View Full Version : Philly Police Harass, Threaten to Shoot Man Legally Carrying Gun
olhamada
05-17-2011, 08:20
http://www.foxbusiness.com/on-air/stossel/blog/2011/05/16/philly-police-harass-threaten-shoot-man-legally-carrying-gun
Even though he was "legal" - yet another example of a lack of SA. Almost lost his life over his "rights". :confused:
http://www.foxbusiness.com/on-air/stossel/blog/2011/05/16/philly-police-harass-threaten-shoot-man-legally-carrying-gun
Even though he was "legal" - yet another example of a lack of SA. Almost lost his life over his "rights". :confused:
Another example of a cop escalating a situation because he does not know the law.
Good thing it was recorded.
So now who do you believe? The cop or the civilian? The cop says the guys hands were in his pockets - the guys says they were not.
The cops seemed to have a problem with the recording also - but at least they didn't smash the device.
Roguish Lawyer
05-17-2011, 08:38
I hope this guy sued the city. Totally outrageous.
By the audio alone, I would agree that the officers were unprofessional. In NC, a CCW permit holder must state that they have the permit and where the fire arm is located upon contact with an officer. NC is also an "open carry" state. My personal SOP on encountering someone in these situations is to ask them to allow me to take control of the weapon until the end of the enounter. One gun (mine) is enough in a situation. I have never had anyone refuse to allow this and have done it numerous times. At the end of the encounter, I always give them the firearm back. If it is a SA, I give it to them with the magazine out and the slide locked back. If it is a revolver, the rounds are in one hand and the cylinder is out. I then allow them to leave the scene first, with instructions to wait until they are in another area to reload their firearm. This method has worked for me for the past 13 years.
My wife and I are both also CCW holders and she has been well rehearsed in what to say and do if she were ever to be stopped by an officer. I don't know about PA, but in NC, when an officer runs someone's license or registration in NCIC, the information cmes back whether that person has a NC CCW permit or not, so the officer knows if you have one before he ever comes up to your door.
My personal SOP on encountering someone in these situations is to ask them to allow me to take control of the weapon until the end of the enounter. One gun (mine) is enough in a situation. I have never had anyone refuse to allow this and have done it numerous times. At the end of the encounter, I always give them the firearm back. If it is a SA, I give it to them with the magazine out and the slide locked back. If it is a revolver, the rounds are in one hand and the cylinder is out. I then allow them to leave the scene first, with instructions to wait until they are in another area to reload their firearm. This method has worked for me for the past 13 years.
That description sounds like a very reasonable and very professional manner of handling the situation.
Any suggestions that you might share with civilians who ever find themselves in this situation would be appreciated - at least by me. PM or otherwise. Thank you.
Wow, that's some serious case of jumping the gun on the LEO's.
Sgt. "I dunno what I'm doing" should definitely be assigned to a desk job, fellas like him don't need to be on the streets.
I don't have a lifetime experience, I've only been in the law enforcement field for 7 years. But I've seen people like him, I've found myself working with them and not only I consider them a threat waiting to come true, but also bad image for all.
Note: why should Mr. Fiorino sue the city? Why should taxpayers refund him for the police officer's wrongdoing and lack of professionalism? :confused: If legal action needs to be started, let it be against him not the whole community.
Utah Bob
05-17-2011, 11:28
Philadelphia PD has had internal problems for a long time.
olhamada
05-17-2011, 11:29
Quis custodiet ipsos custodes? Anybody remember Robin Sage and 1LT Tomeny?
....or the US Army Ranger with a CCP shot to death by the 4 LEOs outside the Costco in Las Vegas last year?
Surgicalcric
05-17-2011, 12:23
..One gun (mine) is enough in a situation...
I feel the same when talking with the majority of LEO... :D
Crip
Philly Police Harass, Threaten to Shoot Man Legally Carrying Gun
They didn't tell you he was wearing a Cowboys jersey with the number 8 on it, did they. :D :D
Richard :munchin
olhamada
05-17-2011, 12:32
They didn't tell you he was wearing a Cowboys jersey with the number 8 on it, did they. :D :D
Richard :munchin
HA! :D My sentiments exactly.
