View Full Version : Tactical Handgun Lighting
The Reaper
08-01-2004, 19:37
Gents:
Just recently acquired my first personally purchased tactical handgun light.
I bought a Surefire X200A, which I had previously examined at the Shot Show. It is a 6v. light, momentary or constantly switched, and it is absolutely tiny for the illumination it puts out. It will also slip quite handily on any rifle or carbine with a free section of 1913 rail, I tried it on my M-4 and it works great at less than half the size of the WeaponsLights. This light also makes a very convenient hand held light. I have decided that if not mounted already, this light will go in my tactical vest permanently.
I had no pistol on hand with a tactical rail, so I had to order a rail and have it installed.
I bought the Caspian Recon Rail, and had my local smith install it on my house pistol, a modified Para P-13 Limited.
Here are a few pics of the weapon with the rail, which is a pretty compact package.
Hope this helps someone who is looking for a light.
TR
Team Sergeant
08-01-2004, 19:39
Dammit, wheres the light??????????
The Reaper
08-01-2004, 19:41
There is another version of the switch available that is a pressure tape type with the switch located back under the triggerguard.
The X200A version I have is a push momentaty, rotate constant switch system.
As I understand it, the switches are interchangable by replacing the rear battery compartment cover, which contains the switch.
This is the light mounted. Note the very compact package.
TR
Team Sergeant
08-01-2004, 19:42
Whew, much better..
Nice light!
(nice background bag also!)
The Reaper
08-01-2004, 19:42
Originally posted by Team Sergeant
Dammit, wheres the light??????????
Slow down, there, Hoss!
I can only post once per minute due to board limitations.
Light is on.
TR
The Reaper
08-01-2004, 19:44
Originally posted by Team Sergeant
Whew, much better..
Hey, I think they even fit the H&Ks. They come with two latches for the different rails.
This light is the heat, TS!
TR
Footmobile
08-01-2004, 20:25
Very nice Sir. Gotta be the most compact pistol mounted tac light on the market right now.
Peregrino
08-01-2004, 20:31
SWEET! Now - what's the skinny? Tech specs, sources, prices, etc. You can't just throw it out there for bragging rights and leave the rest of us hanging. And what are you planning to use for a holster when it's all said and done? YIS - Peregrino
The Reaper
08-01-2004, 20:47
Details, details, I guess your Search or Google button is broken as well....
It can be had for under $200, BTW.
TR
http://www.surefire.com/maxexp/main.pl?pgm=co_disp&func=displ&strfnbr=6&prrfnbr=1110&sesent=0,0
X200 LED WeaponLight (X200)
PRICE: $ 250.00
The X200 features aluminum body construction and a special computer engineered Total Internal Refection (TIR) focusing lens for a tight diamond-shaped central beam and a broad peripheral corona. The special lens allows the X200 to project a tightly focused beam at greater distances than comparably sized lights. The window is constructed of tempered Pyrex® and has an anti-reflective coating. The X200 is designed to fit both the Universal Standard rail as well as the MIL STD M-1913 (Picatinny) rail, and includes adapter plates for both. A momentary toggle/push switch allows fail-safe ambidextrous function under fire.
The X200 also features digital current regulation circuitry to match the LED's current requirements with the battery's output to maintain a more consistent level of light output for the useable life of the batteries (as opposed to unregulated lights, which are subject to a steady decline in light intensity beginning shortly after activation). The X200 produces over an hour of tactical light output followed by 30 minutes of declining intensity light.
Batteries - Two SureFire lithium SF123 3.0 Volt with 10-year shelf life
1.34" high by 1.43" wide by 3.47" long
Weighs less than 4 ounces
Direct mounts to all rail-equipped Glocks and other popular handguns including Beretta, SIG, Springfield and Kimber
Instantly attaches and detaches
Extended runtime
Includes rail interface kit for conversion to Picatinny rail
Superior smoke-cutting ability
Accepts optional pressure-activated switch that extends under trigger guard. Pressure-pad tape switch for long guns coming soon.
