View Full Version : Israel invades Gaza
Firebeef
06-28-2006, 03:30
Ya gotta hand it to the Israelis. When they say "we're gonna bring ya home", they mean it!
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/13580436/
x SF med
06-28-2006, 06:50
Trained a little with them when I was in - they don't mess around.
Team Sergeant
06-28-2006, 08:47
The Israelis are also demonstrating their sense of a formidable national "resolve", one I wish we enjoyed.
I'm betting more than one coward in the hamas leadership filled his pants when the Israelis entered Gaza this time.
TS
I was watching this unfold at 2am local time. My heart indeed filled with pride, not because we stronger than them, not because we are flexing, but because we deployed, tanks, apc's, SF, infantry (1000's), to get one abducted soldier back.
Now it is clear the Qassam issue will also be resolved now, but there is no mistake that this is to pressure Hamas to release this poor youngster.
I am not certain we will get him back alive, but we have to try.
Hoepoe
Proud
I hope that we get an "aleph aleph" on Khaled Meshal and his photo gets a nice red X on it.
With another reported kidnapping (making this 3) this episode is seems to be getting right dirty.
I hope that we get an "aleph aleph" on Khaled Meshal and his photo gets a nice red X on it.
With another reported kidnapping (making this 3) this episode is seems to be getting right dirty.
What 3rd one Dan?
edit: Ok, i saw.
About Friggin time you post here! :-)
Hoepoe
CNN has just reported the Israel jets have done a fly by over the Syrian presidents house.
Team Sergeant
06-28-2006, 13:04
CNN has just reported the Israel jets have done a fly by over the Syrian presidents house.
I saw that, now that had me laughing out loud....... guess who else filled his pants.......
I'm sure a priceless momnet was lost. I wish I could have seen syrian dicators face when he was told "those are not our jets...."
What is surprising is the report that the Syrian guns did not fire at our planes until after they had left the airspace.
Team Sergeant
06-28-2006, 14:41
What is surprising is the report that the Syrian guns did not fire at our planes until after they had left the airspace.
I don't find that "surprising".;)
Smokin Joe
06-28-2006, 17:40
Good for them!
Nothing I respect more than a no BS response to a BS hostile act.
You kidnap one of ours, we invade your country (or the country that hosts you either way). Keep up the great work Israel! :lifter
Saw this on a site and had to Goggle it. Found that it seems true. Two finds 1 (http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,20867,19645805-2703,00.html) & 2 (http://www.aljazeera.com/me.asp?service_ID=11486)
Man talk about making an AO just Blow up!! :eek:
ISRAEL last night threatened to assassinate Palestinian Prime Minister Ismael Haniyeh if Hamas militants did not release a captured Israeli soldier unharmed.
The unprecedented warning was delivered to Palestinian President Mahmoud Abbas in a letter as Israel debated a deal offered by Hamas to free Corporal Gilad Shalit.
It came as Israeli military officials readied a second invasion force for a huge offensive into Gaza.
Hamas's Gaza-based political leaders, including Mr Haniyeh, had already gone into hiding.
But last night's direct threat to kill Mr Haniyeh, a democratically elected head of state, sharply raised the stakes.
The bid to free Corporal Shalit was brokered by Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak, who last night warned Hamas it faced severe consequences if it did not curb its "extreme stance" and described the growing conflict as a lightning rod for Palestinian vengeance.
Jerusalem has made no official comment, but Egyptian state media said Israel had found the offer unacceptable. Israel has not spelt out the terms demanded by Hamas, but earlier this week it refused to buy into talk of a prisoner swap.
Thousands of Hamas supporters protested in Gaza City late on Thursday over the arrest by Israeli forces of up to 32 Hamas MPs on the West Bank that day.
A Hamas spokesman said the group would never recognise Israel, in spite of a deal its leaders signed this week offering implicit recognition of the Jewish state in return for easing an economic blockade.
Israeli fighter jets bombed 20 targets in Gaza, including the Interior Ministry, which it said had been used by militants to stage meetings, while artillery hit the northern strip with 500 shells in the 24 hours until yesterday morning.
