

Secretly under the last administration and I don’t know the numbers but suspect they are in the tens to hundreds of thousands of people were allowed to come here on what’s been called the “Diversity Visa Lottery Program” where the only requirement to apply was to stand in line at the American Embassy and sign up. If your number is called you answer a few questions, run a quick background check (with negative results because there is no derogatory information) and get a new USPP issued with a made up DOB (01/01/1995). Everything from there including plane tickets was paid for by the USG with a cash settling fee to get started in you free section eight housing.

The handlers (government paid sponsors) from arrival until permanent resettlement location help with everything from EBT cards and vouchers to helping to get drivers licenses (CDL in some cases), medical care, special education and eventually low paying or under the table jobs - some in sensitive positions within key national transportation.

The whole thing is a joke! And the worst part is anyone legitimately trying to get here is waiting in the wrong line.

Those above are the new “legal immigrants” go figure.

Smugglers still know there is money to be made on both drug and human smuggling from down south or from East Asia and elsewhere.

Then there are programs and loopholes created by the USG that encourage illegal immigration at the Southern border because we’ll take kids left there by a parent or older sibling. It only encourages the long, costly and often deadly risk to people from Central America to try.

Anyone who thinks our southern border is fortified and patrolled by an army of CBP agents doesn’t know what Mexico’s southern border looks like. I heard the Mexican Army uses it as a no go zone much like the Russians had a wall to keep people from leaving. Mexico uses open fields of fire to keep people out. Obviously they suck at it though.

DACA and all the current programs from both Republican and Democratic White House’s written since the 198X’s amnesty deal have made the Immigration and Naturalization Act of 1952 and subsequent Amendments authorized by Congress and signed into law by the presidents unenforceable.

Trump is simply following the law and ignoring all the unlawful and unconstitutional EO’s signed since about 1972.

I applaud him! It’s about time.

[Pete]

The only thing I can say is "I know a shit hole when I'm in it."

Been in one a number of times.

[tom kelly]

Number 1 THE WASHINGTON DC BELTWAY....Tom Kelly

[GratefulCitizen]

During the campaign, Trump ran on "America First."
This would logically include immigration policies which are designed to benefit this country before it benefits potential immigrants.

The question is:
Does his implied preference of immigrant source-nations actually serve this campaign promise?

Liberals would rather avoid answering that question.

[frostfire]

Back on track, I agree with you that "dreamers" should not be granted automatic citizenship because their parents broke the law. And I actually agree with what POTUS is doing in trying to force congress to make laws regarding immigration policy, instead of governing by fiat like his predecessor. But justice must also be tempered with mercy, and we have to find a way to not punish innocent people while at the same time not encouraging future lawbreakers (or line-jumpers, if you prefer).


this. I pray for the POTUS for wisdom and courage towards that direction.

I went through approx 10 years of time, physical, financial, legal, mental, and emotional toll to get full legal citizenship. So anyone wishing for shortcut can feel like a slap to the face. But my path was also full of grace and merciful moments. Thus who am I to deny others the same. However, I am also fully against enabling current (and future) society liabilities.

The "easy solution" is selection through case-by-case basis, but that sounds easy on paper. On a theoretical basis, DACA makes a lot of sense with individuals who are skilled (or willing to be trained) and set out to build/defend America....even one who wishes to atone for their parents transgression of breaking immigration law
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/checkpoint/wp/2017/09/07/the-military-looked-to-dreamers-to-use-their-vital-skills-now-the-u-s-might-deport-them/?utm_term=.416b570a29d0

[Box]

If someone from a shithole wants to legally immigrate to the United States to make a contribution as an American citizen, they should be welcomed with open arms.

If they want to sneak in and wave their shithole nations flag in American streets... well, fuck 'em
If they want to sneak in and send money back to their shithole country while avoiding US taxes... well, fuck 'em
If they want to sneak in and enjoy American benefits while avoiding US taxes... well, fuck 'em
If they want to sneak in and enjoy American liberties while denouncing the America rule of law... well, fuck 'em


I don't give a fuck. Part of my family immigrated to the USA after Civil War, part of them immigrated after WW2, part of them were already here when the European interlopers showed up and strip mined the land for its resources.
The idea that I am somehow supposed to show a sympathetic ear falls short.
Especially when I have worked in many of the shithole places the POTUS is referring to.