I feel the same when talking with the majority of LEO... :D
Crip
Daaang gents, it feels goood to receive sympathy... :D:D:D
Open-Carry Experiment Shows Cops Don't Know Their Own Gun Laws
Read more: http://www.philadelphiaweekly.com/news-and-opinion/Open-Carry-Experiment-Shows-Cops-Dont-Know-Their-Own-Gun-Laws-121989564.html#ixzz1MhQyFb8t
".......The other factor contributing to cops’ confusion is that according to state law, a license is needed to carry openly in the city, but it’s not required in the rest of the commonwealth. Because of that, officers don’t technically have cause to detain an open carrier without reasonable articulable suspicion of a crime having been committed. But in Philly, because a license is needed, law enforcement officers contend they have authority to stop people to make sure they’re legit. Gun-rights activists take issue with this, saying probable cause is still required for a police stop. They liken it to driving: Officers aren’t legally allowed to stop everyone who is driving a car to ensure they’re licensed, unless a violation has been committed............."
The fact he is a gun rights activist will change some peoples mind - not mine.
Near the end
".........Lt. Lisa King, head of the department’s Gun Permits Unit, said her division is now working to amend language on a supplemental sheet accompanying the firearms license application that says a licensee must conceal. The wording on is old, she concedes. King, who attended the rally, says didn’t even know the practice was legal before it was brought to her attention............"
Wonder how that little bit will play out in an open carry state?
That description sounds like a very reasonable and very professional manner of handling the situation.
Any suggestions that you might share with civilians who ever find themselves in this situation would be appreciated - at least by me. PM or otherwise. Thank you.
If you are a CCW holder:
1. As soon as an officer approaches, even before he first speaks to you, keep your hands where they can be seen and inform him that you have a CCW whether you have your firearm with you or not. In NC, this is actually part of the law and responsibility of the CCW carrier.
2. If you have your firearm, tell the officer where it is (holstered on your hip, in the glove compartment, between the seats, etc.). KEEP YOUR HANDS WHERE THEY CAN BE SEEN! Never reach for the firearm while saying "it is right here." NEVER APPEAR TO BE REACHING FOR SOMETHING UNSEEN BY THE OFFICER. This includes while the officer is approaching your vehicle.
3. Follow the officer's instructions. Some will ask you to exit the vehicle and either leave the weapon where it is or do like I do and ask to take possession of the firearm. Do not attempt to give the firearm to the officer, let the officer take it from you. Your hands should never come in proximity of the weapon.
4. No matter what the stop is for, maintain your composure and a cooperative, respectful attitude. This does not mean that you have to give permission to have your vehicle searched if you do not want to. That is a seperate issue from the legal possession of a firearm. You can decline the request for search consent while still cooperating within CCW law constraints.
Law enforcement, like any other occupation, has those who may specialize in certain areas while being relatively unfamiliar with other areas. The fact that some officers are unfamiliar with some firearms laws is indicative of that. Some officers can barely qualify every year or semi-annually, whichever their department requires. Some officers are experts at juvenile law, some with domestic law, others with traffic or firearms, etc.
Each officer tends to gravitate toward that which interests them the most. It is unreasonable to expect an individual officer to be familiar with the hundreds, or even thousands, of laws which may apply in their specific jurisdiction, not to mention the fact that these laws tend to change or be amended every election cycle. Most departments tend to focus training on the issues they view as the most important at the time. Usually, these are drugs; break-ins; assaults; homicides; or whatever the citizenry is complaining about the most at the time.
Some departments restrict the actions of their officers, compartmentalizing the training and experience. Traffic units only deal with traffic; warrants are only written by detectives; patrol only answers calls and take initial reports; etc. (fortunately, my department is not like this).
In my experience, it is easy to understand how some officers may not have been familiar with PA's firearms laws. It is not, however, an excuse to act unprofessionally. I am sure there were other officers on the shift who were familiar and could have answered questions if they had been asked.
