View Full Version : Sharia; The Threat to America
shooter_250
04-08-2011, 08:08
This is the entire study in PDF format. I just began reading, thought you guys might want to read the study as well..
http://www.centerforsecuritypolicy.org/upload/wysiwyg/article%20pdfs/Shariah%20-%20The%20Threat%20to%20America%20(Team%20B%20Repor t)%20Web%2009292010.pdf
The book is $15...the download is free.
I hope i have this in the correct area, guidance, as always, is appreciated.
God Bless
Lee
I am ready to listen to a solution to our self generated problem..
Shariah law is creeping into our society, our government, and our laws. The problem is we have set ourselves up for the fall.
How many of our current laws were written in Ecclesiastical favor??
Think about it..
Ecclesiastical Holidays
Ecclesiastical Land Rights, Banking, and Tax Laws
Ecclesiastical Law for Ordination
Ecclesiastical Schools
Ecclesiastical Medical Procedures
Ecclesiastical Funerals Laws
Ecclesiastical Marriage Laws
Ecclesiastical Dietary Laws
NOTE: I used the word Ecclesiastical, substitute any religion's formal name for personal clarity
The list is longer than most would guess.. How do you selectively allow some and not others,, by religion ??
Is there an allowable "LIMIT" on the type or extent of ecclesiastical jurisdiction?
Be advised, I do not advocate a secular view, nor do I advocate religious bigotry..
This World in a combination of both the ecclesiastical and the secular.
But, In the case of shariah law there is no secular anything..
Maybe I am a bigot??? :confused:
From the conclusion:
While detailed recommendations for adopting a more prudential and effective strategy for surviving shariah’s onslaught are beyond the scope of this study, several policy and programmatic changes are clearly in order. These include:
• U.S. policy-makers, financiers, businessmen, judges, journalists, community leaders and the public at large must be equipped with an accurate understanding of the nature of shariah and the necessity of keeping America shariah-free. At a minimum, this will entail resisting – rather than acquiescing to – the concerted efforts now being made to allow that alien and barbaric legal code to become established in this country as an alternate, parallel system to the Constitution and the laws enacted pursuant to it. Arguably, this is already in effect for those who have taken an oath to “support and defend” the Constitution, because the requirement is subsumed in that oath.
• U.S. government agencies and organizations should cease their outreach to Muslim communities through Muslim Brotherhood fronts whose mission is to destroy our country from within as such practices are both reckless and counterproductive. Indeed, these activities serve to legitimate, protect and
expand the influence of our enemies. They conduce to no successful legal outcome that cannot be better advanced via aggressive prosecution of terrorists, terror-funders and other lawbreakers. They also discourage patriotic Muslims from providing actual assistance to the U.S. government lest they be marked for ostracism or worse by the Brothers and other shariah-adherent members of their communities.
• In keeping with Article VI of the Constitution, extend bans currently in effect that bar members of hate groups such as the Ku Klux Klan from holding positions of trust in federal, state, or local governments or the armed forces of the United States to those who espouse or support shariah. Instead, every effort should be made to identify and empower Muslims who are willing publicly to denounce shariah.
• Practices that promote shariah – notably, shariah compliant finance and the establishment or promotion in public spaces or with public funds of facilities and activities that give preferential treatment to shariah’s adherents – are incompatible with the Constitution and the freedoms it enshrines and must be
proscribed.
• Sedition is prohibited by law in the United States. To the extent that imams and mosques are being used to advocate shariah in America, they are promoting seditious activity and should be warned that they will not be immune from prosecution.
• Textbooks used in both secular educational systems and Islamic schools must not promote shariah, its tenets, or the notion that America must submit to its dictates.
• Compounds and communities that seek to segregate themselves on the basis of shariah law, apply it alongside or in lieu of the law of the land or otherwise establish themselves as “no-go” zones for law enforcement and other authorities must be thwarted in such efforts. In this connection, assertion of claims to territory around mosques should be proscribed.
• Immigration of those who adhere to shariah must be precluded, as was previously done with adherents to the seditious ideology of communism.
Although I agree with the conclusion, I feel it opens up our country to a problem of biblical proportions...
Because if we out-law one religion, why stop???
Because if we out-law one religion, why stop???
