View Full Version : Did the United States steal Texas from Mexico?
My youngest comes home today and says Hey Dad, my social studies teacher told us today that the United States stole Texas and the New Mexico region from Mexico.
I hate when teachers plant these type of seeds instead of educating kids on the differing viewpoints.
So my question is, did the US steal Texas and the New Mexico region from Mexico?
Streck-Fu
05-04-2016, 16:40
Texas fought for and won independence from Mexico in 1836. The US recognized Texas at the time but did not annex it then. Mexico threatened war with the US if they did.
There was an active dispute over some territories that are now part of New Mexico and Colorado that the US eventually helped the Texans secure after the recognized territory of Texas was annexed.
I equate those claiming that the US stole Texas with those claiming all native Indians were peaceful victims of European and American aggression.
Oldrotorhead
05-04-2016, 16:45
Here is a quick time line for Texas.
http://www.thestoryoftexas.com/discover/texas-history-timeline
Tell "teacher" to support the claim that the US stole Texas from Mexico or publicly retract the statement.
Here is a quick time line for Texas.
http://www.thestoryoftexas.com/discover/texas-history-timeline
Tell "teacher" to support the claim that the US stole Texas from Mexico or publicly retract the statement.
They have Indians on horses well before 1492.
Oldrotorhead
05-04-2016, 17:54
They have Indians on horses well before 1492.
The time line shows when they moved into Texas not when they stole their first horse. :D
...and the Spaniards (those with Spanish names) stole it from the Indians...etc. etc....what a stupid ass of a teacher.
Congressman Grijalva of Tucson maybe?
mark46th
05-04-2016, 18:39
Have the teacher look up the Gadsen Purchase, too. We bought the lower parts of New Mexico and Arizona from Mexico and the Treaty of Guadalupe Hidalgo which set the borders between Mexico and Texas...
I had a book written by Capt. Jack "Coffee" Hayes, one of the original Texas Rangers, and participant in the revolution and the Mexican-American War. In the book he had a map that showed the map of what they claimed, it spread to the California coast and took all of Cali east to what is now Oklahoma (excluded OK).
We stole Texas from Mexico to the same extent that Mexico stole Mexico from the Spanish.
Before the Spanish, those in Mexico did not own Texas. The Comanche did. And we've pretty much killed all of them. So.....
We stole Texas from Mexico to the same extent that Mexico stole Mexico from the Spanish.
Before the Spanish, those in Mexico did not own Texas. The Comanche did. And we've pretty much killed all of them. So.....
To the victor go the spoils................. Since the beginning of civilization nothing has changed regarding this.
Congressman Grijalva of Tucson maybe?
Rawooooooooolll! :D
Hold on guys, I may want to be part of Mexico in a few months. ;)
Pat
Here is the work sheet, it is titled 'Was the United States Justified in Going to War with Mexico?'
http://troxelsclassroom.com/uploads/3/0/6/3/3063417/ush1_6.pdf
So it appears they are asking for an opinion on the subject which is based on the contents of the documentation.
Notes on the back provided by the teacher......
Yes!
1. Manifest Destiny
2. We were attacked
No....
1. Polk provoked the war (and lied to Congress)
2. We were just taking land from our neighbor
3. Slavery may expand into more states in the US
As far as I can tell there is no mention of the battle of San Jauncito, nor did I find any mention that Texas was its own country for 10 years prior to the US annexation.
Both of which are very important events......reading the Mini-Q it would be easy to see how a 7th grader might come away thinking the US merely took the land from the poor Mexicans.
Divemaster
05-04-2016, 21:32
Such a small world. My antique map collecting interest of late has steered towards maps that show, as they highlight in the auctions and on map dealer sites, "Texas as an Independent Republic". For North America collectors this is a sub category just as "California as an Island" (I wish!) is.
I think the teacher is getting history lessons from progressive/socialist sociologists rather than from historians.
Yes... we stole texas.
...we stole New Mexico too
...we also stole New Engand
...we stole the mid-atlantic states
...we stole the recipe for kool aid
...we stole lightsaber technolgy form the sith and used it to produce those crazy lights you see underneath of street-racers
...we stole an aliens spaceship and locked him up in a secret prison
We will gladly give ALL of that shit back...
...You just have to come and get it.
Yes... we stole texas.
...we stole New Mexico too
...we also stole New Engand
...we stole the mid-atlantic states
...we stole the recipe for kool aid
...we stole lightsaber technolgy form the sith and used it to produce those crazy lights you see underneath of street-racers
...we stole an aliens spaceship and locked him up in a secret prison
We will gladly give ALL of that shit back...
...You just have to come and get it.
But Billy they have come here to get it. All I have to do is look left and right here in NM and all is see is Mexicans. They have taken it back without a war.....:eek:
But Billy they have come here to get it. All I have to do is look left and right here in NM and all is see is Mexicans. They have taken it back without a war.....:eek:
Love the food, though. ;)
Pat
Here is the work sheet...FWIW, the mini-DBQ is patterned on the AP U.S. History exams' DBQ (document based questions) that high school juniors and seniors take typically after an advanced course. MOO, the work sheet is all over the place and overall not a good tool to teach 7th graders about the causes of the Mexican-American War.
To the victor go the spoils[.] Since the beginning of civilization nothing has changed regarding this.Okay, but the challenge of this POV is that it doesn't square with American exceptionalism--if we're the City on the Hill, setting an example for the world to follow, what are observers to think when we behave just like they do and then celebrate that fact?