MilSpec Type III hard-anodized aluminum construction
Waterproof to 30m/99ft
Ambidextrous momentary and constant-on switch
Flawless beam, always in focus
Bright enough to momentarily blind an opponent
Peregrino
08-01-2004, 21:04
See - All you have to do is jerk their chain and they come through on the challenge. :p Now the rest of us need to see if we can get enough interest for a group buy. I have it from a reliable source (who must remain unnamed) that if we can generate enough interest, he has a POC who might be able to get a decent group price. I for one am interested, especially if my wife doesn't see this post before I can get another job to pay for it! YIS - Peregrino
Smokin Joe
08-02-2004, 07:28
Originally posted by Peregrino
See - All you have to do is jerk their chain and they come through on the challenge. :p Now the rest of us need to see if we can get enough interest for a group buy. I have it from a reliable source (who must remain unnamed) that if we can generate enough interest, he has a POC who might be able to get a decent group price. I for one am interested, especially if my wife doesn't see this post before I can get another job to pay for it! YIS - Peregrino
I'm in for the group buy.
Great photos TR....once again setting the standard!
Nice! I think I may need two.
The Reaper
08-02-2004, 08:28
Guy, I do not see that as unreasonable.
For those not familiar with the Surefire lights, the two lithium batteries have over a 10 year shelf life (unrefrigerated) and are only $15 per dozen from Surefire. The light provides an hour of high intensity illumination, followed by continuing light at a decreased output, and due to the LED lamp, never requires a bulb replacement.
Thanks, Joe!
TR
Originally posted by The Reaper
...two lithium batteries have over a 10 year shelf life (unrefrigerated)...
Does that indicate that you suggest refrigerated batteries have a longer shelf life?
I was taught that cold unloads batteries, which is why in arctic environments you are supposed to take them out of your tractor and dig them a hole which you isolate and then cover.
That is according to the Swedish mil, but I've heard elsewhere to put them in a refrigerator.
A certain temperature range, perhaps?
I have seen a few of these lights. I like the size and the light output. That being said, I am not a fan of the rocker switch. On all of the examples I have seen, the switch was "Mushy" and lacked positive clicks when engaged. If I were to get one of these, I would go for the "Low Profile" switch, or the tape switch.
Just My $.02
Ambush Master
08-02-2004, 12:05
Originally posted by Martin
Does that indicate that you suggest refrigerated batteries have a longer shelf life?
I was taught that cold unloads batteries, which is why in arctic environments you are supposed to take them out of your tractor and dig them a hole which you isolate and then cover.
That is according to the Swedish mil, but I've heard elsewhere to put them in a refrigerator.
A certain temperature range, perhaps?
Yes, refrigerating "Dry Cell" batteries radically extends their Shelf Life. All batteries have a certain amoiunt of "electrical leakage" in them, coupled with the normal chemical reaction betwen the various compounds that they are made from will limit their useful life. Note, "Refrigerate", not FREEZE !!! I'll look up some data on Shelf Life Extensions for "Nicad" cells that we use and post it later.
Now on a vehicle battery, they are "wet cells" and they will really suffer if subjected to extreme freezing conditions.
Also, when any of the batts have been subjected to cold, they should not be used untill they return to normal operating temperature.
Ambush Master
08-02-2004, 12:16
For rechargeable Nicads:
SHELF LIFE 30 DAYS FROM CHARGING DATE AT AMBIENT TEMPERATURE OR 120 DAYS IF STORED BETWEEN 32 AND 41 DEGREES F.
This is from one of the Nicad Batt Manufacturers that we use.
Sacamuelas
08-02-2004, 14:52
Group buy price estimate?
I am in for (2)two if the price is right. :cool:
From the pictures on Surefire's site, the switch plate looks almost identical to the Streamlight/ITI M series. I had an M3x rifle mounted in Iraq. *If* the Surefire switch plate is of the same construction, they will break if you do anything resembling vehicle operations. My bottom tab went first, then the top (it'll be sideways on a rifle). If it wasn't for the backup tape switch I brought, I'd have been SOL. If the tabs are plastic and attached to a thin, rectangular metal rocker switch, be wary.
P
militarymoron
08-06-2004, 21:46
reaper,
SWEET pistol! here's a pic of my custom P14.45 signature model with GG&G rail installed.
cheers,
MM
*If* constructed the same as ITI, this can happen:
The Reaper
08-07-2004, 07:53
Not the same switch.