................Law enforcement, like any other occupation, has those who may specialize in certain areas while being relatively unfamiliar with other areas. The fact that some officers are unfamiliar with some firearms laws is indicative of that.r.................
If the local cops don't understand the city's gun laws how the hell do they expect a civilian to understand them?
I can understand a cop not being up on minor local laws but guns and drugs?
How can local government expect to enforce laws if the cops don't know them?
longrange1947
05-18-2011, 17:40
I have been stopped in three seperate occasions at "check points", you know the drunk driving types. Each time, I immediately declare I am a licensee and indicate if am armed and the location of the weapon. Twice I was carrying and once I was going to an occasion that would have been questionable as to my weapon on property in my car so left it home. In all occasions the LEO, once State, twice Fayettevilles finest, were well aware fo the proceedures and nop[roblems were incountered.
I firmly believe the difference in the "gun culture" of ther area. Most in Philly are anti gun, most in NC are not.
If the local cops don't understand the city's gun laws how the hell do they expect a civilian to understand them?
I can understand a cop not being up on minor local laws but guns and drugs?
How can local government expect to enforce laws if the cops don't know them?
Police are often trained in only specific aspects of certain laws, including gun laws. Sometimes the training may be flawed. We are all aware of varying interpretations of the 2nd Amendment. IMO, it is written in plain english and requires no interpretation, however there are attorneys who make a living trying to explain to everyone else what it means.
Many officers, law enforcement administrations, attorneys, and elected officials interpret laws according to their experiences, political ideologies or by what someone else has told them. To take something simple as an explanation, I don't know how many times I have had to explain the reasons that some speeding violations require one to go to court and others can pay a fine, to other officers. They don't deal with traffic violations that much and often get confused. The same goes for weapon violations, whether it be a firearm or a shuriken. If you don't have that much experience dealing with it, or that area is not your niche, then you may not know.
Police are often trained in only specific aspects of certain laws, .........
But the cops like to use the line "Ignorance of the law is no excuse" on people they are arresting.
So Joe Civilian can get a gun pointed at him and thrown on the ground and the excuse is "Well, we can't be expected to know all the laws."
This line of an excuse sounds like Bull Shit. If a cop is carring a gun the least he should be expected to know are the local gun laws.
Sad, Sad, Sad when civilains jump through all the hoops to get a gun license and end up knowing more about local open carry that the cops do.
Maybe cops should be required to go through the same course civilians do.
What does a civilian get for flashing a gun? Maybe that Philly cop should be charged with that.
Snaquebite
05-18-2011, 18:24
In the summer time I don't always CC, I may go somewhere, grab my piece and slap it on my hip. Very OC....I've had several encounters with both Cumberland and Hoke Sheriffs and Fay Police where they observed me in a parking lot or store and never blinked an eye..... I do believe sometimes perception can have a lot to do with it. Could be wrong.
Edit: None of those encounters were on the Murch or Bragg Blvd.....
It is unreasonable to expect an individual officer to be familiar with the hundreds, or even thousands, of laws which may apply in their specific jurisdiction, not to mention the fact that these laws tend to change or be amended every election cycle.
Yet, the citizen (read: taxpayer/employer) is told that "Ignorance of the law is no excuse". We are all criminals. They just have to figure out which law we broke. The Nuremberg Laws were less intrusive.
Pat
Snaquebite
05-18-2011, 18:31
Yet, the citizen (read: taxpayer/employer) is told that "Ignorance of the law is no excuse". We are all criminals. They just have to figure out which law we broke. The Nuremberg Laws were less intrusive.
Pat
Have to agree with that to an extent. This is a law that every cop everywhere should be familiar with...I can see them not being aware of some obscure ordinances, IMHO this is very different.
If you are a CCW holder:
1. As soon as an officer approaches, even before he first speaks to you, keep your hands where they can be seen and inform him that you have a CCW whether you have your firearm with you or not. In NC, this is actually part of the law and responsibility of the CCW carrier.
