View Full Version : 81% of Mosques in Survey Promote Violence
http://washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/columnists/2011/06/survey-finds-most-mosques-promote-violent-voices
Survey finds most mosques promote violent voices
By: Diana West 06/11/11 8:05 PM
Examiner Columnist
Read more at the Washington Examiner: http://washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/columnists/2011/06/survey-finds-most-mosques-promote-violent-voices#ixzz1P5CcQxMU
Nobody can afford to miss a new study in the Middle East Quarterly called "Shari'a and Violence in American Mosques."
The authors have amassed a solid bank of peer-reviewed data attesting to the presence and promotion of literature advocating violence in the majority of 100 randomly selected American mosques.
And yes: that's majority of "American" mosques. Not Saudi mosques. Not Pakistani. Not Iranian. Not Turkish. Not even British mosques. American mosques.
There goes that post-9/11 myth -- the one that tells us that American Islam is a happily assimilating creed, wholly different from the aggressive Islam transforming Europe.
The new data collected by Israeli scholar Mordechai Kedar and lawyer David Yerushalmi of the Center for Security Policy (and one of my 18 co-authors on the book "Shariah: The Threat to America") indicate that most American mosques are sanctioning, if not also promoting, the study of material of similar peril.
For me, the six tables of data boil down to two simple and stunning facts. Eighty-one percent of the mosques in the study feature Islamic literature that advocates violence. The authors divide the "violence-positive material" into two categories: 30 percent "moderate" violence, and 51 percent "severe" violence.
Further, 85 percent of the imams recommend this literature - both lay-written and authoritative Islamic texts (not including the Koran or Sunnah, writings said to be words and deeds of Muhammad).
It is a slim 19 percent of the mosques that don't feature such violent materials, and an even slimmer 15 percent of the imams who don't recommend it.
I guess it is in these small fractions where we might find the real "tiny band of extremists" -- perhaps among the followers of the four imams in the 100 mosques who, the authors point out in a footnote, "instructed against the study of violence-positive material."
The authors follow a line of inquiry into whether signs of adherence to Shariah (Islamic law) within the mosque -- for example, sex-segregated prayer, regimented prayer lines, bearded imams -- indicate the presence of inflammatory material.
Take sex-segregated prayer. They found that 95 percent of the mosques where men and women pray separately contain violent literature. At the same time, however, so do 74 percent of the mosques where men and women pray together.
Similarly, 94 percent of the imams presiding over sex-segregated congregations recommend the study of violence-positive material; but so do 80 percent of the imams leading co-ed services. So, yes, Shariah-adherence is a sure-fire indicator, but it's not the only indicator.
No wonder the authors consider the conclusions to be drawn from their survey as "dismal at best." But what will those conclusions be? What should they be? I conclude, just for starters, that there is an urgent need to halt Islamic immigration to ensure that the demographic for more such mosques doesn't grow.
But having dug up the hard data on the textual embrace of Islam-inspired violence within organized Islam in America, the authors almost seem content to throw it all away:
"This survey suggests that, first and foremost, Muslim community leaders must take a more active role in educating their own faith community about the dangers associated with providing a safe haven for violent literature and its promotion...."
The data may be new, but this is the same old mistake we've made since 9/11: outsourcing our response to the ideological threat posed by Islam to "Muslim community leaders" - and usually linked to the Muslim Brotherhood.
This isn't an internal Islamic problem. These alarming data on the promotion of violence within Islam in American mosques are for the wider, still non-Islamic society to address, and before it's too late.
Examiner Columnist Diana West is syndicated nationally by United Media and is the author of "The Death of the Grown-Up: How America's Arrested Development Is Bringing Down Western Civilization."
Read more at the Washington Examiner: http://washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/columnists/2011/06/survey-finds-most-mosques-promote-violent-voices#ixzz1P5CtIPWV
I'd like to see the violent material that's being promoted.
I once read a study that said 1 out of 3 women had been raped. I don't advocate violence being promoted in mosques, nor do I promote rape. But research, especially by organizations with an agenda, has to be backed up.
http://washingtonexaminer.com/opinion/columnists/2011/06/survey-finds-most-mosques-promote-violent-voices
All
Herman Cain's statement regarding Muslims in his cabinet, is making more sense every day....:rolleyes:
"Would you be comfortable appointing a Muslim either in your Cabinet or as a federal judge?" the blogger asked.
"No, I will not," Cain replied. "And here’s why. There is this creeping attempt, there’s this attempt to gradually ease Sharia law and the Muslim faith into our government. It does not belong in our government."
It is a slim 19 percent of the mosques that don't feature such violent materials, and an even slimmer 15 percent of the imams who don't recommend it.