Jewish settler Eliyahu Asheri, who was murdered by militants this week, was buried on Thursday as leaders of the Popular Resistance Committees pledged to seize more hostages in the West Bank. No further word has emerged about another suspected Jewish hostage, Noach Moskowitz, who Israeli police said was found dead hours after Mr Asheri's remains were found.
Much of Gaza, including two main hospitals, was without power and running water as a UN aid chief warned that the 1.4 million residents of the strip were three days away from a humanitarian crisis.
"They are heading for the abyss unless they get electricity and fuel restored," said emergency relief co-ordinator Jan Egeland, who urged militants to free Corporal Shalit and stop firing rockets into Israel.
Residents complain that sonic booms caused by Israeli jets traumatise children and that shelling confines families to their homes.
Israeli Prime Minister Ehud Olmert has vowed the military will do all it can to avoid civilian deaths if a full-scale assault is launched.
Mr Olmert said the decision to invade northern Gaza had already been delayed to allow Mr Mubarak's negotiations to continue.
The arrested Hamas legislators have been sent to security prisons and many will stand trial on terrorism offences. The detentions have hurt Hamas's already limited ability to govern and are likely to force a regime change.
Israel claims it has intelligence about the area where Corporal Shalit is held, but has been unable to pinpoint the exact location. Mr Olmert said the military would leave the strip if he was unconditionally and safely returned.
I would say with a fair amount of confidence that the Syrian Air Defense sites shut their radars off if Israeli jets even look like they are going to cross the border. They more than likely cease all flight ops as well.
I am all for a strong response and am glad Israel has acted. But 1.4 million people without basic services, including hospitals and working electricity to run the water filtration plant seems a bit of a heavy handed response. I empathize with Israel and do not know if I would not demand the same response if I were in their shoes. Why pillage the civilians for the acts of the leaders? I am not sure the children in Gaza should be put in the middle of al this. Hearts and minds, IMHO.
I am all for a strong response and am glad Israel has acted. But 1.4 million people without basic services, including hospitals and working electricity to run the water filtration plant seems a bit of a heavy handed response. I empathize with Israel and do not know if I would not demand the same response if I were in their shoes. Why pillage the civilians for the acts of the leaders? I am not sure the children in Gaza should be put in the middle of al this. Hearts and minds, IMHO.
They voted Hamas into power, they made their bed, time to lie in it.
I also do now want the average man in the street, women or children to suffer, but when it's my woman or child or them, sorry, but it ain't gonna be mine.
Hoepoe
I empathize, Hoepoe. I guess I am not so sure the everyday civilian's suffering will accompolish anything. To me it plants the seeds for more hate among the Palestinians, especially the young. 4-5-6 yr olds without water is pretty henious to me, and not reflective of Israel's ideals as I see them.
I say bury the leadership and assasinate as many PM's as they put up. But kids should be off limits.
I empathize, Hoepoe. I guess I am not so sure the everyday civilian's suffering will accompolish anything. To me it plants the seeds for more hate among the Palestinians, especially the young. 4-5-6 yr olds without water is pretty henious to me, and not reflective of Israel's ideals as I see them.
I say bury the leadership and assasinate as many PM's as they put up. But kids should be off limits.
I couldn't agree more. Kids are kids are kids.
My point was that the people by vast majority voted the Hamas into power and now have to pay the price. Keep in mind that we (IDF) are a humane army and will not let civilians be starved of basic neccessaties as much as possible. On the other hand the IDF has a population to protect. What abour the Qassams landing outside our schools in Sderot?
That doesn't make it right, but we are not the bad guys here.
On the whole i agree, civilians should be left out, but this is a war and since Hamas was voted in this is a war between countries and no longer a war between country and terrorist organization.
The methods used by Hamas are terrorism, but they are in government now, a whole different ballgame. They bear 100% responsibility for civilians suffering. If they let our soldier go, stop the Qassams, we will be out of Gaza in minutes.
