View Full Version : Unit Crest Identification
I'm posting this here because "Briefback" looked like it was just for SF history - and this isn't SF history, it's Army history. And, I do want to give these away to good homes but that isn't really a "Buy/Sell/Trade" so "the Cache" didn't seem to work either. So if I'm in the wrong place I apologize, I tried!
I've just inherited all of my grandfather's Army things - which really means, that he was a pack rat and kept EVERYTHING over his 30 year career and then he was also really sentimental and decorated everything in Army. I sort of lost my mind when going through all of his stuff and felt unequal to the task of being the keeper when my dad told me that I was still the best person for the job because I'd be able to decide what was appropriate to keep in the family and what just needed to find good homes elsewhere. We were loathe to just turn anything over to the estate liquidators for someone to come in and finger through his life for a dime.
Bringing us to this - my first identification and adoption.
I have around 25 of these solid oak framed unit crests. We've taken out the ones that mean something to us, and the ones that we know already have clear homes - but there are some that I haven't got the first clue where to start because I don't know the name of the unit. I'm hoping that some of you can help me identify the units and then, if you have an attachment to the unit - you might want to adopt this nicely framed piece of vintage history - because you are the types of homes I'd really like to send these into. I'd guess these are about 30 years old. My grandfather died in 1982 and he likely framed all of these up somewhere between his retirement in 1962 and 1975 when he began getting quite ill.
Thanks for your help.
Your first post, middle picture is as it seems: Ft. Leavenworth. The actual crest that is worn as a uniform item is the shield with 3 oil lamps. 4th is the 29th Infantry Regiment.
Your second post is the 4th Infantry Regiment and USARSO crest. US Army South. I remember that being one of the last assignments a friend took before ending his service. He like Ft. Buchanan, of course, he was born just up the road and grew up there. ;)
As for the others, I'm unsure.
Did you try the Institute of Heraldry?
http://www.tioh.hqda.pentagon.mil/
http://www.tioh.hqda.pentagon.mil/DUI_SSI_COA_page.htm
Hope this helps you find other worthy homes for these.
Ret10Echo
04-01-2008, 04:33
Shar,
Knowing what career field/branch your grandfather was might narrow the scope a bit.
R10
Shar, I think the Ship, as a patch worn on the right pocket blouse pocket with the words "jungle school" was from/in panama. Would love to see them all!!!
Shar,
Knowing what career field/branch your grandfather was might narrow the scope a bit.
R10
He was infantry - and I have all of his obituary and a ton of his paperwork which has helped some with a bunch of the others, but there are (obviously) some REALLY obscure patches. My dad was careeer Army and my husband is active duty and we're all still trying to piece this together.
Over the course of his career he was in the Phillipines, Panama, Europe, Korea, and all over the US (but I know he was in GA, WY, NY, MA, KS, DC).
I appreciate the link posted, my husband sent me that last night too.
I'll post a few of the photos I sent to my husband for identification. These are the ones I figured I should have known and felt dumb asking you guys about. :p I know one is ARCENT and one is TRADOC but I'm stumped from there. These are all up for adoption too. I'll take photos of the others later.
I'll post a few of the photos I sent to my husband for identification. These are the ones I figured I should have known and felt dumb asking you guys about. :p I know one is ARCENT and one is TRADOC but I'm stumped from there. These are all up for adoption too. I'll take photos of the others later.
USAREUR, 3rd Army, 2nd Something or other, FORSCOM and 6th Army...
I just spent some time looking at every crest on the heraldry site and found two more (the 1st and 5th at the top):
the blue Sea Lion is for the Phillipine Command
the AF is for Allied Forces Headquarters
the single oil lamp (we lead the way) is 29th INF REG - which apparently was my grandfather's first assignment at Ft. Benning in 1932
- as they are being identified they are making sense to me based on his history, but it is very convoluted and I would suggest to all of you that you do a really good job writing down your entire military history to include all of your units and associations, interesting stories, etc. because even though it may seem really clear and documented to you (and believe me, my grandfather kept everything and wrote down TONS) there are still certain things that are a mystery to us. This isn't the biggest hole in the puzzle, we've got a couple other things to unravel that are going to take me some serious time and digging.
...and you see I'm a nerd at this because I flipped TRADOC and FORSCOM.
:o
x SF med
04-01-2008, 09:20
shar - the Polar Bear / Fish is a unit of the 10th Mtn Div - I have a friend who would really like that one - it was his unit. Let me know.
I was just corrected - apparently the sword shield isn't USAREUR, it is SHAEF. The background is black.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SHAEF
The only ones left to identify are:
- the fist in armor holding the torch and I wonder if it has to do with NYC. They lived on Governor's Island for awhile while he was the first Chief of Staff of the US Army delegation to the UN. Could it be something to do with that? It kind of looks like the Statue of Liberty.
- to fully identify the "II" 2nd something one...
Thanks guys!!!
Oh and they still need homes, or ideas for me to where to adopt them out.
shar - the Polar Bear / Fish is a unit of the 10th Mtn Div - I have a friend who would really like that one - it was his unit. Let me know.