Sir,
I see the underlying truth embedded in your question, and in debates regarding someones right to burn an American flag, or a Bible, or a Quran, I have learned to understand that the freedom I have to pray, teach, carry a gun provides them the ability to do their thing, no matter how morally reprehensible or socially irresponsible or just downright disrespectful that thing may be.
So in a sense, I have to say, yes, no matter how it disgusts me to consider it, I must attempt to accept a muslims 'right' to practice whatever religion he chooses, and respect that he wishes to be governed by a different set of laws.
But in this case, by giving him that freedom, here in our country, we will indubitably accept with that a loss of our own freedoms, a warping of the intent of our constitution and an erosion of the good and honorable values that somehow have managed to remain. My rhetorical response to this is "if they want Sharia law, go home and get it" . I think we have been extremely open hearted and open minded to the muslim culture here. They can eat 'wegetarian' at most restaurants, they can worship, they can run a thriving business, own property. So I have no qualms about saying, NO! Enough is enough, live here work here, pay taxes here, but we will NOT be governed by YOUR rules. We have our own and if you don't like them, go home.
In practice, will someone being tried for the murder of a woman get to switch over to Sharia law and use the justification that he caught her sleeping with another man? Can non-muslims choose which set of laws to live by? Can one mix and match? It sounds like a dangerous proposition.
These are my thoughts, respected warrior, they are not eloquently stated, and in re-reading may seem a little immature. Would you mind addressing your own question? I am curious how you have worked out the quandary that your question presents.
Respectfully
Sir,
I am curious how you have worked out the quandary that your question presents.
Respectfully
I think in a simple form,, I did..
Maybe,, I am a bigot???
:munchin
I think in a simple form,, I did..
:munchin
Sir,
I understand you to mean that we have no choice but to allow it. Does it follow logically then that we (as a country) don't have a choice in the matter, we HAVE to subject ourselves to what we already know is insanity?
I understand you to mean that we have no choice but to allow it. Does it follow logically then that we (as a country) don't have a choice in the matter, we HAVE to subject ourselves to what we already know is insanity?
I think we can continue to allow the reasonable practicing of those tenets of the faith which do not conflict with US Code - as many living here now do - and if that isn't enough, there's always the opportunity for them to practice the freedom to move somewhere else.
Richard :munchin
I think we can continue to allow the reasonable practicing of those tenets of the faith which do not conflict with US Code - as many living here now do - and if that isn't enough, there's always the opportuity for them to practice the freedom to move somewhere else.
Richard :munchin
For now.....
Svengali wave of the hands - "There is no threat" - Svengali wave of the hands - "There is no threat" - Svengali wave of the hands - "There is no threat"
Sir,
Does it follow logically then that we (as a country) don't have a choice in the matter, we HAVE to subject ourselves to what we already know is insanity?
Just the opposite.
I think we need to admit that choices are not only our responsibility, but an inviolable right.
We need to make decisions for our own good.
That being subjugated by inaction is wrong.
That allowing "others" the liberty to take advantage of our divisiveness will lead to our demise.
Ergo, I will live with the vigilance of one that knows I have faults, that can be mastered. I'll be dammed if I let indecision be one of my failings.
I wonder how long before we have guys like Siddiq...or Shanon as he used to be called.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jc98Ilbxr9s&feature=related.
Notice...how glances to the side when the reporter says that Sharia Law is medieval.
Roguish Lawyer
10-17-2011, 15:24
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dN6CHtGGo4g&feature=share
I think we can continue to allow the reasonable practicing of those tenets of the faith which do not conflict with US Code - as many living here now do - and if that isn't enough, there's always the opportunity for them to practice the freedom to move somewhere else.
Richard :munchin
Your freedom of religion ends where my restriction of constitutional rights by your religion begins.
I wonder how long before we have guys like Siddiq...or Shanon as he used to be called.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jc98Ilbxr9s&feature=related.
Notice...how glances to the side when the reporter says that Sharia Law is medieval.
Based on Warrior Mentors many topics and other media sources.....We in US are heading in the same direction and it likely already here.
I don't post much (read hardly at all) since it's easier to learn stuff by reading than typing, but this subject kinda burns me a bit so here goes nuthin'....