2. If you have your firearm, tell the officer where it is (holstered on your hip, in the glove compartment, between the seats, etc.). KEEP YOUR HANDS WHERE THEY CAN BE SEEN! Never reach for the firearm while saying "it is right here." NEVER APPEAR TO BE REACHING FOR SOMETHING UNSEEN BY THE OFFICER. This includes while the officer is approaching your vehicle.
3. Follow the officer's instructions. Some will ask you to exit the vehicle and either leave the weapon where it is or do like I do and ask to take possession of the firearm. Do not attempt to give the firearm to the officer, let the officer take it from you. Your hands should never come in proximity of the weapon.
4. No matter what the stop is for, maintain your composure and a cooperative, respectful attitude. This does not mean that you have to give permission to have your vehicle searched if you do not want to. That is a seperate issue from the legal possession of a firearm. You can decline the request for search consent while still cooperating within CCW law constraints.
Law enforcement, like any other occupation, has those who may specialize in certain areas while being relatively unfamiliar with other areas. The fact that some officers are unfamiliar with some firearms laws is indicative of that. Some officers can barely qualify every year or semi-annually, whichever their department requires. Some officers are experts at juvenile law, some with domestic law, others with traffic or firearms, etc.
Each officer tends to gravitate toward that which interests them the most. It is unreasonable to expect an individual officer to be familiar with the hundreds, or even thousands, of laws which may apply in their specific jurisdiction, not to mention the fact that these laws tend to change or be amended every election cycle. Most departments tend to focus training on the issues they view as the most important at the time. Usually, these are drugs; break-ins; assaults; homicides; or whatever the citizenry is complaining about the most at the time.
Some departments restrict the actions of their officers, compartmentalizing the training and experience. Traffic units only deal with traffic; warrants are only written by detectives; patrol only answers calls and take initial reports; etc. (fortunately, my department is not like this).
In my experience, it is easy to understand how some officers may not have been familiar with PA's firearms laws. It is not, however, an excuse to act unprofessionally. I am sure there were other officers on the shift who were familiar and could have answered questions if they had been asked.
rdret1- thank you for taking the time and making the effort to share such a succinct yet thorough explanation to my inquiry.
I travel quite a bit and travel through NC at least 3 or 4 times a year - we stay in Charlotte, Black Mountain and Asheville. We have never had a problem but it is always prudent to listen to the advice of a professional.
Thanks again.
But the cops like to use the line "Ignorance of the law is no excuse" on people they are arresting.
So Joe Civilian can get a gun pointed at him and thrown on the ground and the excuse is "Well, we can't be expected to know all the laws."
This line of an excuse sounds like Bull Shit. If a cop is carring a gun the least he should be expected to know are the local gun laws.
Sad, Sad, Sad when civilains jump through all the hoops to get a gun license and end up knowing more about local open carry that the cops do.
Maybe cops should be required to go through the same course civilians do.
What does a civilian get for flashing a gun? Maybe that Philly cop should be charged with that.
Even attorneys and judges have paralegals that do research for them when they are unfamiliar with a certain law or case. Police officers (for the most part) do not have law degrees and must have a general familiarization with almost the same laws that attorneys and judges do. It may sound like BS to you but you should go on a ride-along some time.
Many laws are very confusing. For instance, many officers get confused with the NC Statutory Rape law, which reads as follows:
§ 14-27.7A. Statutory rape or sexual offense of person who is 13, 14, or 15 years old.
(a) A defendant is guilty of a Class B1 felony if the defendant engages in vaginal intercourse or a sexual act with another person who is 13, 14, or 15 years old and the defendant is at least six years older than the person, except when the defendant is lawfully married to the person.
(b) A defendant is guilty of a Class C felony if the defendant engages in vaginal intercourse or a sexual act with another person who is 13, 14, or 15 years old and the defendant is more than four but less than six years older than the person, except when the defendant is lawfully married to the person. (1995, c. 281, s. 1.)
Juvenile officers would be able to explain it quite well, the average officer who does not deal with juvenile offenses often can get confused with it.
North Carolina Concealed Weapon statute is as follows:
§ 14‑269. Carrying concealed weapons.
