View Full Version : Pay Soars to Keep People in Military
Team Sergeant
04-11-2007, 13:34
Figures this happens after I retired......:rolleyes:
Pay Soars to Keep People in Military
FOXNEWS.COM HOME > POLITICS
Wednesday, April 11, 2007
WASHINGTON — The struggle to entice Army soldiers and Marines to stay in the military, after four years of war in Iraq, has ballooned into a $1 billion campaign, with bonuses soaring nearly sixfold since 2003.
The size and number of bonuses have grown as officials scrambled to meet the steady demand for troops on the battlefields in Iraq and Afghanistan and reverse sporadic shortfalls in the number of National Guard and Reserve soldiers willing to sign on for multiple tours.
Besides underscoring the extraordinary steps the Pentagon must take to maintain fighting forces, the rise in costs for re-enlistment incentives is putting strains on the defense budget, already strapped by the massive costs of waging war and equipping and caring for a modern military.
The bonuses can range from a few thousand dollars to as much as $150,000 for very senior special forces soldiers who re-enlist for six years. All told, the Army and Marines spent $1.03 billion for re-enlistment payments last year, compared with $174 million in 2003, the year the war in Iraq began.
The Associated Press compiled and analyzed the budget figures from the military services for this story.
"War is expensive," said Col. Mike Jones, who oversees retention issues for the National Guard. "Winning a war, however, is less expensive than losing one."
The soaring budget for re-enlistment bonuses — particularly for the Guard and Reserves, which have seen the most dramatic cost increases — has prompted some observers to question whether the country can still afford its volunteer force.
"I believe the whole issue of the affordability of the volunteer force is something we need to look at," said Arnold Punaro, who heads an independent panel established by Congress to study the National Guard and Reserves.
The higher bonuses come as support for the war continues to wane both in Congress and with the American public. That decline is fueling concerns that more soldiers will leave the military under pressure from families who fear the rising death toll and are weary of the lengthy and repeated overseas deployments. The Iraq war has claimed the lives of at least 3,280 U.S. troops to date.
Incentives for Army Guard and Reserve members combined have skyrocketed from about $27 million in 2003 to more than $335 million in 2006.
The active Army, meanwhile, poured more than $600 million into these payments last year, a six-fold increase from $98 million in 2003. The Army gave two out of every three soldiers who re-enlisted a bonus last year, compared to less than two in 10 who received one during 2003.
Those who don't get bonuses are generally in jobs that are not in high demand or are not in war zones. For example, certain artillery crewmembers who re-enlisted outside Afghanistan or Iraq would receive no bonus, said Army spokesman Lt. Col. Bryan Hilferty.
Bonuses for Marines have nearly doubled, from about $50 million in 2003 to nearly $90 million in 2006.
The incentives help the military compete with private employers who often pay much higher salaries, Hilferty said.
"Soldiers with valuable skills and experience are aggressively sought after by industry," Hilferty said. He said while the extra money is important, "people don't re-enlist in a wartime Army for $13,000. ... If soldiers didn't think they were doing the right thing for the right reason, they would get out and get a job back home."
He said soldiers with special skills can get bonuses between $10,000 and $30,000, with a select few eligible for payments up to $50,000. Only very few highly qualified special forces soldiers would get the top bonus of $150,000. Nearly all soldiers deployed to Iraq, Afghanistan and Kuwait get a maximum of $15,000 for re-enlisting, just a bit more than the average.
Bonuses for Marines in certain critical specialties can go as high as $60,000 for a new four-year tour. On average a Marine who re-enlists this year can receive as much as $24,000. About eight in 10 Marines with up to six years of service will get a bonus this year, as will more than half of those with six to 14 years in the Corps.
Punaro, chairman of the Commission on the National Guard and Reserves, calls the soaring costs "a ticking time bomb."
"My instinct tells me ... that the Guard and Reserve will continue to be a real bargain for the taxpayer" because the costs for the active duty military have gone up a lot more, he said.
So far, the extra cash appears to be working. The active Army, the Guard and the Army Reserve are all on track to meet their re-enlistment goals for the fiscal year that will end Sept. 30.
cont;
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,265296,00.html
Sorry TS....I got 25K tax free and have paid off all of my extraneous debt plus some home improvements.