I've kind of reconciled the "freedom of religion quandry" in my own head...
Islam is contrary to our constitution....full stop (and yes, I've done "a bit of reading" so I'd have info needed for a previous occupation)
It does not accept or respect freedom of religion, freedom of speech or the separation of Church and state (in fact islam states that "church and state" are to be one in the same).
This stuff in in the koran not just the "supplemental readings" known as the hadith.
But you may ask as I did "what about the other religions we have in our country". My answer, at least according to the materials I've seen and the folks I've talked to, is that none of them require a theocracy, and all of them have as part of their central message words to the effect of "Be excellent to each other" ("and party on dude!" is present in many of 'em as well). Islam on the other hand has: "be one of us....or we kill you".
I'm sure someone out there has done more and better research than I, and I'm sure I've missed some "salient points", but this works for me.
Wanna follow islam? Great, do it somewhere else, not in the USA.
mojaveman
10-17-2011, 19:52
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dN6CHtGGo4g&feature=share
Interesting clip. I think what those Muslims are trying to do in London won't go over well in other areas of Europe, in particular East Germany. Don't think it would go over well here either, at least not where I live. :D
It's sickening to be honest. Makes me want to purchase a shotgun for protection.
Roguish Lawyer
10-18-2011, 04:38
It's sickening to be honest. Makes me want to purchase a shotgun for protection.
You should do that anyway, doncha think?
Islam has won in the US.
There are a few who may wish to dispute that but they've won.
Even on this board.
Look at the "burning" issue. You can burn just about anything you want in this country - the flag, a bible, etc, etc. You can mock just about anything you want in this country - again the flag and anything of importance to just about any Religion - except..........
ISLAM
Look at when the nut in FL wanted to burn the Koran.
"Yeah, he has the right but he really shouldn't do it."
Face it folks, when Islam is treated different than other religions they've won.
Interesting clip. I think what those Muslims are trying to do in London won't go over well in other areas of Europe, in particular East Germany. Don't think it would go over well here either, at least not where I live. :D
For some time have been Muslim Clerics here in the US spewing the same rhetoric as those in the clip but like the Blind Sheik we don't pay attention to them until one of their followers lights up and body parts are scattered about the landscape.....more recently there was Imam Anwar Al-Awlaki (http://topics.nytimes.com/topics/reference/timestopics/people/a/anwar_al_awlaki/index.html) who served as an Imam in California, and later in the Washington, D.C. area where he headed the Dar Al-Hijrah Islamic Center and was also the Muslim Chaplain at George Washington University. (http://kalamullah.com/anwar-alawlaki.html)
Remember Advisor/Imam Rauf (http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/2010/08/23/rauf-and-the-state-department/) And lets not forget our very own Louis Farrakahn leader of the Nation of Islam (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W2tl3blyI2o&feature=player_embedded)
And more good news within the government...Mazen Asbah (http://blogs.wsj.com/law/2008/08/07/obama-advisor-schiff-hardin-associate-resigns-over-ties-to-imam/)
Even within the past few weeks there is evidence of a much quieter march towards Sharia......through the use of Civil Rights Law.
The Ohio Department of Corrections removed pork from the menu to accommodate Muslims (http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/ohio-removes-pork-prison-menus-nod-muslim-inmates)
Our DOJ ordered a school district to pay a teacher 75k for denying her special leave to attend the Haj in Mecca (http://patdollard.com/2011/10/obama-justice-department-orders-illinois-school-district-to-pay-muslim-teacher-75k-over-denying-her-special-leave-of-absence-for-hajj-trip-to-mecca/)
mojaveman
10-18-2011, 10:09
For some time have been Muslim Clerics here in the US spewing the same rhetoric as those in the clip but like the Blind Sheik we don't pay attention to them until one of their followers lights up and body parts are scattered about the landscape.....more recently there was Imam Anwar Al-Awlaki (http://topics.nytimes.com/topics/reference/timestopics/people/a/anwar_al_awlaki/index.html) who served as an Imam in California, and later in the Washington, D.C. area where he headed the Dar Al-Hijrah Islamic Center and was also the Muslim Chaplain at George Washington University. (http://kalamullah.com/anwar-alawlaki.html)
Remember Advisor/Imam Rauf (http://pajamasmedia.com/ronradosh/2010/08/23/rauf-and-the-state-department/) And lets not forget our very own Louis Farrakahn leader of the Nation of Islam (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W2tl3blyI2o&feature=player_embedded)
And more good news within the government...Mazen Asbah (http://blogs.wsj.com/law/2008/08/07/obama-advisor-schiff-hardin-associate-resigns-over-ties-to-imam/)
Even within the past few weeks there is evidence of a much quieter march towards Sharia......through the use of Civil Rights Law.