Stay safe
Hoepoe
Slantwire
06-30-2006, 14:00
I am all for a strong response and am glad Israel has acted. But 1.4 million people without basic services, including hospitals and working electricity to run the water filtration plant seems a bit of a heavy handed response. I empathize with Israel and do not know if I would not demand the same response if I were in their shoes. Why pillage the civilians for the acts of the leaders? I am not sure the children in Gaza should be put in the middle of al this. Hearts and minds, IMHO.
I doubt Israel could ever make much headway on Palestinian hearts and minds.
I doubt Israel could ever make much headway on Palestinian hearts and minds.
I think over time with the right Pal and Israeli leadership and employment, schools etc., things could work out. I like to believe that anyway. Without hope we have nothing. I hope for peace for my kids.
Most folks aren't born hating, they learn/are taught it.
Hoepoe
I am all for a strong response and am glad Israel has acted. But 1.4 million people without basic services, including hospitals and working electricity to run the water filtration plant seems a bit of a heavy handed response. I empathize with Israel and do not know if I would not demand the same response if I were in their shoes. Why pillage the civilians for the acts of the leaders? I am not sure the children in Gaza should be put in the middle of al this. Hearts and minds, IMHO.
Heavy handed? Heavy handed??? Try to function for just one day not knowing if your wifes trip to the mall will be her last, your kids bus trip home from school will leave him/her maimed for life, your neighbors night out for dinner will be cut short by the ever present threat of mr shahid.
Its the Hamas charter that calls for the destruction of Israel, not the other way round. I know of no Israelis who want this to continue - all that I know well want peace. But peace for the likes of Hamas means the death and destruction of Israel and its people.
So fuck them - fuck them all. They voted in this terrorist organization on the backs of their own children, whom they care for so much.
Exactly!!!!!!!!!!!
Well put Casey. Those kids are taught from day one. They are just as much the enemy as any adult. Yeah, that needs to be fixed. NOT happening anytime soon.
Those that want to play the PC... wah wah thing in that enviroment, will be the loser. Hamas sure as hell won't.
There is only one way in any combat, firefight, war, whatever. Isreal knows what it takes. They aren't into pussyfooting around.
Well said Casey!!
See American have no Idea of what is going on outside of there on town/City. Hell most Americans don't even talk to there neighbors. There are not more Block parties for the 4th of July, hell when was the last one you seen? 10/20/30/40 years ago?
My point is just what Casey said. I live in Israel for two month. My first week there I was walking the Streets of Tel Aviv and Air raid sirens started to going off. I was a 19 Y/O Straight off the street snotty nose kid. Everyone started to stop their cars and get out and people everywhere stopped walking. I look to my friend and Said, "Were ever these people to running to follow them." We didn't know what was going on.
No one ran, no one walked anywhere. They all just stood looking in the same direction, everyone. We just looked at what was going one. The Sirens stopped, the all went back to what they were doing. Cars started to drive away, people got back into buses, and started back walking. We both looked at each other wondering WTF just happen. We stopped someone and asked what just happen? Why?
"It was Yon Kippur Day, and this is what we do to honor our fallen for this great day."
I will never forget that moment in my life.
See American's have everything easy. Yes, we do!! Like Casey said, You, no of us really, have to think about will this be my last day kissing my kids, wife, ETC dropping them off to work or school. Will I see them at the end of the day.
Until you have walked a street that you wonder shit was that a car back firing or was that a bomb. To see a night club that you just were at the night before. Burned down because a sudiser bomber walked into it after you left clubbing. Yes, I have walked the street and wondered if I would die. As a Soldier you lifted your right hand to die for this country, as a Civilian you didn't, So its different IMO.
Yes kids and civilian shouldn't be the targets, and they never are. But, just like what we are running into in Iraq. How in the Hell can you tell the two apart. When the terrorist are walking in the same streets with these kids, and use the kids to run their "items" for them. They use their people as they see it (or Fit), so how can the Army of whatever nation stop that? When the people of the streets don't turn them in to the authorities, what do you do.
Hamas charter not only calls for the destruction of Israel, but the USA. So until you have walked in their shoes. You just don't know. Just like Casey's PIX, did anyone stop those two guys from putting that EFP emplace? Likely NOT.