Is Cain wrong? Ask Europe.....jd
I'd like to see the violent material that's being promoted.
It's called the Koran. I've already posted many excerpts.
Team Sergeant
06-12-2011, 11:24
Diana West Examiner Columnist, I like the way this woman thinks.....
Violence, as it pertains to spreading the religion, is central to Islam as Muhammed demonstrated over and over again.
For an Imam/Mullah not to spread this message he would have to ignore major elements of the religion and its parctice.
The 19% or so that are not preaching aggression are actually perverting the religion not the so called 'radicals'.
ArmyStrong
06-12-2011, 15:04
I have been operating under the idea that most Muslims who support violence, specifically the people who actually blow themselves up, are extremely poor and uneducated. I always thought that the leadership of terrorist organizations didn't actually believe the BS they were preaching and just took advantage of the huge amounts of uneducated people in the middle east. IE:why didn't UBL "martyr" himself? Somehow hiding out and smoking weed and watching porn just doesn't scream dedicated to the faith to me.
After doing a little research I came across this: "The Spring 2004 Wilson Quarterly discusses the article “Education, Poverty, and Terrorism: Is There a Causal Connection?” by Alan B. Krueger and Jitka Malecková, in Journal of Economic Perspectives (Fall 2003):
[B]etter-off and better-educated people are more likely to support and participate in terrorist or militant acts than their less fortunate peers. In a December 2001 opinion survey of Palestinians in the West Bank and Gaza Strip, for example, 86 percent of adults who had attended high school supported armed attacks against Israeli targets, compared with 72 percent of their illiterate peers. And outright opposition to such attacks was much higher in the ranks of the illiterate: 26 percent voiced opposition, compared with only 12 percent of better-educated Palestinians.
Many studies of those who actually commit terrorist attacks follow the same general pattern. Of 129 Lebanese Hezbollah militants who became Shahids (martyrs) between 1982 and 1994, only 28 percent came from impoverished families (while 33 percent of all Lebanese were living in poverty). Thirty-three percent of the killers had been to high school, compared with only 23 percent of the general population. A study of 285 Palestinian terrorists who carried out suicide bomb attacks for other groups between 1987 and 2002 found that they were nearly twice as likely to have finished high school and attended college as other Palestinians. Two of the bombers were the sons of millionaires."
According to these studies, the idea that poor, uneducated people are being used is off base. Most American mosques advocating violence supports this even further in that the education level here is much higher (Detroit excluded ;))I am having trouble finding any more recent reports about the relationship between terrorism and education/poverty. Can any of you gentlemen point me in the right direction? I'm here to learn.
Almualla
06-12-2011, 18:07
-Domestic Violence within the Church: The Ugly Truth
http://www.crosswalk.com/news/domestic-violence-within-the-church-the-ugly-truth-11602500.html
-Quran-Burning Pastor Terry Jones .
My unit mission was harmed from his action when we were down in `Stan.
-Westboro Baptist Church.
-Christian fundamentalist bigotry reigns at US Air Force Academy.
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2005/apr2005/acad-a30.shtml
See every religion has dirt, blood, and disgusting aspects of.
Religion is one subject that I dislike to discuss. Specially when you talk to a "dead end -minded" people. Islam has been and still being jacked, from close minded, uneducated, and weak people. Christianity had it share , from the secret basements of churches in -dark ages/ heliocentrism- Europe, all the way to the street of my town that Westboro "church" uses to spew its "God hate everybody" slogan.
It's astonishing, yet very tiring and disappointing to read such continued posts that you feel the writers are so far "out there" on the right-wing fringe, so legendary for the aggressive ignorance of all things subtle and intellectually astute.
I know, it's also a little tricky, difficult. some PS posters on here continued posts about Islam clearly reveal they are not the insufferable lintsnorter everyone with a functioning soul suspects them to be, and is instead on a hugely challenging, but richly rewarding spiritual path, one that requires intense wrangling with the ego's incredible powers of conviction and illusion-making so all of us may learn to see through all manner of charade, false narrative and mental trickery, including but not at all limited to Christian dualism, demonization of the Other, Bill O' Reilly, FOX, even the gloomy myth of sin, all ultimately coming to rest on the fluid idea that we are all, each and every one of us, the divine being we seek, God in microcosm, all dancing in ecstatic, self-recurrent consciousness. Do I have that right?
-www.crosswalk.com
-www.wsws.org
-www.globalresearch.ca
-www.sfgate.com
-www.spiegel.de
-www.plasticbag.org
-Domestic Violence within the Church: The Ugly Truth
http://www.crosswalk.com/news/domestic-violence-within-the-church-the-ugly-truth-11602500.html
-Quran-Burning Pastor Terry Jones .