The Ohio Department of Corrections removed pork from the menu to accommodate Muslims (http://www.cnsnews.com/news/article/ohio-removes-pork-prison-menus-nod-muslim-inmates)
Our DOJ ordered a school district to pay a teacher 75k for denying her special leave to attend the Haj in Mecca (http://patdollard.com/2011/10/obama-justice-department-orders-illinois-school-district-to-pay-muslim-teacher-75k-over-denying-her-special-leave-of-absence-for-hajj-trip-to-mecca/)
Informative points. When some Muslim walks through the area where I live posting yellow signs about sharia law I'm going to do everything I can to make him feel extremely uncomfortable. ;)
They can eat 'wegetarian' at most restaurants
Are you confusing Hindus with Muslims? I haven't met to many vegetarian Muslims, halal yes, weggie whopper no. Given the historical enmity there it would be like asking a guy in a Georgia Bulldogs t-shirt if he pulls for the Gators?
Islam has won in the US.
QP Pete,
I have to respectfully disagree with your Islam has won here view, using Herman Cain's recent results as an example.
His if elected "I wouldn't have any ______ in my administration." stance even if misinterpreted in context would have been political suicide for a man hoping to be POTUS if you filled in the blank with, women, midgets, Texans, Methodists, or any other group qualification, however apparently you can fill in the blank "Muslims" and still win straw polls in FL.
As for the opposition to the pastor burning the Koran in FL, we have thousands of young Americans in harm's way fighting insurgencies in Muslim lands, how does this media stunt and the fallout help them do their jobs and get home safe? These are the circumstances of the time.
Islam has won in the US.
I disagree.
Look at the "burning" issue.
OK.
I agree that we have the 'right' to burn our national flag - but I also think we reallly shouldn't do it.
I also agree that we have the right to burn a Bible - but I also think we really shouldn't do that either.
And I would also point out that within US Code there are no laws against burning a Koran and we still retain the 'right' to do so - but, as with the other examples cited, I personally think we really shouldn't do that, either.
So, if the 'right' to do something like that still exists, I don't see how it can be argued that we've capitulated to Islamic law over our national laws.
However - YMMV.
Richard
........So, if the 'right' to do something like that still exists, I don't see how it can be argued that we've capitulated to Islamic law over our national laws.
However - YMMV.
Richard
There seemed to be a pretty big stink raised here in the west about the guy that wanted to burn the Koran.
When it was pointed out that our own military forces burned thousands of Bibles the reaction was "YAWN, so what."
School kids are taught about Ramadan and Eid Al-fitr but go on Spring Break because of the "Wall between religion and the state"?
TOMAHAWK9521
10-18-2011, 13:47
It's sickening to be honest. Makes me want to purchase a shotgun for protection.
A shotgun? Why just a shotgun?
In embracing the liberal mindset :Where's your sense of diversity? Other tools of defense need luvin', too.. A shotgun is okay, but why not add a nice bolt-action rifle, a hi-cap .45, a good knife, a tomahawk, not to mention a surplus of ammo (finely coated with bacon grease-I mean teflon). :D
School kids are taught about Ramadan and Eid Al-fitr but go on Spring Break because of the "Wall between religion and the state"?
School kids are taught about all the world's numerous holidays (whether holy or secular) ICW their studies of those cultures and their histories to understand how they came about and their impact on societies.
Here, we have a fall (1 wk), winter (2 wks), spring (1 wk), and summer (10 wks) break for our schools. The breaks (except summer) traditionally coincide with a number of overlapping major religious holidays.
Richard
Here, we have a fall (1 wk), winter (2 wks), spring (1 wk), and summer (10 wks) break for our schools. The breaks (except summer) traditionally coincide with a number of overlapping major religious holidays.