FWIW, what follows is a quick Q/A with the late David M. Pletcher, a historian who specialized on the topic. Source is here (http://www.pbs.org/kera/usmexicanwar/prelude/md_an_ideal_or_a_justification.html).An Ideal or a Justification?
A Conversation With David M. Pletcher
Indiana University
What were the driving forces behind the United States' quest for Manifest Destiny during the 19th century?
The term "Manifest Destiny" was, in part, an expression of a genuine ideal on the part of Americans. But it was also a justification, in that they wanted territory and needed an excuse or justification for a push into territory that they did not control.
The idea of Manifest Destiny was foreshadowed by some of the writings during the revolutionary times, with the desire for Canada in the period between the American War for Independence and the War of 1812. It rationalized the Louisiana Purchase and United States' support for Texas independence and annexation.
More broadly stated, Manifest Destiny was a conviction that God intended North America to be under the control of Americans. It's a kind of early projection of Anglo-saxon supremacy and there's a racist element to it.
But there was also an idealistic element. It was very hard to measure the two, since it would differ from person to person. If you asked a person to define Manifest Destiny, he might tell you it is an ideal, or he might say, "Well, we want the land and this is the easiest way to justify our taking it."
How were the United States' actions to fulfill its perceived Manifest Destiny viewed by outside nations?
The attitude of Europeans and other observers was one not of fear of the United States, but a combination of lack of respect and a conviction that Americans were essentially hypocrites to talk about ideals then aim at expanding their land holdings.
This conviction developed, in part, out of American propaganda and publicity. The Americans did a great deal of talking and writing about liberty, but at the same time, they expanded the idea of Manifest Destiny. It was their destiny to expand across North America. The people poised in the way of that expansion, were aware of this, especially the Mexicans.
Mexicans were torn between two conflicting attitudes about the United States. One was an attitude of admiration, the other was an attitude of fear that the Americans would try to detach border territories from Mexico's lands.
Many Mexicans wanted to imitate the United States—its prosperity, the development of its economy and its agriculture. But they wanted to do so without losing land in the process.
Were Mexico's fears about the United States justified?
Well, the events of the 1830s and '40s would suggest that their fears were justified. One must take into consideration the fact that the Texans, by revolting against Mexico, were doing practically the same thing that the Mexicans themselves had done when they revolted against Spain. So the arguments Mexico used to protest Texas' right to revolt were a bit hollow. Texans were well aware of this, so they paid little attention to what the Mexicans said.
Who were the people and what were the forces behind U.S. opposition to western expansion and the fulfillment of Manifest Destiny?
Expansion was always a very divisive issue that provoked as much opposition as support in some parts of the country. At first, the opposition to expansion came from those who believed that the United States could not succeed as an experiment in self-government if it grew too large. This became a political position of the Whig Party during the 1840s and was one of the bases for their opposition to the war with Mexico.
There were many citizens who felt that a democracy like the United States could succeed only if it were relatively small and close to the people. In a sense, this was a Jeffersonian ideal. There were others who saw possibilities for greatness on the part of the United States in growth and economic development. This was, in some degree, the Hamiltonian ideal and those who supported it stood behind expansion of the United States, especially in the West, and the expansion of American commerce.
At first, basis for opposition to U.S. expansion was a feeling that it would contribute to the downfall of the nation. Later, the Northeast and East Coast felt they would lose power if the United States admitted more states in to the Union. Finally, the abolitionists in the North were afraid that the conquest of Mexico would lead to the incorporation of more slave territory into the United States.
During the course of the conflict with Mexico, the opposition to the war became focused upon the abolitionists movement and opposition to the expansion of slavery. There was, of course, some sympathy with the Mexicans and some pacifist opposition to the war itself as the casualty lists grew longer. But the abolitionist movement became a means of focusing this opposition into a powerful political movement that President Polk had to pay attention to.
Texas annexation seemed to be a part of the natural expansion of the United States — a logical sequel to the Louisiana Purchase. It became more controversial, however, partly because of Mexican opposition to the annexation and partly because of the conviction in the North that Texas represented an expansion of slavery. John Quincy Adams, a member of the House of Representatives, even thought of the push for Texas annexation as a slaveholder's conspiracy, although I think historians have convincingly proven that there was no conspiracy.
Primary source materials on the Mexican American War are available there (https://www.loc.gov/rr/program/bib/ourdocs/Guadalupe.html).
All land thru history has proven to be owned only by those willing and able to defend it.
If you are unable and/or unwilling to defend your land, or deter others from seeking it,then it is not your land.
All land thru history has proven to be owned only by those willing and able to defend it.
If you are unable and/or unwilling to defend your land, or deter others from seeking it,then it is not your land.
Oh, yeah.
Come try to git my little patch.
The time line shows when they moved into Texas not when they stole their first horse. :D
The circa 1200 bubble has a picture of an Indian holding a rifle on a horse.
Team Sergeant
05-05-2016, 10:01
Yes... we stole texas.
...we stole New Mexico too
...we also stole New Engand
...we stole the mid-atlantic states
...we stole the recipe for kool aid
...we stole lightsaber technolgy form the sith and used it to produce those crazy lights you see underneath of street-racers
...we stole an aliens spaceship and locked him up in a secret prison
We will gladly give ALL of that shit back...
...You just have to come and get it.
Oh they are coming..... by the 10's of millions! And obama is assisting as many as possible. "Undocumented democrats".
Oldrotorhead
05-05-2016, 10:09
The circa 1200 bubble has a picture of an Indian holding a rifle on a horse.
I did see that. I don't know how to respond to you. It doesn't make the time line inaccurate, it's just a poor choice of images.