The Israelis seem to be doing the right things, as far as with the whole peace talks and the walls, the camps ETC. Everything was working out, and there is a lot in the news that isn't being put out. ABC, CNN, CBS, Even FOX don't cover all the little "things" that amount to a lot for the people of Israel. Most in that Area want peace, but when the People of that area who vote in Hamas, a terrorist organization as a political party and there leadership. What would you do if that happen here in America? Hamas lives (runs) their lives IMO on the backs of their own children. They have Imam's teaching their "ways" for what - Mostly for the death of others? For Kids they care for so much for?
IMO this is what the USA should have done in Iraq when we had the First Soldier taken. Now they have gone to taking two guys. Next the will take three of our guys. The use of force in need by a Nation when the means warrant the action because of the action. Hamas is getting what the have delivered onto themselves.
Hopefull this works out for the best. Rant over
Monsoon65
07-01-2006, 17:20
MtnGoat:
I agree. That's what people here can't understand. The enemy isn't playing by the rules that we try to play by. Women and kids are used to move weapons, etc, and when they get killed, the public is up in arms about US troops killing civilians. Doesn't matter if the woman was shooting at troops, or the kid just threw a grenade into a vehicle.
This was done in Vietnam, too, and I'd think that the public would now realise that we are the only ones out there with some sort of ROE.
I am all for a strong response and am glad Israel has acted. But 1.4 million people without basic services, including hospitals and working electricity to run the water filtration plant seems a bit of a heavy handed response. I empathize with Israel and do not know if I would not demand the same response if I were in their shoes. Why pillage the civilians for the acts of the leaders? I am not sure the children in Gaza should be put in the middle of al this. Hearts and minds, IMHO.
:confused:
You have obviously lost your mind.
I can't speak for Israel, but in Iraq the media exaggerated the civilian suffering. Also a favorite trick of the terrorists was to either kill the Iraqi civilians and try to blame us for it, or to try and put civilians in positions were they could be used as human shields (the hospital incident at an-Nasiriyah being the most publicized). I'm sure the Hamas do the same thing.
The kind of solidarity and national support that Israel is showing for one "insignificant" soldier is incredible. I almost wish that I was an Israeli.
Heavy handed? Heavy handed??? Try to function for just one day not knowing if your wifes trip to the mall will be her last, your kids bus trip home from school will leave him/her maimed for life, your neighbors night out for dinner will be cut short by the ever present threat of mr shahid.
Its the Hamas charter that calls for the destruction of Israel, not the other way round. I know of no Israelis who want this to continue - all that I know well want peace. But peace for the likes of Hamas means the death and destruction of Israel and its people.
So fuck them - fuck them all. They voted in this terrorist organization on the backs of their own children, whom they care for so much.
I hear what your saying but I do feel bad for the minority of Palestinians who are stuck in the middle. I had the good fortune to visit Bethlehem a few years ago and went to Mass at a Catholic church and was surprised to find myself surrounded by like 800 Palestinian Christians. The ones that I met were good decent people who just wanted peace with Isreal.
They're getting it from both sides and yet you never hear about their story in the media because their numbers are "insignificant." It's a shite state of affairs for them IMHO.
Until you have walked a street that you wonder shit was that a car back firing or was that a bomb.
I spent four months in Israel before; it is one of the places I want to visit again given the chance. I think that you will find that most people on this board have walked the Streets somewhere. Thinking the above all the time. What we Americans have easy today is because Americans before us suffered and sacrificed. Most Americans do pay attention to what is going on outside their homes. The last election showed that. Mainstream America do's not as a whole listen to the press, Hollywood or only what is on T.V. Stating that Americans have everything easy is wrong.
Team Sergeant
07-02-2006, 15:18
I hear what your saying but I do feel bad for the minority of Palestinians who are stuck in the middle. I had the good fortune to visit Bethlehem a few years ago and went to Mass at a Catholic church and was surprised to find myself surrounded by like 800 Palestinian Christians. The ones that I met were good decent people who just wanted peace with Isreal.
They're getting it from both sides and yet you never hear about their story in the media because their numbers are "insignificant." It's a shite state of affairs for them IMHO.