Richard
You just proved my point Richard - it used to be Thanksgiving, Christmas and Easter Breaks - but now is Fall, Winter and Spring.
You just proved my point Richard - it used to be Thanksgiving, Christmas and Easter Breaks - but now is Fall, Winter and Spring.
So - we changed what we call school breaks because of Islam? :confused:
We still have a Thanksgiving break (in addition to the fall break) and it is still called a Thanksgiving break as it is a national holiday.
The fall break coincides with several Jewish and Islamic holy days, as well as teacher in-service training days; the winter break coincides with several Christian, Jewish, and Interfaith holidays; and the spring break coincides with several Christian and Jewish holidays.
Thanksgiving is a national holiday - the remainder are breaks which allow numerous religions to celebrate holy days of importance to their faiths.
Personally, I see the changes as being more correctly in alignment with the intent of the 1st Amendment of the Bill of Rights.
Richard
I disagree.
I don't see how it can be argued that we've capitulated to Islamic law over our national laws.
What about in instances where parties enter into a contract that is based Sharia or allows for Sharia Arbitration and the US Court system allows it, or as in the link below the US Court sends the case to the Texas Islamic Court
http://www.2ndcoa.courts.state.tx.us/opinions/HTMLopinion.asp?OpinionID=14601
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2008/02/sharia-courts-intexas.html
Considering that, it would appear we now have (2) systems of Law, one based on US Law and based on Sharia.
.....The fall break coincides with several Jewish and Islamic holy days, as well as teacher in-service training days; the winter break coincides with ..............
Which Islamic Holiday coincides with the Fall Break? Ramadan moves backwards through the year with the moon. Works out to be about 11 days a year.
Ramadan this year was in August.
Some of the others are Al-Hijra, Ashura, Mawlid al-Nabi and Id al-Adha. all of them move through the year with the moon also.
As a side note since Ramadan is moving into July next year it should be around 6 years before it backs into the next school year.
What about in instances where parties enter into a contract that is based Sharia or allows for Sharia Arbitration and the US Court system allows it, or as in the link below the US Court sends the case to the Texas Islamic Court
http://www.2ndcoa.courts.state.tx.us/opinions/HTMLopinion.asp?OpinionID=14601
http://www.jihadwatch.org/2008/02/sharia-courts-intexas.html
Considering that, it would appear we now have (2) systems of Law, one based on US Law and based on Sharia.
Rola Qaddura said...
I am Rola Qaddura. It is sad to say that I have been forbidden to talk about my case. My case has created an international controversy. My name was used in every article with partial information that is leading to an incorrect image about Muslims trying to impose Sharia in the Texas legal code.
Let me start by briefly telling my story. I was a petitioner of the mentioned lawsuit for divorce and custody that was based on physical abuse.
After prolonged battles in Texas District Court all parties signed an Islamic Arbitration agreement to arbitrate the case. District Court denied it. The Court of Appeal ruled that the agreement is valid and enforceable.
After all arbitration is arbitration.
In 2004 while arbitration was taking place a signed order from a District Court was presented to us to revoke arbitration and return to court for a final hearing. The order was signed the same morning of arbitration. Arbiters had to stop the hearing.
In Tarrant County the Muslim community is a big target for judicial elections. I am a party of the mentioned Islamic Arbitration. While the election were taking place in 2006 the court has ordered me not to talk to anyone about my case or to anyone at Mosques, to the extend if I need to seek help from the Mosque I have to do it through my attorney.
I am an American Muslim I have turned to the legal system to protect me and my children. When they didn't I had to ask for arbitration and still they will not allow it.
I have been a victim and now my children are too. I have experienced the true meaning of losing human rights. I have lived in fear, pain and still under threat. Respecting the Civil law I have complied with Court orders regardless of its fairness. I have paid 75% of my income in child support and since then I have seen my children 4 times only.
Ten years of battling in court it says something. What law would abuse a parent or a child? It should never be justified under any name neither Civil law, Jewish, Christian, nor Islamic. Families and children have rights regardless of any excuse or personal interests.
All religious preach for human rights however these rights whether it is civil or religious are only applicable and enforceable by judicial authorities.