My unit mission was harmed from his action when we were down in `Stan.
-Westboro Baptist Church.
-Christian fundamentalist bigotry reigns at US Air Force Academy.
http://www.wsws.org/articles/2005/apr2005/acad-a30.shtml
See every religion has dirt, blood, and disgusting aspects of.
Religion is one subject that I dislike to discuss. Specially when you talk to a "dead end -minded" people. Islam has been and still being jacked, from close minded, uneducated, and weak people. Christianity had it share , from the secret basements of churches in -dark ages/ heliocentrism- Europe, all the way to the street of my town that Westboro "church" uses to spew its "God hate everybody" slogan.
It's astonishing, yet very tiring and disappointing to read such continued posts that you feel the writers are so far "out there" on the right-wing fringe, so legendary for the aggressive ignorance of all things subtle and intellectually astute.
I know, it's also a little tricky, difficult. some PS posters on here continued posts about Islam clearly reveal they are not the insufferable lintsnorter everyone with a functioning soul suspects them to be, and is instead on a hugely challenging, but richly rewarding spiritual path, one that requires intense wrangling with the ego's incredible powers of conviction and illusion-making so all of us may learn to see through all manner of charade, false narrative and mental trickery, including but not at all limited to Christian dualism, demonization of the Other, Bill O' Reilly, FOX, even the gloomy myth of sin, all ultimately coming to rest on the fluid idea that we are all, each and every one of us, the divine being we seek, God in microcosm, all dancing in ecstatic, self-recurrent consciousness. Do I have that right?
-www.crosswalk.com
-www.wsws.org
-www.globalresearch.ca
-www.sfgate.com
-www.spiegel.de
-www.plasticbag.org
Please clarify your point.
Please clarify your point.
Yes, please elaborate...
For instance, when have PS posters ever been described as “the insufferable lintsnorter everyone with a functioning soul suspects them to be".
That is, until you did anyways. I do believe my soul functions fine.......:munchin
Almualla,
I wouldn't care a wit about Islam if we were not at war with individuals and organizations that use it's principles to kill non Muslims and attack non Muslim oriented ways of life in the name of their god.
Prove to me that it has been 'jacked'.
Please do not quote abrogated verse or surah as I've a bit of experience with that.
So, please answer this, the actions of Muhammed, in say the writings of Sahih Al-Bukhari, are not valid today?
You believe then that Muhammeds actions are only applicable to history and to the time and place they were enacted in?
Or, as every Muslim scholar has ever written that Muhammed is the 'perfect man' and to be emulated.
I'll give you an example....Muhammed took slaves and used them for sex if they were non Muslim.."What you take with your right hand..."
This is acceptable in Islam as Muhammed did this.
If you choose to bury your head in the sand and believe non Islamic doctrine I say good for you, maybe there is some hope.
However, there is ample doctrinal support for almost any depridation in 'mainstream' Islam.
I note you talk about the Westboro folks like they are mainstream Christians even tho they are nuts challenged everywhere they go to peacefully protest ...unlike the Muslim killings/kidnapping/forced conversion of Christian copts and Church burnings thruout the midleast. Those things are not even investigated by the police in Egypt.
Here are two Muslims echoing that attitude...a woman of stature in Kuwait and an Imam
http://www.meforum.org/2930/muslim-woman-seeks-to-revive-institution-of-sex
kawaishi
06-12-2011, 19:37
I'm not a Christian but I can read and I haven't ever read anything in the bible to align with what you are trying to stick to Christianity.
You and everyone else knows that Christianity doesn't condone domestic violence; however, individuals still smack around their significant others and claim to be Christian.
Westboro Baptist is a group of idiots who don't reflect Jesus' teaching. God plainly states that he finds homosexuality abhorrent in the Old Testament. Then the New Testament strikes a new deal between God and men that changes everything. I'm sure God didn't change his mind about people being gay but he's no longer fire-bombing predominately gay cities. The Christian faith is based on forgiveness of the repentant man by the God who stops using capital punishment to enforce rules. Many Christians, including Bill O'Reilly, publicly and frequently proclaim this group to be wrong and encourage everyone who speaks out against them.
Whether Terry Jones is right or wrong he is an individual who is not following a biblical directive to burn Korans. Not a systemic effort here.
Anti-Semitism is not taught in the bible and is the perverted idea of individuals or subgroups. Jesus was a Jew. Jesus had to die in order for the deal to be done. He knew what was going to happen and, while hanging on the cross in pain, asked God to forgive them because they didn't know what they were doing. Anyone who is an anti-semite holds those beliefs in spite of the bible.