(a) It shall be unlawful for any person willfully and intentionally to carry concealed about his person any bowie knife, dirk, dagger, slung shot, loaded cane, metallic knuckles, razor, shurikin, stun gun, or other deadly weapon of like kind, except when the person is on the person's own premises.
(a1) It shall be unlawful for any person willfully and intentionally to carry concealed about his person any pistol or gun except in the following circumstances:
(1) The person is on the person's own premises.
(2) The deadly weapon is a handgun, and the person has a concealed handgun permit issued in accordance with Article 54B of this Chapter or considered valid under G.S. 14‑415.24.
(3) The deadly weapon is a handgun and the person is a military permittee as defined under G.S. 14‑415.10(2a) who provides to the law enforcement officer proof of deployment as required under G.S. 14‑415.11(a).
(b) This prohibition shall not apply to the following persons:
(1) Officers and enlisted personnel of the armed forces of the United States when in discharge of their official duties as such and acting under orders requiring them to carry arms and weapons;
(2) Civil and law enforcement officers of the United States;
(3) Officers and soldiers of the militia and the National Guard when called into actual service;
(4) Officers of the State, or of any county, city, town, or company police agency charged with the execution of the laws of the State, when acting in the discharge of their official duties;
(5) Sworn law‑enforcement officers, when off‑duty, provided that an officer does not carry a concealed weapon while consuming alcohol or an unlawful controlled substance or while alcohol or an unlawful controlled substance remains in the officer's body.
(b1) It is a defense to a prosecution under this section that:
(1) The weapon was not a firearm;
(2) The defendant was engaged in, or on the way to or from, an activity in which he legitimately used the weapon;
(3) The defendant possessed the weapon for that legitimate use; and
(4) The defendant did not use or attempt to use the weapon for an illegal purpose.
The burden of proving this defense is on the defendant.
(b2) It is a defense to a prosecution under this section that:
(1) The deadly weapon is a handgun;
(2) The defendant is a military permittee as defined under G.S. 14‑415.10(2a); and
(3) The defendant provides to the court proof of deployment as defined under G.S. 14‑415.10(3a).
(c) Any person violating the provisions of subsection (a) of this section shall be guilty of a Class 2 misdemeanor. Any person violating the provisions of subsection (a1) of this section shall be guilty of a Class 2 misdemeanor for the first offense. A second or subsequent offense is punishable as a Class I felony.
Not every police officer or citizen knows that it is illegal to carry a sling shot outside of your property concealed.
North Carolina General Statutes consists of 168 chapters. Many with subsections from A - G. The chapters most relevant to LEO's are: 14 - Criminal Law; 15 - Criminal Procedure; Ch 18 - Alcohol; Ch 20 - Traffic; Ch 50B - Domestic violence; and Ch 90 Art 5 - NC Controlled Substances Act. Each one is a very thick BOOK unto itself, written in legalese. Then you have whatever local ordinances in effect in the city or county, which is another book. There being no excuses, realistically, how much of that do you believe any one individual is going to be familiar with on a particular day?
That would be like expecting the average soldier to know everything from AR 1-32 to AR 930-5, when you are doing good if you can get them to get AR 670-1 right.
The Nuremberg Laws were less intrusive.
YGBSM.
Richard :munchin
YGBSM.
Richard :munchin
Broadly speaking, I'm not. I'm saying that the whole population is targeted, not just one minority segment.
Here, if the government outlaws incandescent light bulbs and mandates curlycue florescent bulbs and then, when the curlycue fails, I toss it in the trash, I've broken the law because of the HAZMAT laws. You'll point out that that hasn't happened, but it will.
How'd the Central Valley fair with the environmental law protecting the Delta Smelt? What would have happened to a citizen/taxpayer who poisoned the fish so he could water his crops? You lived there. What would you have done to save your livelihood?
There are many more.
Pat
It is better to eat humble pie and live to talk about it, (that is, in any situation involving an active duty LEO), than try to prove a point and wind up like this poor chap, ultimately arrested and in jeopardy of losing his CCW, and potentially DOA had things gone further south.
A little preachy but my .02 nevertheless...