These are the ones I see out protesting the actions of the hamas terrorists, right?
I have no sympathy either, none, zero.
I've no doubts that if hamas were to stop their cowardly acts of terrorism Israel would leave them alone. How hard is that to understand?
TS
I hear what your saying but I do feel bad for the minority of Palestinians who are stuck in the middle. I had the good fortune to visit Bethlehem a few years ago and went to Mass at a Catholic church and was surprised to find myself surrounded by like 800 Palestinian Christians. The ones that I met were good decent people who just wanted peace with Isreal.
They're getting it from both sides and yet you never hear about their story in the media because their numbers are "insignificant." It's a shite state of affairs for them IMHO.
"Feeling bad" is a luxury you have from here. I've spent years stomping around Tel Aviv, Jerusalem, Netyanya, Netzarim and a plethora of other points, and have found there is no "stuck in the middle". Those few Palestinian Christians understand dhiminitude all too well, and chose to be there - period. You live on the reservation - you have to expect a few indian attacks.
We as a whole body of Americans, had better develop the intestional fortitude shown by our forefathers, a whole lot of these respected FOGs on this board, and the present day warriors who have all moved to fire while understanding that the threat facing us (as well as Israel) is an end game. This constant bleeting of "why is this happening" and "well what about point A, B, & C"??? is mental chaff. When a terrorist organization declares its intent to kill you, your family, friends, albeit your nation, I say believe them.
Anyone not smart enough to get out of the way after this amount of time doesn't need to be reproducing anyway!
I've no doubts that if hamas were to stop their cowardly acts of terrorism Israel would leave them alone. How hard is that to understand?
TS
I agree with you 100%.
[QUOTE=casey]"Feeling bad" is a luxury you have from here. I've spent years stomping around Tel Aviv, Jerusalem, Netyanya, Netzarim and a plethora of other points, and have found there is no "stuck in the middle". Those few Palestinian Christians understand dhiminitude all too well, and chose to be there - period. You live on the reservation - you have to expect a few indian attacks.
I guess I was relating more on a personal level to one particular family I know rather than from a larger socio-political perspective. Sorry for not making that more clear. And this family is most definitely familiar with dhimmitude, having recieved death threats for being involved in peace vigils and not supporting the jihad.[I] They were good people in every sense and very much pro-American and yet living, given their particular circumstances, in a rather untenable situation. Hopefully they'll outlast the terrorists.... as for the rest, well I guess they'll get what's coming to them.
I guess I have the luxury of supporting the actions of the Israeli's while thinking the suffering of young Palestinians sucks.
I have condemned Palestinians for targeting civilians. Taking out the electricity and water supply in Gaza seems to be the same thing.
The Reaper
07-03-2006, 12:23
I guess I have the luxury of supporting the actions of the Israeli's while thinking the suffering of young Palestinians sucks.
I have condemned Palestinians for targeting civilians. Taking out the electricity and water supply in Gaza seems to be the same thing.
So you equate kidnapping, extorsion, and murder with inconvenience. Interesting perspective.
Who is responsible for the continuation of the current situation and who can resolve it?
Should the Israelis trade 1,500 possible terrorists back for their soldier?
Do you think he would be returned by any other means than force?
The Palestinians were given the Gaza back by the Israelis as sovereign territory. They have an elected government. If they are to be a legitimate state, they have to exercise control and governance over their people, and their actions.
Legitimate states do not allow their militias to fire rockets into their neighbor's population centers or murder and abduct their citizens. They resolve these issues internally.
Time for the Hamas government, which was elected by the Palestinian people to govern, or fall.
TR
Time for the Hamas government, which was elected by the Palestinian people to govern, or fall.
TR
That sums it up. Hamas is 100% responsible for the fate of the Palestinian nation.
They need to step up or be stepped on.
Hoepoe
Okay, I do not equate turning off power with terrorism. I never said that. I said it was targeting civilians.
What actually is accomplished by turning off the electrcity and water?
Okay, I do not equate turning off power with terrorism. I never said that. I said it was targeting civilians.
What actually is accomplished by turning off the electrcity and water?