In our own nation Christians publicly and frequently denounce the actions of individuals that you try to associate them with. How many Muslims in the ME can you find to publicly denounce violent jihad?
Yes, please elaborate...
For instance, when have PS posters ever been described as “the insufferable lintsnorter everyone with a functioning soul suspects them to be".
That is, until you did anyways. I do believe my soul functions fine.......:munchin
Well, if he wishes to make any point... he should try doing it without plagiarizing. Google, my friend. How many "lintsnorter" references did he think are on the internet? (this thread is number 1 by the way!) I didn't know QP's were equated to Glenn Beck wannabes... :rolleyes:
I know, it's also a little tricky, difficult. Beck's statements clearly reveal he's not the insufferable lintsnorter everyone with a functioning soul suspects him to be, and is instead on a hugely challenging, but richly rewarding spiritual path, one that requires intense wrangling with the ego's incredible powers of conviction and illusion-making so the student may learn to see through all manner of charade, false narrative and mental trickery, including but not at all limited to Christian dualism, demonization of the Other, Bill O' Reilly, even the gloomy myth of sin, all ultimately coming to rest on the fluid idea that we are all, each and every one of us, the divine being we seek, God in microcosm, all dancing in ecstatic, self-recurrent consciousness. Do I have that right, Glenn?
Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/g/a/2011/03/23/notes032311.DTL&ao=2#ixzz1P7G3Vuze
So my response to him, regardless of his "point"... is STFU and let the grownups talk.
Well, if he wishes to make any point... he should try doing it without plagiarizing. Google, my friend. How many "lintsnorter" references did he think are on the internet? (this thread is number 1 by the way!) I didn't know QP's were equated to Glenn Beck wannabes... :rolleyes:
So my response to him, regardless of his "point"... is STFU and let the grownups talk.
Thanks Head....
Very well then, our Pseudo-intellectual wannabe Mr Almualla is going to try his plagiarizing wares on this thread, at our expense? Bring it on, you mental midget. Amounts to nothing other than another wannabe pozer to me. .....:munchin
incarcerated
06-12-2011, 23:28
Wow. It might be the combination of drugs and English as a second language, but he writes just like the Tarnac Nine:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Coming_Insurrection
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tarnac_9
What the heck is "B.O.H. DUSTY .C.A. " ?
What the heck is "B.O.H. DUSTY .C.A. " ?
Wow, just noticed that - a modification of BOHICA... "bend over, here it comes again" with a QP's handle inserted. I wouldn't mind if this kid never posted again.
The actual article is here (http://www.meforum.org/meq/pdfs/2931.pdf).
Has anyone else noticed that the article makes a significantly different argument than Ms. West says it does in her editorial?
Do the 100 mosques surveyed amount to a 'representative sample' (page 66.) Where is the proof of this characterization in the article itself? A plus/minus of 9.6%; an admission that the selection of mosques was shaped by logistical concerns--so it is no longer a 'random sample'; a projection of the Muslim population in America based upon a source published in 1993. And, to top it all off, an admission that the sampling universe remained unknown and that there may have been bias in the data collection. (This is all on page 68 of the article.)
Does "peer reviewed" mean that the authors' peers agree with the findings or that they agree that the article itself conforms to certain technical specifications? (Is the Middle East Quarterly a journal that is accepted by scholars and specialists in that field in the first place?)
If it is okay to profile some places of religious gathering based upon categories selected by observers, how long will it be before .GOV decides to profile other centers of gathering?
Surgicalcric
06-13-2011, 05:45
<ENTIRE POST>
Your BOHICA comment referencing a respected member of this board and QP will not be tolerated. I suggest you pull your head out of your 4th POC unless you care to be reading posts from the outside...
Questions?
Wonder how this play would go over were it based on Islam? Violent reaction?
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20110613/ap_on_en_ot/us_tony_awards
By JOCELYN NOVECK, AP National Writer Jocelyn Noveck, Ap National Writer – 2 hrs 43 mins ago
NEW YORK – A slew of acclaimed shows were up for Tony Awards in a remarkably competitive year, but a production that wasn't even eligible still managed to cast a shadow — well, shall we make that a web? — over the proceedings.
On a night when the hilariously profane "The Book of Mormon" reigned supreme, the famously troubled "Spider-Man: Turn Off the Dark" got attention both positive and negative at Sunday's Tonys.
(Snip)
At the top of the heap was "Mormon," which has taken Broadway by storm this season. It captured nine awards, including best musical, for its offensive yet good-natured look at two missionaries who arrive in Uganda and get way more than they bargained for, including gun-toting warlords, whole villages infected with HIV and a running gag about maggots in a man's scrotum.