:o
While I can appreciate your logic I would have to respectfully disagree. Unless we as citizens hold law enforcement to the same standards we are expected to live up to there is a much higher chance of the misuse of power or perceived power in this case.
Of course once we loose that perspective things like the following video could happen VERY easily. Police officers have to be held to a higher degree of competency than the average Joe.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EnKLEOXenow
The Reaper
05-19-2011, 18:11
While I can appreciate your logic I would have to respectfully disagree. Unless we as citizens hold law enforcement to the same standers we are expected to live up to there is a much higher chance of the misuse of power or perceived power in this case.
Of course once we loose that perspective things like the following video could happen VERY easily. Police officers have to be held to a higher degree of competency than the average Joe.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EnKLEOXenow
I agree.
You have to give respect to get respect.
A gun and a badge are not a license to abuse citizens and treat them disrespectfully.
If you want to swear at citizens and call them names while issuing instructions, maybe you shouldn't be on the streets with a gun and a badge.
While the root cause of this incident was a citizen who decided to demonstrate his rights and an officer who was ignorant of the statute he was trying to enforce, he demonstrated not only his ignorance, but a complete lack of control of himself, the situation, and his professionalism.
If I start calling an officer names and dropping the f bomb on him, I would expect the encounter to go downhill quickly. Who likes to be treated like that?
IMHO, the DA is prosecuting to try and cover the likely civil suit coming along next.
TR
Based on the audio alone, it sounds like a huge jackass fest to me.
There wasn't a good enough reason for the officer to get all butthurt and curse the man out, nor any excuse for stopping a man lawfully open carrying and not breaking the law. He sounded like one of the "little man syndrome" type of police officers. Although not in a position of power or authority, I've found being direct and respectful elicits desired behavior most effectively.
OTOH, Fiorino should understand that the world is bigger than his perception. Maybe there was some kind of report or warrant or other out for a man matching his description. Would it have been that big of a deal to comply and explain the situation to the police officer instead of square off "peacefully?" I think a quick conversation and presentation of ID and carry permit would have had the officers sending Fiorino on his way.
My .02
- Dan P.
I'm an active LEO and a Supevisor. There's better ways of skinning that cat. I'm going out on a limb and assuming that agency does not interact with open carry laws nor does it have a policy to deal with it.
However, if he tried that tactic in CA it would have ended up bad for him. Especially in a city that's very anti gun.
Badger52
05-20-2011, 13:11
I'm an active LEO and a Supevisor. There's better ways of skinning that cat. I'm going out on a limb and assuming that agency does not interact with open carry laws nor does it have a policy to deal with it.
Probably a fair assessment. In WI where (currently) open-carry is the only legal recourse available because the law is mute in that regard, simply doing so makes one a target of the "he's just making a point about his rights" moniker. Several municipalities have found their coffers emptier for FTFSI when the AG even counselled in an advisory memo,
"Look folks, absent any other criminal circumstances, the simple presence of a holstered gun is NOT cause for a disorderly conduct charge or anything beyond a brief investigative encounter following a man-with-gun call." Departments that weren't in a coma have incorporated the dynamic in their policies and everyone drives on.
Hopefully that will soon change with codification of OC or CC on the books, since the same folks that cried "no hidden guns!" are the first ones to cry "oh, please put the offending things from our sight!"
I OC when in state but have no problems; then again, as TS advises, I don't make a point of being the 2nd belligerent asshat when there's already one at the scene. Most officers I know respond to civility as much as anyone.
Stupid punk, he should know better than to jump up out of his wheelchair and assault two cops - since they had a grip of both his arms.
Must be crazy also since he smashed his own head into the sidewalk.
"Arrest of Man In Wheelchair Raises Concerns"
http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/Arrest-of-Man-In-Wheelchair-Raises-Concerns-122423619.html?dr
".................The statement goes on to say "the patron resisted arrest which resulted in him falling out of his wheelchair."........................."
The civilians standing around? I can't believe they were even questioning the LEOs activities. Should have busted their heads and hauled them off also. And while they were at it they should have rounded up the person filming the incedent also. Geeez, the nerve of some people.