It came about when I was tossing the idea around of re-upping to help the wife and I with consistent paychecks. I had made my decision to do it and was amazed that the bonus was that high, that made the decision easier and I couldn't sign quick enough. :D
Though it was not the sole reason I re-enlisted, it did help. I was not ready to get out, my wife is running a home based business and is just getting started, my BN CSM said he'd keep me (vote of confidence for a support guy from the senior SF NCO in the unit). I like the Army, it is fulfilling, plus Quiet Professionals are by far the best men that I've served with in 9 years of AD service.
Now the 150K is a definate plus, but the fierce competition for contracting is still drawing out some guys. Though the younger guys aren't eligible, they are offered a substantial bonus, and contractors offer more. It's hard to keep people that way. Deployments are really driving the commitment some have. I know of a few guys that are just tired (rightfully so) and said there is an appeal in the money, but it is just not worth it. (which ties into family and SF running head-on with one another - many threads here about it)
Nothing against anyone who re-enlists for money. I re-enlisted twice and was given a bonus (twice) and have benefitted from it. My service has been the greatest benefit of all. I've made friends for life, contacts to utilize upon my departure from service, and a sense of self appreciation to know that I've done something more with my life for others. Not to detract from the subject at hand on bonuses.
Monsoon65
04-11-2007, 14:37
TS:
It always works that way. As soon as you get out, your career field has a ton of cash thrown at it by the way of bonuses.
I've been in for 24 years and have never seen a bonus. I was always in the wrong "zone" for them.
The MILPER message ends on Dec 31 of this year. I'm hoping they renew this message for another two years. I'm going to stay regardless but 150K (less taxes) is a nice added bonus. The rumor mill around battalion had it going up to 250K. I'm not holding my breath.
Team Sergeant
04-11-2007, 16:03
TS:
It always works that way. As soon as you get out, your career field has a ton of cash thrown at it by the way of bonuses.
I've been in for 24 years and have never seen a bonus. I was always in the wrong "zone" for them.
Actually you don't want to know how much I received in bonuses......We did get them in the 80's too!
TS
82ndtrooper
04-11-2007, 17:50
I recieved a signing bonus. Of course it's paid out in 4 installments over the frist two years just to make sure your not grabbing cash and then AWOL over a holiday weekend. I recieved a second bonus for the next 3 years, paid out in stallments also.
I think I spent mine on the guy's in the barracks that didn't have enough drinking money because I sure dont dont have it now. :munchin
Basic pay scales sould be raised anyway for soldiers, sailors and airmen in the first place. If the democrats can peg billions of dollars for shit "Earmarks" then every soldier, sailor and airman should be paid with a real living wage with cost of increases to match the past 20 years inflation index. :mad:
My .02
The Reaper
04-11-2007, 18:00
I'd settle for making all pay and allowances, as well as military retirement, fully non-taxable.
TR
Vandalism
04-11-2007, 18:06
Hope this isn't a repost but it may offer some insight into why the Army upped its retention budget.
WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Tours of duty for members of the U.S. Army will be extended from 12 months to 15 months effective immediately, Defense Secretary Robert Gates announced Wednesday.
"What we're trying to do here is provide some long-term predictability to our soldiers and their families," Gates told reporters at the Pentagon.
In exchange for the extension, Gates said the service will be able to give all units a year at home between deployments.
He denied the order was a sign that the Army has passed its breaking point under the stresses of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, saying the service has met or passed its recruiting and retention goals.
But he added that the military has been "stretched" by the conflicts.
I'd settle for making all pay and allowances, as well as military retirement, fully non-taxable.
+1
82ndtrooper
04-11-2007, 18:39
I'd settle for making all pay and allowances, as well as military retirement, fully non-taxable.
TR
At least the VA disability pension checks are tax exempt. It they are not tax exempt then I have a large bill owed to the IRS. They can come find me if they want to. :rolleyes:
They are never going to get it are they. Bonuses are short term. If they are serious they need to raise the base pay. A base pay bonus will follow you into retirement. Most SF guys can make more then those bonuses in less then a year, working one good contract. If your not fortunate to get it tax free. IMO those bonuses don't add up to much for todays standards
Ret10Echo
04-12-2007, 05:10
I'd settle for making all pay and allowances, as well as military retirement, fully non-taxable.