Trey Parker and Matt Stone, creators of the Emmy Award-winning "South Park," collaborated with Robert Lopez, who co-wrote the Tony-winning "Avenue Q." Collecting the best musical prize, Parker said he'd be remiss if he didn't thank his late book co-writer — Joseph Smith, the founder of the Mormon church.
"You did it, Joseph! You got the Tony!" Parker said, looking skyward.
Snip
The irony I find in the blind hate promoted by the peaceful religion of Islam is that these wackjobs manage to kill more muslims than they do infidels.
...or so it seems.
The irony I find in the blind hate promoted by the peaceful religion of Islam is that these wackjobs manage to kill more muslims than they do infidels.Another one NOT too ask or say:
"Professor, I'm more worried about getting killed by a black person than a white one..."
Anyways, I was called/labeled an uncle tom.:eek:
FIDO and stay safe.
Another one NOT too ask or say:
"Professor, I'm more worried about getting killed by a black person than a white one..."
Anyways, I was called/labeled an uncle tom.:eek:
FIDO and stay safe.
Yeah well I think your label is on your left sleeve top brother...sometimes if you don't run with the pack they gotta call you something.
As to Sigba's comments even if the author was off by a large margin it would be very worrisome. My understanding of Islams tenets lead me to believe the author is very close to a real number.
If Imams simply teach the Quran and Muhammeds lifestye/activiteis then they will teach a violent message directly or in the abstract.
incarcerated
06-14-2011, 16:21
An excerpt from commentator Robert Spencer’s take on the same study:
http://www.humanevents.com/article.php?print=yes&id=44147
...Terrorism expert Yehudit Barsky affirmed the same thing in 2005, saying that 80% of the mosques in this country “have been radicalized by Saudi money and influence.” The Center for Religious Freedom in 2005 found a massive distribution of hateful jihadist and Islamic supremacist material in mosques in this country. The Mapping Sharia Project’s 2008 study likewise found that upwards of 80% of mosques in America were preaching hatred of Jews and Christians and the necessity ultimately to impose Islamic rule.
And in June 2008, federal investigators found that the Islamic Saudi Academy in Virginia, despite promises to stop teaching such material, was still using books that advocated that apostates from Islam be executed and that it was permissible for Muslims to kill and seize the property of “polytheists.”
What is most arresting about these studies is their unanimity. Although each was conducted independently of the others, they all came to the same conclusion: that around three-quarters of mosques in this country are teaching what amounts to sedition. And yet the mainstream media has shown about as much interest in the new survey as they did in the others—that is, none at all....
An excerpt from commentator Robert Spencer’s take on the same study:And like Ms. West, Mr. Spencer misrepresented the study's findings.
MOO, if people want to investigate this issue correctly, they're going to have to put aside their predetermined conclusions, roll up their sleeves, and spend the next several years getting good data.
incarcerated
06-14-2011, 23:34
MOO, if people want to investigate this issue correctly, they're going to have to put aside their predetermined conclusions, roll up their sleeves, and spend the next several years getting good data.
Do you really think that that level of rigor is called for here? I certainly don’t see CNN or MSNBC going to that effort when they quote scientific studies. Why apply the standards of academia (IMO, a hotbed of bias) here? And given the hundreds of articles I’ve read over the last 9+ years (one doesn‘t have to look much further than post # 8 of this thread), do you really think that the 80% figure is out of line? The religion has articulated itself to we kuffar fairly well.
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/law-and-order/8570506/Police-covered-up-violent-campaign-to-turn-London-area-Islamic.html
Police 'covered up' violent campaign to turn London area 'Islamic'
Police have been accused of “covering up” a campaign of abuse, threats and violence aimed at “Islamicising” an area of London.
By Andrew Gilligan
8:10AM BST 12 Jun 2011
Victims say that officers in the borough of Tower Hamlets have ignored or downplayed outbreaks of hate crime, and suppressed evidence implicating Muslims in them, because they fear being accused of racism.
The claims come as four Tower Hamlets Muslims were jailed for at least 19 years for attacking a local white teacher who gave religious studies lessons to Muslim girls.
The Sunday Telegraph has uncovered more than a dozen other cases in Tower Hamlets where both Muslims and non-Muslims have been threatened or beaten for behaviour deemed to breach fundamentalist “Islamic norms.”
One victim, Mohammed Monzur Rahman, said he was left partially blind and with a dislocated shoulder after being attacked by a mob in Cannon Street Road, Shadwell, for smoking during the Muslim holy month of Ramadan last year.
“Two guys stopped me in the street and asked me why I was smoking,” he said. “I just carried on, and before I knew another dozen guys came and jumped me. The next thing I knew, I was waking up in hospital.”