The X200A uses a rocker on either side of the battery compartment. Forward pressure activates momentary, rotation activates constant on.
The other X200 model uses a tape switch which goes under the trigger guard.
Will have to take a pic later.
TR
Sacamuelas
08-16-2004, 07:57
So, where are we on the handgun lights?
I found this online with my googleFU. I know nothing about this company. Can this price be beat by anyone's contact on the group price?
$189.00 http://www.botac.com/surefirex200.html
Ambush Master
08-16-2004, 09:25
You may want to give these guys a call:
http://www.shomertec.com/contact.cfm
They don't list that light in their catalog, but they may have them. Their prices have been very competitive in the past for me.
Take care.
Martin
Gentlemen:
RE the add on rails, I've heard that they tend to work their way loose. What is your experience with this?
I plan on buying a 5" 1911 (for 3 gun comp. and home defense, hence the light) either with an integral rail or adding a rail onto a non-railed weapon.
The price difference can be significant, hence my interest in the add on rails.
Regards
The Reaper
08-16-2004, 09:47
Originally posted by Sacamuelas
So, where are we on the handgun lights?
I found this online with my googleFU. I know nothing about this company. Can this price be beat by anyone's contact on the group price?
$189.00 http://www.botac.com/surefirex200.html
Botach has a VERY checkered rep, and I would exercise lots of caution in dealing with them. Caveat emptor.
As far as the rails working loose, the Caspian puts the screws inside the dustcover to increase the contact area. I also asked my 'smith to Black Loctite the screws and JB Weld the rail on as well. Some are actually welding the rails onto the pistols.
As an aside, I do not think that you can mount the rail on an alloy framed gun, or a 1911 with less than a 4" barrel.
TR
Sacamuelas
08-16-2004, 10:26
Originally posted by The Reaper
As an aside, I do not think that you can mount the rail on an alloy framed gun, or a 1911 with less than a 4" barrel.
TR
If that was for me, it is not intended for my Kimber Sir.
I would like one for a different personal weapon. The second one was for my brother as a present. He just got one of those .40 SW99's.
Originally posted by The Reaper
As far as the rails working loose, the Caspian puts the screws inside the dustcover to increase the contact area. I also asked my 'smith to Black Loctite the screws and JB Weld the rail on as well. Some are actually welding the rails onto the pistols.
As an aside, I do not think that you can mount the rail on an alloy framed gun, or a 1911 with less than a 4" barrel.
TR
Roger that. Thanks for the information, TR.
Hey Sir,
I wonder if they have one for Glock 23 or 19. I would definately be interested.
L5
The Reaper
08-18-2004, 13:23
Originally posted by larfive
Hey Sir,
I wonder if they have one for Glock 23 or 19. I would definately be interested.
L5
I do not think so, though there may be a source for a Glock add on rail, frankly, it is probably cheaper and easier to sell your Glock and buy a new one with the built in rail.
TR
I THINK that I heard that Glock will update older pistols to the new style with rail for a fee. I would Contact Glock direct. They should have answers.
bberkley
08-18-2004, 16:42
Glock will replace the lower receiver with a 3rd generation frame with the finger-grooves and accessory rail for a nominal fee. You have to contact Glock in Smyrna, GA and send in your pistol, and they will charge you about $150 or so to replace it.
I have a sig 220, but it doesn't have a rail system. My question is, are there any good lights, that don't use a rail or should I spend the money and get a rail mounted on it?
Some of the older Surefire systems didn't require a rail but I'm not 100% on whether they work on the Sig 226/220 weapons or if they're even still available.
/edit:
http://www.action-lights.com/product_detail-4673.asp?bhcp=1
It appears that they are still available.
geronimo
09-04-2004, 22:42
They are still available. I don't know the model #'s but a quick call to surefire can fix that for you.
Roguish Lawyer
12-21-2004, 19:30
So, where are we on the handgun lights?
I found this online with my googleFU. I know nothing about this company. Can this price be beat by anyone's contact on the group price?
$189.00 http://www.botac.com/surefirex200.html
I had a very bad experience with that company. Ordered a gun safe from them based on assurance of prompt shipment, then they were out of stock and did not ship and I ultimately had to cancel the order. That did not stop them from putting me on a seriously annoying e-mail list that spammed the living daylights out of me for a while.