When a corruption takes place who would have the authority a religion or officials?
I highly believe that corruption doesn't end justice but it is a reason for applying justice.
Sunday, February 01, 2009 4:16:00 PM
http://worldmuslimcongress.blogspot.com/2008/02/texas-adopting-shariah.html
Which Islamic Holiday coincides with the Fall Break?
The fall break varies annually - anytime between mid Sept to late Oct depending on the accomodation of the Jewish and/or Islamic holy days during the period which vary greatly from year to year. Sometimes it's only because of one; sometimes it's for both. This year neither fell during the school week so the district took only 2 days for teacher professional development pruposes. The next break is Thanksgiving.
Richard
Rola Qaddura said...
I am Rola Qaddura. It is sad to say that I have been forbidden to talk about my case. My case has created an international controversy. My name was used in every article with partial information that is leading to an incorrect image about Muslims trying to impose Sharia in the Texas legal code.
Let me start by briefly telling my story. I was a petitioner of the mentioned lawsuit for divorce and custody that was based on physical abuse.
After prolonged battles in Texas District Court all parties signed an Islamic Arbitration agreement to arbitrate the case. District Court denied it. The Court of Appeal ruled that the agreement is valid and enforceable.
After all arbitration is arbitration.
In 2004 while arbitration was taking place a signed order from a District Court was presented to us to revoke arbitration and return to court for a final hearing. The order was signed the same morning of arbitration. Arbiters had to stop the hearing.
In Tarrant County the Muslim community is a big target for judicial elections. I am a party of the mentioned Islamic Arbitration. While the election were taking place in 2006 the court has ordered me not to talk to anyone about my case or to anyone at Mosques, to the extend if I need to seek help from the Mosque I have to do it through my attorney.
I am an American Muslim I have turned to the legal system to protect me and my children. When they didn't I had to ask for arbitration and still they will not allow it.
I have been a victim and now my children are too. I have experienced the true meaning of losing human rights. I have lived in fear, pain and still under threat. Respecting the Civil law I have complied with Court orders regardless of its fairness. I have paid 75% of my income in child support and since then I have seen my children 4 times only.
Ten years of battling in court it says something. What law would abuse a parent or a child? It should never be justified under any name neither Civil law, Jewish, Christian, nor Islamic. Families and children have rights regardless of any excuse or personal interests.
All religious preach for human rights however these rights whether it is civil or religious are only applicable and enforceable by judicial authorities.
When a corruption takes place who would have the authority a religion or officials?
I highly believe that corruption doesn't end justice but it is a reason for applying justice.
Sunday, February 01, 2009 4:16:00 PM
http://worldmuslimcongress.blogspot.com/2008/02/texas-adopting-shariah.html
I understand that and it would appear the story may have been blown out of proportion to some degree.
But what about the Texas Islamic Court, it would appear on the surface as a court system not based on US Law. Is there enough Sharia based arbitration in Texas to warrant a Islamic Court? Does Texas have a Texas Mexican Court and Texas Jewish Court?
After prolonged battles in Texas District Court all parties signed an Islamic Arbitration agreement to arbitrate the case. District Court denied it. The Court of Appeal ruled that the agreement is valid and enforceable.
Based on that statement it would appear that the parties did not like the outcome in the Texas District Court and the CoA bent over to accommodate them and Sharia.
RE Post #31 -
You should read the article at the link provided.
After prolonged court battles, they agreed to arbitration by a private Richardson-based group, the Texas Islamic Court.
You should also read up on Jewish law and how similar proceedings are handled in Rabinical courts - even here in America.
Richard :munchin
I read it, it seems pretty benign in this case, but sounds like a can of worms for the court system, but it is interesting.
Maybe I am wrong, but if I were to go outside CONUS I would not expect other countries to honor US Law, its Courts or my Rights...so personally I don't think believe there should be any 'courts' outside the US Court System.
I read it, it seems pretty benign in this case, but sounds like a can of worms for the court system, but it is interesting.
Maybe I am wrong, but if I were to go outside CONUS I would not expect other countries to honor US Law, its Courts or my Rights...so personally I don't think believe there should be any 'courts' outside the US Court System.
Concur. Same with language, IMO.