Which one? The blue one with the sea lion/dragon looking thing is Panama I believe. http://www.tioh.hqda.pentagon.mil/Alpha/Philippine%20Command.htm
The one I've just attached is the only one I know of that is attached to the 10th MTN (right now anyway). If he wants this one - it's his. This one is the 31st INF that is now up there at 10th MTN. Is there another one that's got 10th MTN history? Let me know and I'll reserve it for him.
x SF med
04-01-2008, 09:32
Which one? The blue one with the sea lion/dragon looking thing is Panama I believe. http://www.tioh.hqda.pentagon.mil/Alpha/Philippine%20Command.htm
The one I've just attached is the only one I know of that is attached to the 10th MTN (right now anyway). If he wants this one - it's his. This one is the 31st INF that is now up there at 10th MTN. Is there another one that's got 10th MTN history? Let me know and I'll reserve it for him.
31st INF is the one I meant. PM me and I'll pay shipping and whatever you deem appropriate for the item itself.
USAREUR, 3rd Army, 2nd Something or other, FORSCOM and 6th Army...
Shar: Its the 2d Corps. Erwin Rommell handed members of this unit, their head at a place called Kaserine Pass.
The CG was relieved of duty and the unit was re-organized under the leadership of Geo. S. Patton.
Go For Broke
04-01-2008, 16:05
I believe that the second picture, in your initial set is the Army War College -
Crest: On a wreath of the colors (Argent and Azure) a dexter mailed hand Sable, holding a torch inflamed Proper.
The Institute of Heraldry (http://www.tioh.hqda.pentagon.mil/Schools/Army%20War%20College.htm)
As to where he was at the time..."The device was originally approved for the Army War College, Washington Barracks, D.C. on 6 Dec 1910. It was reassigned on 14 Jul 1950 for the Army War College, Fort Leavenworth, KS. On 1 Aug 1951 the device was reassigned for the Army War College, Carlisle Barracks, PA."
V/R,
the blue Sea Lion is for the Phillipine Command
Shar,
Nope, it was the Philippine Department. Prior to WW2 both the philippines and Hawaii were called Departments, not commands. Those are some nice plaques.
Richard
Shar,
The blue circular patch with white galleon and red Maltese cross is for the Caribbean Defense Command.
Richard
I finished opening all the boxes today and found one more that wasn't with the rest. It's obviously something to do with Thailand - but I'm not sure the exact title. If anyone is interested in these three, they don't have homes yet. In fact the only ones that are taken are the 31st Inf and the Phillipine Department plus the ones I'll shown here on this post. Someone asked earlier to see the whole collection - so I've posted what I have here. My dad kept the rest.
I appreciate all of your help with identification. I'm positive my grandfather would be happiest knowing that I was doing this with his belonging rather then just dumping them or putting them in a closet somewhere.
The rest - and these do have homes.
Shar,
The mailed fist holding the torch is a part of the crest for the Army War College. a dexter mailed hand Sable, holding a torch inflamed Proper
An interesting collection.
Richard :munchin
Shar,
The maroon and green striped dui belongs to the 4th Infantry Regiment.
Richard:lifter
Image 1273 is the "Follow Me" patch of the United States Army Infantry School, Ft. Benning, Georgia. It's the patch I wore for six months during OCS in 1971/72, and that my instructors wore for Airborne and Pathfinder schools. If no one else desires that item, I wil gladly pay shipping and/or a donation to any cause you want.
Image 1273 is the "Follow Me" patch of the United States Army Infantry School, Ft. Benning, Georgia. It's the patch I wore for six months during OCS in 1971/72, and that my instructors wore for Airborne and Pathfinder schools. If no one else desires that item, I wil gladly pay shipping and/or a donation to any cause you want.
You got it!
Shar, The Eagle may be Cloisonné, an ancient metalworking technique, that is an enamel process used to produce jewelry, vases, and other decorative items. I would suggest that you check the metal. If the Object proves postive it could be very valable. The process alone is worth some serious cash. A time consuming process to produced and this process called cloisonné is highly collectable and sought after by collectors.
Shar, The Eagle may be Cloisonné, an ancient metalworking technique, that is an enamel process used to produce jewelry, vases, and other decorative items. I would suggest that you check the metal. If the Object proves postive it could be very valable. The process alone is worth some serious cash. A time consuming process to produced and this process called cloisonné is highly collectable and sought after by collectors.
I appreciate your bringing that to my attention. I double checked everything and they are all prints. So the value really is mostly sentimental. They are "vintage" prints in that they are older - but they aren't dimensional in any way - just flat printing. I wish I could take them out of the frames and look closer at any inscriptions on the back - but my grandfather really secured them in there and I'd ruin the integrity of the framing.
...and you see I'm a nerd at this because I flipped TRADOC and FORSCOM.:o
Shar,
Today's FORSCOM patch was the AGF (Army Ground Forces) patch in WW2 and the CONARC (Continental Army Command as in continental USA forces) after that. It didn't become FORSCOM until 1973. I remember it being CONARC when I left for USASFT and it was FORSCOM when I returned to Fort Bragg.
Richard
Well, I was wrong. They aren't prints - they are paintings. I opened one of them up as the "backing" was a little warped so I was going to put new backing on it. It wasn't the backing - it was the back of the painting surface. I'm going to assume he had someone paint these all for him? None of them are signed or anything but you can clearly see the brush strokes and feel the paint now that it's out of the frame.
They aren't prints - they are paintings. I'm going to assume he had someone paint these all for him? None of them are signed or anything but you can clearly see the brush strokes and feel the paint now that it's out of the frame.
Shar,
I would guess that it is more likely that these paintings were done by a post graphics shop and were made to display in a military unit or schoolhouse (e.g., Infantry Hall or an OCS classroom or the like) building. These are exactly the type of graphics that you used to see all the time in military buildings.
Richard :)