Perhaps this was an isolated event, but I do not plan to buy anything from them again.
The Reaper
12-21-2004, 19:39
Agreed, I would avoid Botach like the plague.
TR
Smokin Joe
12-21-2004, 23:27
Agreed, I would avoid Botach like the plague.
TR
Ditto that. I had SEVERAL instances where they did not delivery as promised.
Shark Bait
12-22-2004, 09:42
For those of you who are interested, there is an armorer here at the Dept. of Energy who makes rail mounts. I don't know what he wants for them, but if you're interested I can get his contact info for you.
Endorphin Rush
12-23-2004, 03:37
Guys,
Check out www.safetysystemscorp.com. Our team has ordered from them in the past and have been pleased. They do not stock every item all of the time, so there may be a backorder, but it is usually a reasonable amount of time. I just spoke with a sales rep there within the last week or two and they had the Surefire X200's on sale for 185.00. Yeah, that's no typo...185.00.
You can request a quote online via their website, if interested...especially if it will be a large group order.
The Reaper
12-23-2004, 09:00
Safety Systems is good.
877 653-1103
TR
I recently acquired via Ebay a 3 volt Surefire weapon light that mounts on a Browning Hi Power. No rail necessary, it mounts using the tail of the slide release on the right side of the gun, along with a setscrew that puts pressure on the trigger guard and eliminates "wobble". this particular light came out of Israel and was "Israeli Engineered" to better suit the preferences of the unit using it. It has had the tape switch removed and heplaced with a Toggle switch mounted along the left side of the gun, placed far enough back so that the thumb of either hand can be used to operate it. I had never seen a switching system like this and have been quite pleased with it thusfar. Now, since I have a light, Looks like I will need to put a hi power at the top of my list of guns to buy :D
Sacamuelas
01-16-2005, 18:32
I like the way you think Air. :D Now it is a NECESSITY to get the pistol, otherwise it would be a waste of money to have the light. THat type thinking and logic will serve you well in a future marriage.
I was at a gunshow today, didn't see a Browning Hi Power but did see one of Frontsight's pump handle pistols (P7) for $835 (used).
Almost bought the HK just so I can get some of those custom made Fire Dragon Red grips for my wife. :D
I apologize for resurrecting an old thread, but I didn't see the sense in creating a new one when the pictures I want to reference are in this one.
I noticed the rail on TR's P13 is rather wide, about the same as the integral rails we are seeing these days on Kimbers, Springfields, Paras, etc. I have a 1993 era P14 that I would love to mount my new X200B on, but I saw the Dawson Precision rail in a recent magazine. It is significantly narrower, but appears to mount the X200 w/o a problem.
Has anyone seen these in person?
Go to this http://www.dawsonprecision.com/images/DPCatalog44.pdf link and on Page 15 you will see the narrow rail on the side.
Here is another view:
http://www3.mailordercentral.com/shootingstore/prodinfo.asp?number=023-012&variation=&aitem=1&mitem=12
Any thoughts would be greatly appreciated.
V/R
KM
The Reaper
12-06-2005, 17:36
The rail that I have on the P-13 is a Caspian, it is the same general dimensions as almost all of the other add-on rails.
The Dawson is a proprietary low-profile set-up that requires an adapter for the X200 light.
It is small enough that some stock handgun holsters will still take the pistol with the rail mounted.
AFAIK, no one else makes or uses the Dawson rail on their factory guns, the others are mainly M1913 Picatinny or Universal rail slotted. The SureFire X200 comes with both rail adapters. The H&K used a proprietary rail on older models, their new P2000 uses a standard Picatinny rail.
You should be able to mount the Dawson rail and use the X200A or B with the Dawson adapter. I have no experience with the durability of the Dawson rail, it seems to me that smaller would get more stress, but Dawson builds good stuff.
HTH.
TR
Thanks TR! I'll probably hold off for now then. I've been looking for an excuse to buy the SA MC Operator anyway. :D
Has anyone seen just the new switch assembly for sale to retrofit an older x200A?
I've had mine for a year and a half, love the x200. Way better than an M3.
The Reaper
12-06-2005, 20:29
Has anyone seen just the new switch assembly for sale to retrofit an older x200A?