“He reported it to the police and they just said they couldn’t track anyone down and there were no witnesses,” said Ansar Ahmed Ullah, a local anti-extremism campaigner who has advised Mr Rahman. “But there is CCTV in that street and it is lined with shops and people.”
Teachers in several local schools have told The Sunday Telegraph that they feel “under pressure” from local Muslim extremists, who have mounted campaigns through both parents and pupils – and, in one case, through another teacher - to enforce the compulsory wearing of the veil for Muslim girls. “It was totally orchestrated,” said one teacher. “The atmosphere became extremely unpleasant for a while, with constant verbal aggression from both the children and some parents against the head over this issue.”
One teacher at the Bigland Green primary school, Nicholas Kafouris, last year took the council to an employment tribunal, saying he was forced out of his job for complaining that Muslim pupils were engaging in racist and anti-Semitic bullying and saying they supported terrorism. Mr Kafouris lost his case, though the school did admit that insufficient action had been taken against the behaviour of some pupils. The number of assaults on teachers in Tower Hamlets resulting in exclusions has more than doubled from 190 in 2007/8 to 383 in 2008/9, the latest available year, though not all are necessarily race-related.
Tower Hamlets’ gay community has become a particular target of extremists. Homophobic crimes in the borough have risen by 80 per cent since 2007/8, and by 21 per cent over the last year, a period when there was a slight drop in London as a whole.
Last year, a mob of 30 young Muslims stormed a local gay pub, the George and Dragon, beating and abusing patrons. Many customers of the pub told The Sunday Telegraph that they have been attacked and harassed by local Muslim youths. In 2008 a 20-year-old student, Oli Hemsley, was left permanently paralysed after an attack by a group of young Muslims outside the pub. Only one of his assailants has been caught and jailed.
Even during meetings of the local council, prominent supporters of Tower Hamlets’ controversial directly-elected mayor, Lutfur Rahman – dropped by the Labour Party for his links to Islamic fundamentalism - have persistently targeted gay councillors with homophobic abuse and intimidation from the public gallery.
The Labour leader, Josh Peck, was attacked with animal noises and cries of “Unnatural acts! Unnatural acts!” when he rose to speak. The Conservative leader, Peter Golds, was repeatedly heckled as “Mrs Golds” and a “poofter”.
Mr Golds said: “If that happened in a football stadium, arrests would have taken place. I have complained, twice, to the police, and have heard nothing. A Labour colleague waited three hours at the police station before being told that nothing would be done. The police are afraid of being accused of Islamophobia. Another Labour councillor said that the Met is now the reverse of what it must have been like in the 1970s, with a complete lack of interest when white people make complaints of harassment and hatred.”
In February this year, dozens of stickers appeared across Tower Hamlets quoting the Koran, declaring the borough a “gay-free zone” and stating that “verily Allah is severe in punishment.”
The Sunday Telegraph has learned that during a routine stop-and-search at the time police found a young Muslim man with a number of the stickers in his possession. He was released without charge on the advice of the Crown Prosecution Service. Police also had CCTV images of a second unidentified Muslim youth posting the stickers at a local railway station, but refused to release the pictures for several weeks.
Peter Tatchell, the gay human rights campaigner, said: “The police said no-one was allowed to talk publicly about this because they didn’t want to upset the Muslim community. We’ve made very clear the difference between the Muslim community as a whole and these particular fundamentalists, and the fact that the police wouldn’t publicly say what they knew was an absolute disgrace.”
When the CCTV footage was finally released, in early April, the culprit was quickly identified as 18-year-old Mohammed Hasnath, who last week pleaded guilty to a public order offence and was fined £100. Jack Gilbert, of the Rainbow Hamlets gay group, said a more serious charge should have been brought. “The vast majority of the community saw the material as threatening, but the police were not willing to accept it as threatening,” he said.
Hasnath’s “interests” on his Facebook page include Khalid Yasin, a hate preacher who describes Jews as “filth” and teaches that homosexuals must be killed. Yasin has spoken at least four times since 2007 at the East London Mosque, Tower Hamlets’ most prominent Muslim institution. Although the mosque claims to be against extremism, discrimination, and violence, it has hosted dozens of hate, extremist or terrorist preachers and also hosted a “Spot The Fag” contest.
In the same week that it issued a press release condemning the anti-gay stickers, the mosque was also due to host a “gala dinner” with Uthman Lateef, a homophobic hate preacher.
The mosque is controlled by a fundamentalist group, the Islamic Forum of Europe, which says that it is dedicated to changing the “very infrastructure of society, its institutions, its culture, its political order and its creed ... from ignorance to Islam.”