TR
Your retirement pay can hide from the tax man in several states as I am sure you are aware.(PA, DE and others) but the Fed will hunt you down.
More pay is great, but if they could slide it into a pre-tax dollar something to bury it that would be better, short of the fully non-taxable option.
Eagle5US
04-12-2007, 09:05
Hope this isn't a repost but it may offer some insight into why the Army upped its retention budget.
WASHINGTON (CNN) -- Tours of duty for members of the U.S. Army will be extended from 12 months to 15 months effective immediately, Defense Secretary Robert Gates announced Wednesday.
"What we're trying to do here is provide some long-term predictability to our soldiers and their families," Gates told reporters at the Pentagon.
In exchange for the extension, Gates said the service will be able to give all units a year at home between deployments.
He denied the order was a sign that the Army has passed its breaking point under the stresses of the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, saying the service has met or passed its recruiting and retention goals.
But he added that the military has been "stretched" by the conflicts.
And you know how WE found out about this? WATCHING THE FOOKIN TV in the DFAC. NOT from our Commanders, NOT from our NCO support channel-FROM CN FOOKIN N!!!:mad:
Long term predictability? I had that when they said I would be gone for 12 and home for 12. "Exchange it for 12 months back"??? Whois he kidding? And his comparison with the Corps doing 7 over and 6 back twice over being the same as 15 over and 12 back is plain ludicrous.:rolleyes:
This was a true kick in the nuts this morning...this means that (after leaving in SEP of 06) we aren't even at our halfway point yet.
I am very dissappointed in our leadership...
Eagle
The Reaper
04-12-2007, 09:14
J:
Sorry for your CoC's lack of intestinal fortitude and ability to disseminate bad news.
Why don't you ask the CSM if she was too busy making up uniform policies to take care of soldier welfare and morale.
JK. Let us know if we can be of any assistance.
TR
Eagle5US
04-12-2007, 09:24
J:
Sorry for your CoC's lack of intestinal fortitude and ability to disseminate bad news.
Why don't you ask the CSM if she was too busy making up uniform policies to take care of soldier welfare and morale.
JK. Let us know if we can be of any assistance.
TR
Just sour grapes, Sir-
We have had a truely horrific week here...this just kinda topped it all off for us. Comparitively to those we have serviced this week-our trouble are non-existant.
Sour grapes indeed....
Eagle
...Sorry for your CoC's lack of intestinal fortitude and ability to disseminate bad news.
Why don't you ask the CSM if she was too busy making up uniform policies to take care of soldier welfare and morale......
TR/JK;
A better question to ask is when did the CSM find out. It wouldn't be the first time where the Army released something and it got out to the world on CNN before it got filtered down to the lower level CoC. Bad news don't get better with age. I would hope that the CSM found out the same way JK did and is right now pounding on some other CSM's desk.
Pounding on a CSM's desk doesn't always fix things but it sure does make you feel better.
I can remember pulling into Camp Doha Kuwait one night coming in from the states. The Camp S2 grabbed the three of us and took us over to the S2 Shop. CNN International was running the Bagdad Bombing that President Clinton ordered that night. Everybody just looked at each other and shrugged, Oh well.
Pete
TR/JK;
A better question to ask is when did the CSM find out. It wouldn't be the first time where the Army released something and it got out to the world on CNN before it got filtered down to the lower level CoC.
I can bet you they ALL Knew about this. I know about it happening while In A-stan.. About a month ago.
I tell me Conventional Friends.. You guys need to think about that trip to the Dark Side and drop that SF Package ASAP.
What does the DoD think this will do to the Amry and the Military.. Hell the Military families?? Those Cats in them high seats just sit back becuase most haven't done a combat tour, never will be gone for more than 2 Wks from home. SO they don't really know or care about what the foot soldiers or ground pounders tours are. Sad day when the news of the 15 Month tours.. Sad.
As for the bonuses.. They are short term and to me the 150,000 doesn't cover what we SF can make on a contract job. Yes we can make that money, and the bonus for SF needs to go up. The DoD needs to look at uping the EOD Bonus too, those guys can go out and get contracts at the 200K levels in Iraq. I think they just got a up SADP. Not sure of the amount, but I think it was only 250.00.