I've had mine for a year and a half, love the x200. Way better than an M3.
The TG, the SL, or the DG switch, and for what weapon?
TR
I have an x200A with the standard rocker switch.
I was looking at the new x200B and one of them had a remote switch that has the activator on a tape switch that mounts under the trigger guard.
But I haven't seen just the remote switch assembly for sale anywhere.
I'd like to get the switch, and put it on my x200A.
The Reaper
12-06-2005, 21:14
The TG, the SL, or the DG switch, and for what weapon?
TR
You still haven't answered the questions.
There are three switch types for a number of different weapons.
TR
You still haven't answered the questions.
There are three switch types for a number of different weapons.
TR
Not sure. I have a X200 (not marked A or B, but it is an A), it likes to live on a Glock 21. The only marking on the body is A01606. There are no markings on the tail switch either inside or outside.
The Reaper
12-06-2005, 22:29
Not sure. I have a X200 (not marked A or B, but it is an A), it likes to live on a Glock 21. The only marking on the body is A01606. There are no markings on the tail switch either inside or outside.
Finally!
You do have an X200A and you can retrofit the TG-11, SL-11, or DG-11 switches for the Glock by snapping off the switch cover and snapping on the appropriate tape switch.
I recommend the DG switch, and would suggest that for anyone shopping, the X200B is a much better weapons light for most situations.
Call the factory, ask for the Customer Service Department, and tell them that you are LE when you order. The switches are between $55 and $65 each.
TR
Peregrino
12-06-2005, 22:32
Not sure. I have a X200 (not marked A or B, but it is an A), it likes to live on a Glock 21. The only marking on the body is A01606. There are no markings on the tail switch either inside or outside.
You might want to finish that beer and call it quits for the night. :rolleyes:
1) The switches are available from SureFire.
2) There are three different styles.
3) There are 5-6 different configurations of each style depending on what weapon you want to put it on.
We (finally) got the Glock 21 part but you still need to answer the rest of the question.
I recommend the DG version.
FWIW - Peregrino
What TR said - he beat me out the gate.
OK - thanks!
Shit... I didn't know there were 3 different switch assemblies.
"Got the old one, need the new one... ooohh ooohh shiny thing for the gun!" isn't good enough? :D
Sorry about that, when I bought the light there were no options for switches. There was no discussion about what weapon or switch so I thought the x200 was universal. I just asked for a Surefire x200, got one, put it on the gun, good to go.
If you try to buy an x200B on the web it says "Accepts optional pressure-activated switch that extends under trigger guard." No mention of the switch or weapon type and no option to buy one.
Damn it... If anyone is looking for the same info, look here first. I snipped this from a .pdf of a newer catalog with the info:
http://img457.imageshack.us/img457/7519/x200switches8it.jpg
Team Sergeant
12-07-2005, 08:27
Now here's a good look at the DG switch.....
(X200 on steroids;) )
Now here's a good look at the DG switch.....
(X200 on steroids;) )
Damn.....TS has all the toys! ;)
What model? P115C, W115C/D
I've got the tactical and had a GG&G mount. It squeezed a bit much and made it difficult for the slide to rack forward hard back into battery. If I loosened it I could shoot it loose in 2 mags (low power, Winchester WB).
Interested in finding out which one, don't need it, just want it. :D
Now here's a good look at the DG switch.....
(X200 on steroids;) )
Nice - how big is the holster!?
Team Sergeant
12-07-2005, 13:08
Millennium M115C/M115D Handgun WeaponLight
A quantum leap in power! This three-battery, 9-volt system provides an amazingly bright 125 lumens for one hour or 225 blinding lumens for 20 minutes, making it the brightest handgun-mounted light available. Constructed from aerospace grade aluminum, Millennium Series Handgun WeaponLights feature a shock isolated bezel and lamp assembly designed to withstand repeated recoil. Key components of Millennium Series Handgun WeaponLights are compatible with Millennium WeaponLights for long guns and the Special Operations series of handheld lights, allowing for in-the-field parts swapping. All systems are MilSpec hard anodized for maximum resistance to the elements.