The IFE’s community affairs co-ordinator, Azad Ali, is chairman of the Muslim Safety Forum, an organisation officially recognised by the Met as its “principal [liaison] body in relation to Muslim community safety.” Mr Golds said: “This relationship may explain the police’s feebleness.” The IFE also has close links to the Tower Hamlets mayor, Mr Rahman.
There is no suggestion that any mosque official has been personally involved in any act of violence or intimidation. However, in an email obtained by The Sunday Telegraph, one IFE activist, Abu Talha, used the name of the group to threaten a local Muslim woman who ran a dating agency.
“I am asking you kindly to stop these activities as it goes against the teachings of Islam,” he wrote. “Let me remind you that I have a huge network of brothers and sisters who would be willing to help me take this further…If by tomorrow you haven’t changed your mind … then the campaign will begin.” The dating agency has now closed and the woman has left the area.
Mr Ahmed Ullah said: “There has been a gradual increase in these kinds of attacks, that’s for sure.” A spokesman for the Metropolitan Police said: “When any allegation of crime is made to us, we investigate appropriately. We will always take action against hate crime in accordance with, and within the confines of, the law.”
Westboro Baptist is a group of idiots who don't reflect Jesus' teaching....
Anti-Semitism is not taught in the bible and is the perverted idea of individuals or subgroups. Jesus was a Jew. Jesus had to die in order for the deal to be done. He knew what was going to happen and, while hanging on the cross in pain, asked God to forgive them because they didn't know what they were doing. Anyone who is an anti-semite holds those beliefs in spite of the bible.
In our own nation Christians publicly and frequently denounce the actions of individuals that you try to associate them with. How many Muslims in the ME can you find to publicly denounce violent jihad?
Interesting points.
Being a non-Bibile student I did study Theology at Boston College in order to better understand, and work with Catholic Church (Vatican) Leaders and USAid directors in Africa, (Boston, max per diem, civilian clothing allowance, etc., too cool), but I digress....
What is taught in most religious circles, is the continuation and speculation of given and limited information, be it, Christian, Judahism, or Islam. Rarely is religion taught from a historical perspective.
If God is the same before, today and tomorrow, then we call Him Omnipotent and Omnipresent, or at least His influence is. If one taught of and fortold of God's plan, His reason and purpose for His creation, us, His children, then they were called, (Old Testament), children of God and/or followers of God. If one taught the purpose of the coming of "Christ", that His followers and church were called Christians, having said that, would Adam, Moses, Noah, and many of the Old Testement Prophets were described as "christian", by definition, be the followers of God?
Old testament prophets taught baptism, taking upon them the name of God, follow Him, etc. John the Baptist was sought out by Jesus in order for him to perform the Savior's baptism. Why? Could it have been performed much closer to where Jesus lived and taught by someone else? What of authority to baptize? Who can perform such work? How does one get authority from God? Why did Jesus need baptism? Does not the ordinance represent the washing of one that is filthy?
What chaps my ass more than anything else is, someone says they attended a college or university and a "degree" is issued in order for someone to begin preaching God's word.
Really?
The Westboro Baptist crowd can go pound sand.
What gave the school establishments, or states the power to issue God's power to man? If the power of God is given to man, what is it called? If God is real, if He is the same today as He was yesterday, then why has he left us alone without the living prophets to at least guide us as he did years ago? If a real prophet of God showed up today, how would we recognize him? What would he say or do?
Anti-Semitism is the bastard views of post Christiandom popularity, and the segregation of Arab nations, (tribal in part) based on trade, money, politics, circa 250-1200 AD. We got to blame someone for our problems, banking, trade, economics, then why not cousin Epstein.
The introduction of Islam in 8th century only clouded the waters that much more.
Jesus' atonement, the taking upon the sins on the world was performed in the Garden of Gethsemane, it is there that he felt the greatest pain, to bleed from every pour, alone, being tempted. His later suffering by the hands of interrogators, the beatings, were nothing compared to the suffering in the Garden, many miss that small bit of intel. His death upon the cross was simply the nail in the coffin, so to speak. No one could take His life, he was not killed by the hands of others, he could have at any point saved Himself, but he gave His life willingly as a gift, and all the benefits of doing so as well as the ressurection broke the bonds of death, both spiritual and physical.
What also is a deciding point in finding a solution to this very diverse and critical time we all live in, is the ability to talk of and speak to religious discourse and thought. We are not allowed to speak of Islam as anything other than peaceful. We are only allowed to speak of Christianity as radical, and Judaism as old fashioned. Science is viewed as Godless, and I don't know what the hell I'm talking about.
Sitting quietly, listening to the still small voice, while reloading.