Vandalism
04-15-2007, 16:22
How long are SF tours usually? I've heard Ranger companies only do three months at a time.
Did you catch the point where they're going to 'give' the troop an extra $1,000 a month for each month past 12 if they are extended? I notified my son he was being extended and his answer was - sh*t! They heard nothing from their command structure.
Vandalism
04-15-2007, 16:50
The extra 1,000 a month has been policy since the invasion. If I'm not mistaken the only units to have been extended past 12 months until now have been 2nd BCT 1 AD and 172 Stryker.
The Reaper
04-15-2007, 16:53
Remember the overly deployed units and the tracking of days deployed per year for extra pay?
That went away as an unfunded mandate pretty quickly after the GWOT started.
How about 365 days deployed in a year?
TR
Monsoon65
04-15-2007, 21:04
Remember the overly deployed units and the tracking of days deployed per year for extra pay?
That went away as an unfunded mandate pretty quickly after the GWOT started.
How about 365 days deployed in a year?
TR
I just checked my LES for that. It says:
"As of 13 Mar 01, 003 high tempo deployment days accrued".
I remember being deployed after 9/11 and reading that program had been put on hold.
Team Sergeant
04-15-2007, 21:39
How long are SF tours usually? I've heard Ranger companies only do three months at a time.
And your point would be?
Don't post again until you PM me with the Ranger mission and the Special Forces mission.
This is not a request.
Team Sergeant
Eagle5US
04-15-2007, 23:28
We are patiently waiting for the $1000 per month "benefit" to be "replaced with something less costly to the USG". Of course, the $1000 pre month replaced the previous $100 per DAY, as the notion of it becoming a reality prompted it to be "too costly".
We have been told that, due to the expense of paying so many soldiers the extra money, a proposal has been put forward by the Dems to instead "offer 2 additional days per month of administrative absence for every moneht deployed over 12. If the soldiers decline the administrative absence days, they can sell them back to the USG at $200 per day ($400 per month)"
So, I have lost between 27 and 30 days leave from "use or lose" each year for the past 3 years. I currently have 74 days leave accrued and am in Iraq. I have been extended and (if this proposal comes to fruition) am being offered 2 ADDITIONAL days of leave per month. Man those folks are generous:D
Id' rather have the leave than nothing, and rather have the money than the leave, but what I would prefer over all of it was the sense that those folks making decisions felt our time and lives here were worth MORE as time goes on and not continually worth LESS.:boohoo
Eagle
Eagle5US
04-18-2007, 13:39
I read this and could only laugh....
3 day weekend-not cash (http://today.reuters.com/news/articlenews.aspx?type=politicsNews&storyid=2007-04-18T184428Z_01_N18308085_RTRUKOC_0_US-USA-MILITARY-PAY.xml&src=rss&rpc=22)
excerpt:
Under the new Pentagon policy, active-duty troops will get one day off for every month their deployment extends beyond 12 months in a three-year period. If deployment extends to more than 18 months out of 36, two days per month will be granted.:rolleyes:
What a f*^king joke. And I don't swear that often in my old age. But this is degrading.
Who are they trying to kid here anyway? THIS is all my time in a CZ is worth? Less than an hour a friggin day?
They are trying real hard to push folks out of the Army. Real hard.
Eagle :mad:
I read this and could only laugh....
3 day weekend-not cash (http://today.reuters.com/news/articlenews.aspx?type=politicsNews&storyid=2007-04-18T184428Z_01_N18308085_RTRUKOC_0_US-USA-MILITARY-PAY.xml&src=rss&rpc=22)
excerpt:
Under the new Pentagon policy, active-duty troops will get one day off for every month their deployment extends beyond 12 months in a three-year period. If deployment extends to more than 18 months out of 36, two days per month will be granted.:rolleyes:
What a f*^king joke. And I don't swear that often in my old age. But this is degrading.
Who are they trying to kid here anyway? THIS is all my time in a CZ is worth? Less than an hour a friggin day?
They are trying real hard to push folks out of the Army. Real hard.
Eagle :mad:
:mad: This is more than stupid; it's insulting - especially for those who are in a use-or-loose situation BECAUSE of the deployments. There isn't a woodshed big enough to take those jerks into and beat some sense into them!