The M115C features both a SlimLine grip-activated momentary switch and a constant-on shuttle switch. The M115D features a SlimLine grip-activated momentary switch and a system disable shuttle switch. The "C" -- or Constant-on -- option is useful when there is a need to keep the light on for extended periods of time, or for users -- such as K9 officers -- who cannot switch to a handheld flashlight because they must keep weapon and leash in hand. The "D" -- or Disable -- option allows the light to be locked in the OFF position, decreasing the chance that the light will be accidentally activated during covert operations or during storage or transport.
No holster, I carry it in a rucksack.....
Team Sergeant
12-07-2005, 19:59
Now here's a good look at the DG switch.....
(X200 on steroids;) )
I got the switch name wrong, its an SL and not a DG switch!
TS
ChandlerSniper
12-07-2005, 21:54
I got the switch name wrong, its an SL and not a DG switch!
TS
I didn`t want to correct ya in your own house there pal.
Team Sergeant
12-08-2005, 08:08
I didn`t want to correct ya in your own house there pal.
You're full of cow manure, your'e PO'ed I beat you to it!:p Even I will admit when I'm wrong!
TS
Sindervhit
12-11-2005, 13:54
Now here's a good look at the DG switch.....
(X200 on steroids;) )
I had that EXACT Surefire on mine before I got my X200. Nice to see another HK fan in here! I love my X200a, but kinda wish I'd held out for the 'b' version instead.
I just ordered an X200B and DG switch for Glock 22 from Surefire. LE/Mil prices were $270.00 shipped for both. They had the switch in stock but the X200B's are on backorder. For those that already have an X200, I think the DG switch was $45.00 LE/Mil pricing.
I just ordered an X200B and DG switch for Glock 22 from Surefire. LE/Mil prices were $270.00 shipped for both. They had the switch in stock but the X200B's are on backorder. For those that already have an X200, I think the DG switch was $45.00 LE/Mil pricing.
For LEO/Mil pricing take 25% off the MSRP on their site. Helluva deal!! :cool:
You can bargin shop a decent gun light setup. Its not nearly as sexy as the wonderfull lights from surefire that have been showcased on this thread, however for under $40 you can get a G2 Nitrolon ($35) and some Tasco weaver stlye scope rings from CDNN ($3.99). Put them together and they fit nicely on just about any type of pistol with a rail (with the exception of the Sig Pro).
With a little bit of work you can get the setup very nicely balanced and it is easy to use. The change to point of impact is minimal and with a bit of range work should not be a factor.
1911detective
01-01-2006, 17:08
Its sounds like from the posts that an allloy frame (i.e. my P13 limited Alloy) might not be able to take a rail, has anyone seen one or been told that it's just not possible?
The Reaper
01-01-2006, 18:10
Its sounds like from the posts that an allloy frame (i.e. my P13 limited Alloy) might not be able to take a rail, has anyone seen one or been told that it's just not possible?
1911, you need to fill in your profile, read all of the stickies and intros, and post an intro in the proper place before posting again elsewhere.
TR
I had that EXACT Surefire on mine before I got my X200. Nice to see another HK fan in here! I love my X200a, but kinda wish I'd held out for the 'b' version instead.
I like the flash hider on that USP Tactical :)
I am not sure where to find the rational for affixing a light on your firearm. I was always told, Prior 1980 told to stay away from light sources. I like the darkness and move, or use to move quite well in it. Even in LEO training, We were told to keep the light away from you. Working in darkness the guy with the light is a bullet magnet. It blinds you where you can only see in that thin tunnel of light. I could never see having a lit base in RVN. It is a lot easier to look into a lit base, than to look out.
Maybe this is just a bush Marine Bias. If I was hunting varmints at night, a red light affixed to the rifle would be OK, after all four legged varmints don't shoot back.
So I am puzzled or just way out of touch. I like the new lights for providing light when needed, especially in policing situation. Been meaning to ask this for a long time. I was hoping I would find a reason before now.
Peregrino
01-31-2006, 16:22
I am not sure where to find the rational for affixing a light on your firearm. I was always told, Prior 1980 told to stay away from light sources. I like the darkness and move, or use to move quite well in it. Even in LEO training, We were told to keep the light away from you. Working in darkness the guy with the light is a bullet magnet. It blinds you where you can only see in that thin tunnel of light. I could never see having a lit base in RVN. It is a lot easier to look into a lit base, than to look out.