I am ready to listen to a solution to our self generated problem..
Shariah law is creeping into our society, our government, and our laws. The problem is we have set ourselves up for the fall.
How many of our current laws were written in Ecclesiastical favor??
Think about it..
Ecclesiastical Holidays
Ecclesiastical Land Rights, Banking, and Tax Laws
Ecclesiastical Law for Ordination
Ecclesiastical Schools
Ecclesiastical Medical Procedures
Ecclesiastical Funerals Laws
Ecclesiastical Marriage Laws
Ecclesiastical Dietary Laws
NOTE: I used the word Ecclesiastical, substitute any religion's formal name for personal clarity
The list is longer than most would guess.. How do you selectively allow some and not others,, by religion ??
Is there an allowable "LIMIT" on the type or extent of ecclesiastical jurisdiction?
Be advised, I do not advocate a secular view, nor do I advocate religious bigotry..
This World in a combination of both the ecclesiastical and the secular.
But, In the case of shariah law there is no secular anything..
Maybe I am a bigot??? :confused:
From the conclusion:
Although I agree with the conclusion, I feel it opens up our country to a problem of biblical proportions...
Because if we out-law one religion, why stop???
Sharia is not a religion and can be addressed as a form of law that directly contradicts our form of civil law.
It should be addressed as a cultural import that incorporates a value system based upon ancient middle eastern tribal law.....
frostfire
11-15-2011, 06:37
http://www.americanthinker.com/2011/11/the_case_for_banning_sharia_law_in_america.html
American Thinker, November 14, 2011
The Case for Banning Sharia Law in America
By JanSuzanne Krasner
The incompatibility of Islamic sharia law with secular courts stems from the underpinning of Islamism -- the unyielding union of the laws and punishments of the Qu'ran and Hadiths with the country's legal and political system. Sharia law is the legislation of these religious and criminal rules, which rejects America's constitutional secularism and legal penalties.
The Qu'ran commands Muslims to change secular laws to conform to sharia, eventually establishing Islamic law worldwide. Islamic courts want their fatwas to supersede the civil and criminal laws, untying Muslims from civil secular courts.
The facts reveal that in 2008, when the first sharia court was recognized in the U.K., within one year, over 85 recognized sharia courts were established within the U.K.'s Tribunal Court system. The problem with this rapidly spreading dogma is that several of these courts have issued some fatwas that are completely incompatible with British and European law.
As Islam is a male-dominated ideology, the laws of the Qu'ran make half of its devotees, its female population, second-class citizens. This inequality has drawn recent attention to the need for additional British legislation to rein in these courts so they abide by British law.
It appears that once any legal system opens its doors to Islamic law, that door will be hard to close...and eventually, the only thing missing will be a parallel Islamic government.
But even with this reality in front of Americans, there are still many who insist that our laws will prevent such circumstances from ever occurring in the U.S. And because of this nonchalant attitude, there are numbers of people, both Muslim and non-Muslim, who believe that sharia law is not a threat to non-Muslim Americans or to the Western liberal democratic rule of law.
Sharia Law Is in the U.S.
The possibility that Muslim-only towns and urban enclaves could be created in the U.S. seems unimaginable to most Americans, but it already is a reality. Just travel 150 mile northwest of New York City to the woods of the western Catskills, and you will find Islamberg, a private Muslim community founded in 1980 by Sheikh Syed Mubarik Ali Shah Gilani. Sheikh Gilani is said to be one of the founders of Jamaat al-Fuqra, a terrorist organization believed to be responsible for dozens of bombings and murders in the U.S. and abroad.
Islamberg is only one of twenty to thirty Muslim-only communities and training compounds that this Pakistani group supports through Muslim affiliates in America. This radical group has purchased land in isolated areas close to city networks and infrastructure. Jamaat al-Fuqra now has sites in Alabama, Georgia, Oklahoma, South Carolina, Tennessee, Virginia, Pennsylvania, California, Washington, Colorado, Michigan, and Illinois, as well as Canada, Venezuela, and Trinidad.