Stupid punk, he should know better than to jump up out of his wheelchair and assault two cops - since they had a grip of both his arms.
Must be crazy also since he smashed his own head into the sidewalk.
"Arrest of Man In Wheelchair Raises Concerns"
http://www.nbcwashington.com/news/local/Arrest-of-Man-In-Wheelchair-Raises-Concerns-122423619.html?dr
".................The statement goes on to say "the patron resisted arrest which resulted in him falling out of his wheelchair."........................."
The civilians standing around? I can't believe they were even questioning the LEOs activities. Should have busted their heads and hauled them off also. And while they were at it they should have rounded up the person filming the incedent also. Geeez, the nerve of some people.
What better way to give all that high speed tac gear a work out than to bust up some cripples? All in a days work.
Look what happened to a quadriplegic being booked into the county jail in Tampa back in 2008.
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article19346.htm
Brian Sterner is a former emergency services telephone dispatch operator and has been a quadraplegic since he broke his neck at the age of 14 in a wrestling accident. He only has partial use of his arms, no feeling below the sternum and is unable to walk. Sterner was driving a small car fitted with hand pedals in October 2007 when police on patrol in Ybor City saw him waving his arms and shaking his head. He had been driving 5 mph in a 30 mph zone. Police lost sight of him, but found him later nearby. They said he made "foolish" statements. Police found no alcohol or illegal drugs but charged him with fleeing. He was arrested on a warrant on 29th January and brought to the booking room at the Hillsborough County, Florida jail. In order to search him, Deputy Charlette Marshall-Jones threw him from his wheelchair on to the floor. The incident was caught on a CCTV camera at the jail and this video footage of the incident has been widely circulated. The video shows Deputy Marshall-Jones walking behind Mr Sterner's chair to tip it forwards so he falls to the floor. Mr Sterner lands heavily and rolls onto his back and then Deputy Marshall-Jones starts searching his pockets.
Surgicalcric
05-23-2011, 18:07
That bitch needs to be donkey kicked square in her teeth. Wonder if she will find it as amusing then...
Crip
Texas_Shooter
05-23-2011, 19:38
How do you justify or explain behavior like that?
DaveMatteson
05-24-2011, 08:59
Has anyone else noticed that a majority of these incidents happen in the Northern, Eastern, and far west postion of the US where gun laws are seriously restricting?
I was sickened to read the article and the subsequent covering of asses in the shooting the of the West Pointer at the Costco and this article made it worse.
I grew up in Rhode Island and people there were gun shy. I had a CCW while in that state and I cannot tell you how many people, my parents included, had something negative to say. I now live in Alabama where shotgun racks are full and the gun shops are busy. In most cases the only questions you hear when someone sees someone carrying a gun are usually; "Where did you get it" and "How much".
Dohhunter
05-24-2011, 10:18
Look what happened to a quadriplegic being booked into the county jail in Tampa back in 2008.
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article19346.htm
Brian Sterner is a former emergency services telephone dispatch operator and has been a quadraplegic since he broke his neck at the age of 14 in a wrestling accident. He only has partial use of his arms, no feeling below the sternum and is unable to walk. Sterner was driving a small car fitted with hand pedals in October 2007 when police on patrol in Ybor City saw him waving his arms and shaking his head. He had been driving 5 mph in a 30 mph zone. Police lost sight of him, but found him later nearby. They said he made "foolish" statements. Police found no alcohol or illegal drugs but charged him with fleeing. He was arrested on a warrant on 29th January and brought to the booking room at the Hillsborough County, Florida jail. In order to search him, Deputy Charlette Marshall-Jones threw him from his wheelchair on to the floor. The incident was caught on a CCTV camera at the jail and this video footage of the incident has been widely circulated. The video shows Deputy Marshall-Jones walking behind Mr Sterner's chair to tip it forwards so he falls to the floor. Mr Sterner lands heavily and rolls onto his back and then Deputy Marshall-Jones starts searching his pockets.
That infuriates me as much this time watching it as the first time. Disgusting.