Maybe this is just a bush Marine Bias. If I was hunting varmints at night, a red light affixed to the rifle would be OK, after all four legged varmints don't shoot back.
So I am puzzled or just way out of touch. I like the new lights for providing light when needed, especially in policing situation. Been meaning to ask this for a long time. I was hoping I would find a reason before now.
HOLLiS - Fair question, the answer to which I've been working on for about a year now (writing training/lesson plans for SureFire). Bottom line - lights are just another tool. Knowing how to use them effectively and when it is appropriate to use them is vital - otherwise you have the "blind bullet magnet" you refer to. It's important to remember that LEOs and military have very different operational requirements. As an LEO you spend the majority of your time using a handheld flashlight for navigation and searching. Your most probable adversary doesn't really want to mix it up with you (a recent search of the available literature does not show ANY LEO ever being shot while using a light). The military on the other hand can expect their adversaries to respond violently to any breach of noise/light discipline. Yet true weapon mounted tactical lights are one of the most important pieces of accessory equipment being used by every class of soldier in the current conflict. At short range in confined spaces (CQB) they are a phenomenal asset. Outdoors or in a rural environment they are significantly less useful and expose the user to observation and fire. Lights can be seen and targeted from much further away than they will illuminate (inverse square law). That's why the military uses IR covers, NVGs, and worrys about "white light ADs" as they move into an assault position. When the action does kick off then they go to white light until it's over. (Now if we could just convince them to use the lights intermittently!) I've got days (actually nights) worth of training materials for teaching this stuff but it all boils down to toolbox and training. Analyze your mission requirements and select the TTPs appropriate to the METT-T. FWIW - Peregrino
Peregrino, Thank you for the responce. When I was in LE, I had a 5 and 7 cell mag light. It doubled as a baton in a emergency, with out being offensive as in pulling a baton on a regular civilian, and provided the necessary light.
I can see lighting as a tool. I think with all craftsman, it is how one can employ a tool or their tools that makes them a craftsman. Otherwise we are monkeys imitating craftsman.
I live rural, and prefer darkness. I am not in LEO or active military anymore and prefer to use the darkness to my advantage.
In LE, the light on the handgun also helps out when you just don't have enough hands. A few examples are when you have a suspect at gunpoint at night and you are by yourself, the light on the handgun allows you to keep the suspect covered and illuminated and still allows a free hand to use your radio to call for help. It also helps out when searching buildings where you have a lot of obstacles that you need to navigate. The light has been very handy when climbing up ladders to search attic crawl spaces or when popping up onto a rooftop.
I trained with Ken Good at Strategos and based on his training, I really do try and keep the flashlight away from me as much as I can when searching. I finally got my X200b with the DG switch in and it really made a difference when doing building searches. I got to use it for the first time during our inservice training (it fit's on Sims and airsoft guns but was a pain to get back off). What I ended up doing was primarily using the hand held flashlight and then switched to the handgun light when I was in situations like mentioned above. The LED light was awesome and the dg switch made it much more user friendly then the M3.
I got the switch!! It was only back ordered 4 months! The cust svc guy I talked to tried to get me to not order it... i just told him to order it and send it when they got it. ;)
I like it. I like being able to manipulate the light and use my off hand for opening doors, using the radio, etc. the switch is more squared off than the bubble type one I played with before.
I'd post pics... but it is a Glock 21 w/ an x200 - I'm sure you can use your imagination.
I have been using the M6 from Stream light. It has the constant on switch and the temporary pressure switch. It also has the off switch to reduce the chance of an accidental light discharge. Like TS said I just keep it on my rig and use it as a standard hand held light source when needed.
a recent search of the available literature does not show ANY LEO ever being shot while using a light
take it for what it's worth, but the last gun mag I perused had a taclight ad from surefire that showed a shot handheld model. Story said rookie got shot with the light doing a traffic stop, but was able to return fire and eliminate the threat, albeit slightly later than would have been preferred.
this HK UTL works for me. Takes "military issue" pressure switches since Insight technology built it. Bright enough, dealt with what I've tossed at it, and it swaps to the wife's compact if need be.
Homemade Representation (http://www.skynet-mk2.com/photos/P's%20stuff/DVC00349.JPG)