The sharia debate in the U.S. is heating up as more and more Americans are reacting to lawyers requesting rulings based on sharia law, and local judges agreeing to make them. This has happened in a New Jersey divorce case, a Maryland child custody case, and most recently in a Florida property case. These cases are now a precedent for other American-Muslim communities. In addition, according to the Center for Security Policy study that was published in May 2011, there are actually over fifty Appellate Court cases from 23 states that all involve conflicts between sharia law and American state law.
There are numbers of Muslim community leaders challenging the delicate line between religious freedom and the laws against state religion by petitioning in favor of living under sharia law. The moment one court allows the establishment of an independently ruled enclave, others courts in liberal cities across the nation will petition for the same opportunity.
Another example of efforts to usurp the Constitution are the actions of the global Organization of Islamic Cooperation (OIC), whose main agenda is to have "hate speech" laws enforced against anyone who criticizes Islam. And, unfortunately, there are those determined to enforce sharia on their own who attack and murder any nearby dissenters. The Qu'ran justifies and protects these people's violence by declaring that it is blasphemous to mock or degrade any component of Islam. According to sharia law, such activity is punishable by death.
It is this ongoing effort to shut down public criticism of Islam that presents the gravest danger to America -- one that the Muslim Brotherhood and its Salafist organizations regard as key to limiting individual rights over the rights of the community. The Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR), along with other Islamic activist groups, continues to push back, often with demonization of character and follow-up lawsuits. Recently, intimidation and character assassination have been used against U.S. politicians who question Islamism or want hearings on issues relating to radical Islamic terrorism, along with those Congressmen who introduce state legislation to ban all foreign law.
Preventing Sharia through Legislation
The Court of Appeals is the system used to review lower court decisions and believed by some to be the stopgap against foreign law, including sharia, from entering our legal system. However, some Islamic cases that have reached the Appellate Court for review have retained the sharia rulings even in the face of sharia's contradiction to American civil law.
The U.S. is heading towards dangerous territory if its citizens buy into the twisting of constitutional amendments. Indeed, what everyone really needs is the interpretations of the laws as they are written in order to prevent the encroachment of Islamism into the court system.
The establishment of sharia courts within the arbitration laws is a leading objective of every peace-loving, kindhearted, moderate male Muslim. I have asked several male American Muslims whom I know, some living very happily in my community and in the U.S., what their one greatest wish is. The answer is always the same: "Everyone should be a Muslim."
The line must be drawn in states' legislatures, not in the courts. It is imperative that we recognize the differences between the religion of Islam and the ideology of Islamism. Political correctness is leading to interpretations of the Constitution and its amendments that are pushing America across that line.
If non-Muslim Americans do not recognize how close they are to the precipice, then they are beyond a shadow of a doubt going to fall victims to an Islamic conquest. Time is running out.
A couple of the more salient points for me from the American Thinker piece highlighted below.
It appears that once any legal system opens its doors to Islamic law, that door will be hard to close...and eventually, the only thing missing will be a parallel Islamic government.
It is imperative that we recognize the differences between the religion of Islam and the ideology of Islamism.
ddoering
11-15-2011, 11:10
"Originally Posted by frostfire View Post
It is imperative that we recognize the differences between the religion of Islam and the ideology of Islamism."
How do you separate the two when one is the foundation of the other?????
"Originally Posted by frostfire View Post
It is imperative that we recognize the differences between the religion of Islam and the ideology of Islamism."
How do you separate the two when one is the foundation of the other?????
I was wondering the same. Isn't it you either follow the book, or you don't; "ism's" and context be damned...
Surgicalcric
11-15-2011, 13:01
How do you separate the two when one is the foundation of the other?????
Which is precisely why I contend that we are at war with Islam and not just the "radicals."
Crip
Just some observations:
Simply stated, Sharia law is generally incompatible with the US Constitution.
From a purely analytical perspective, IMO, to separate the underlying religion of Islam from the Sharia law component may be of some utility given the First Amendment to the United States Constitution.
From a purely practical perspective, IMO, an ongoing attempt at conquest by some in Islam exists and must be met and vanquished or life in the USA as we know it ceases.
IIRC, others have weighed in on this topic in numerous previous posts on this BB. I have found that there exists some very good stuff and some quite insightful observations archived on this BB.
Various searches here under Islam, Muslim or Sharia, etc., pulls up a few.
YMMV.