Immigrants are not bad - they are brave people - taking a HUGE chance by leaving their lives behind and stepping into a new world. We deserve them.
Illegal aliens are NOT immigrants, they are citizens of foreign lands that are breaking American laws.

[cbtengr]

If someone from a shithole wants to legally immigrate to the United States to make a contribution as an American citizen, they should be welcomed with open arms.

If they want to sneak in and wave their shithole nations flag in American streets... well, fuck 'em
If they want to sneak in and send money back to their shithole country while avoiding US taxes... well, fuck 'em
If they want to sneak in and enjoy American benefits while avoiding US taxes... well, fuck 'em
If they want to sneak in and enjoy American liberties while denouncing the America rule of law... well, fuck em......................

AMEN! I do not think that that could have been stated any better

[PSM]

Shithole, CA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KF7hWzqdPDk)

ETA: 2015 vs 2017 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=263&v=eOuCRqxFi3E)

Pat

[tonyz]

Shithole, CA (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KF7hWzqdPDk)

ETA: 2015 vs 2017 (https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=263&v=eOuCRqxFi3E)

Pat

What a fu$king disgrace.

[Box]

What a fu$king disgrace.


It's not a disgrace - it's just proof that we need a liberal female president, higher taxes, and more gun control.

[spaike97]

I don't understand the horror and hostility towards the concept of legal immigration and merit-based immigration. If I recall, NZ requires you to have skills or some other desirable traits/assets (successful company) in order to qualify for citizenship, and Wales used to require you to learn the Welsh language within a year in order to continue living there.

And I apologize if my American history is rusty, but didn't the US put a lengthy hiatus in place for taking in large numbers of immigrants in order for them to fully integrate into the fabric of the nation? That is until, TK, the failed amphibious car driver of Chappaquiddick introduced legislation to allow massive numbers of immigrants to enter the country for the specific intent of beefing up the number of registered democrap voters. That's been the MO of the DNC and DC establishment (socialist family tree) ever since. I realize I'm stating the obvious, but by allowing hole-shitters unfettered access to this country, a majority of them illegally, the nightmare of the DNC controlling the policies of our country becomes very real. If this nation is to survive, perhaps we should revisit the idea of reducing the flow of all immigration and make it strictly merit-based.

It's not just the politics that are at stake, foreign hole-shitters are like Kalifornians (not Californians). They allow their state to turn to shit in one form or another, usually economically, decide it's no longer the "diverse/multicultural/inclusive" paradise they "intended" it to be and move to states with less intrusive governments and more available resources (cheaper real estate). But they don't like how those states don't cater to their selfish interests so they push the failed ideas they brought with them until the states they moved to become as big a shit hole as the one they abandoned. And they call this "progress".

I think the reason for the horror and hostility towards the concept of legal immigration and merit-based immigration is 1. A lot of Americans probably can't tell between legal and illegal immigration, and don't know how damn hard it is nowadys to do it legally. 2. It's a voter base thing to politicians. They want to make sure they are bringing people that will support them.

[tonyz]

It's not a disgrace - it's just proof that we need a liberal female president, higher taxes, and more gun control.

...an an we need open borders an more AM-nasty...an an LBGTQRSTUVWXYZ's should automatically have their choice of assignments ahead of everyone 'specially those wascist white, capitalist, CIS-gendered, tax payin, good fo nuthin christian sperm donors...an an free cake for everyone !

[PSM]

I'll shoot for cross-thread points: http://www.professionalsoldiers.com/forums/showpost.php?p=629028&postcount=12

[Box]

I feel like some of you folks are letting too much sarcasm creep into your posting.

Let's take things a little more seriously and focus on facts and things that are important; the sarcasm needs to be toned down a little.

[tonyz]

I feel like some of you folks are letting too much sarcasm creep into your posting.

Let's take things a little more seriously and focus on facts and things that are important; the sarcasm needs to be toned down a little.

...was just channelin' my inner snowflake.

[Old Dog New Trick]

Redacted

[tom kelly]

Today there are @ 8 Billion people in the World and by 2050 there are expected to be 12 Billion inhabitants on this planet. The population of the U S A today is @ 335 million. This problem needed to be addressed 70 years ago. However it was pushed down the road like DACA and now it's a problem. The overpopulation of the U S A is approaching a CRITICAL point? The solutions, if there are any, will not be easy and what will be the final solution?