...........Peter Tatchell, the gay human rights campaigner, said: “The police said no-one was allowed to talk publicly about this because they didn’t want to upset the Muslim community. We’ve made very clear the difference between the Muslim community as a whole and these particular fundamentalists, and the fact that the police wouldn’t publicly say what they knew was an absolute disgrace.” ................
The Money Quote.
Islam is the sea in which the terrorist shark swims. It aids and comforts the shark on it's journey. The deeper the sea the larger the shark can grow.
The water is pretty deep in Tower Hamlets.
Muslims are beating up other Muslims and non-Muslims and the police don't want to say it because it would upset the Muslim community? Hmmmm, reads to me like the Muslim majority in the area are OK with the beatings - or at least don't want to get beat themselves.
the most productive audience for coversion (or as they say reversion)to Islam is in our prison system among the black population....the imbedded strain of violence in Islam appeals to convicts as does the "in your face Muslim" aspect that can be acted out in a great display of anti US/non comformity...a great twofer.
Bukhari(a chronicler of Muhameds life, a companion)..."and we waited at first light to hear the call to prayer...if they prayed we would pray...if the were silent (non Muslim believers) we would attack the caravan"
Many present day Muslim criminals refer to robbing banks, violent crime as "attacking the Kafir caravan"...great perp appeal as it was/is condoned by tenets of the religion.
Violence-Positive Texts Incubate Jihad in
Mosques; Congress Needs to Ensure They Do Not
Do the Same in Federal Prisons
Washington, DC, June 13, 2011 – Chairman Peter King has just announced the witnesses who will appear on June 15th before the House Homeland Security Committee as part of a series of hearings on radicalization of the Muslim-American community. The Center for Security Policy respectfully suggests that one of the lines of questioning for the past and present law enforcement officials* called to testify about “The Threat of Muslim-American Radicalization in U.S. Prisons” must be an inquiry into permitted print and video materials that may contribute to jihadist recruitment and indoctrination inside federal penal institutions.
Such materials were used in a new peer-reviewed study published last week in the highly respected journal Middle East Quarterly (MEQ) as indicators of jihadist sentiment and proselytization in a random sample of 100 American mosques. This study, which is entitled Shari’a and Violence in American Mosques, involved the collection of empirical data through repeated on-site investigations over several years. It established that 81% of U.S. mosques had the cited materials on the premises. The study also found that in over 84% of the mosques surveyed, the imam recommended texts advocating violent jihad.
The seven texts featured in the MEQ analysis are illustrative of the body of hate-mongering, supremacist literature and films used by shariah-adherent Muslims to inculcate in targeted populations their call to violent jihad:
1. Al-Nawawi's Riyad-us Saliheen (Gardens of the Righteous)
2. Maududi's Jihad in Islam
3. al-Misri's Umdat al-Salik (The Reliance of the Traveller)
4. Maududi's Tafhim al-Qur’an (The Meaning of the Qur’an)
5. Saabiq's Fiqh-us-Sunnah (The Book on Acts of Worship)
6. Tafsir Ibn Kathir
7. Qutb's Ma’alim fi’l-Tariq (Milestones)
[Reformatted]
Do you really think that that level of rigor is called for here?
I certainly don’t see CNN or MSNBC going to that effort when they quote scientific studies.
Why apply the standards of academia (IMO, a hotbed of bias) here?
And given the hundreds of articles I’ve read over the last 9+ years (one doesn‘t have to look much further than post # 8 of this thread), do you really think that the 80% figure is out of line?
The religion has articulated itself to we kuffar fairly well.
Answers follow.
Yes. If we're going to fight a multi generational war of civilizations and to use tools that are against many of our core principles, we may as well take the time to do our due diligence in a way that will stand the test of time. If one were to spend time looking at the types of justifications Americans have used for previous public and national security policy choices of the previous centuries, there have been some profoundly embarrassing inconsistencies. These mistakes undermine this nation's credibility to this day. The history of GWOT can an example of America doing the right thing for the right reasons if we as a nation have the will to make that choice. To paraphrase the late Robert B. Parker, is GWOT about who we are at least as much as it is about our enemies.
To put it politely, so what? Just because many media outlets prefer to editorialize than to report does not mean we should follow their footsteps.
MOO, saying there is bias is like saying there is air. While objectivity is a construct, that doesn't mean we should not do our best to meet that goal with intensity and with rigor.
I'm going to take with a sixty pound bag of salt any statistical study where the sample size is woefully small and/or the researches themselves point out that their sample is not random.
It remains fashionable to extoll the virtues of the founding fathers and yet we seem too eager to cast away the Enlightenment that inspired them.
Looking on the bright side maybe we'll get more Muslim recruits with the removal od DADT