It puts pressure on the world as well as PA to push Hamas into making a positive move.
Did you know that in all the great incursions over the last few days, civilians have NOT been killed and only +-5 militants killed?
The Pal people need to understand that as long as Hamas as a terrorist organization is in power, all will suffer. If they do not, they will simply vote them in again....and suffer.
They (the people) are the ones to force Hamas to change their ways.
Hoepoe
Any word on the Israeli soldier Hoepoe?
Godspeed on that operation.
Karl.Masters
07-03-2006, 16:32
The Palestinians were given the Gaza back by the Israelis as sovereign territory. They have an elected government. If they are to be a legitimate state, they have to exercise control and governance over their people, and their actions.
Legitimate states do not allow their militias to fire rockets into their neighbor's population centers or murder and abduct their citizens. They resolve these issues internally.
Time for the Hamas government, which was elected by the Palestinian people to govern, or fall.
TR
TR - I think you have captured the strategic issues facing the Hamas government.
Hamas government foreign policy is coming up short. Decisive response by Israel should have been expected-this nation is no "paper tiger". Continued myopic blunders by Hamas could pull up the roots of Palestinian sovereignty planted by multilateral effort.
Looks to me like the greatest national security threat to the Hamas government is the Hamas government.
Karl
I guess I have the luxury of supporting the actions of the Israeli's while thinking the suffering of young Palestinians sucks.
I have condemned Palestinians for targeting civilians. Taking out the electricity and water supply in Gaza seems to be the same thing.
Yes, you do have that luxury. You also have the luxury to be an armchair general. My friends, myself and many of the members of this board have given that to you. Its easy to sit back and critique the situation when your watching CNN and not on the front lines, especially if you've never been there. Far be it from me to judge the actions of Israel until I stand in their shoes. Yes there are clear cut issues of right and wrong, but evil is never right. Hamas is evil.
Any word on the Israeli soldier Hoepoe?
Godspeed on that operation.
No word yet Doc. Israel is holding steady and is not changing it's standpoint. We will not release terrorists for him. This would simply lead to many more abductions. As far as the press is reporting we do not know where he is, so a precise military op i snot on the cards...unless it's disinformation.
Hamas has declared the matter 'closed' without really expanding. They have said we will now never get any information on his condition.
This deadline was at 6am Today.
On a brighter note, the killers of another teen last week were captured overnight in, you got it, the PA security HQ :eek:
I hope for Gilad's safe return.
Hoepoe
No word yet Doc. Israel is holding steady and is not changing it's standpoint. We will not release terrorists for him. This would simply lead to many more abductions. As far as the press is reporting we do not know where he is, so a precise military op i snot on the cards...unless it's disinformation.
Hamas has declared the matter 'closed' without really expanding. They have said we will now never get any information on his condition.
This deadline was at 6am Today.
I hope for Gilad's safe return.
Hoepoe
Thanks Hoepoe.
Thoughts and prayers out to Gilad and his family.
Yes, you do have that luxury. You also have the luxury to be an armchair general. My friends, myself and many of the members of this board have given that to you. Its easy to sit back and critique the situation when your watching CNN and not on the front lines, especially if you've never been there. Far be it from me to judge the actions of Israel until I stand in their shoes. Yes there are clear cut issues of right and wrong, but evil is never right. Hamas is evil.
I understand that, that is WHY I used the term luxury. I am one of the biggest supporters of Israel, always have been, especially in this instance. I questioned why they turned off power and water and the answer was given to me by Hoepoe.
The Reaper
07-04-2006, 08:18
I understand that, that is WHY I used the term luxury. I am one of the biggest supporters of Israel, always have been, especially in this instance. I questioned why they turned off power and water and the answer was given to me by Hoepoe.
It occurs to me that going without power or running water for a few days, military or civilian, is hardly morally comparable to what Hamas is doing. Growing up, I spent quite a bit of time in a house with very limited electricity and no running water. It was not tremendously difficult.
Targeting civilians' electricity and water is hardly going to produce the same level of suffering as being captured and potentially being treated like our two soldiers recently snatched in Iraq.
In World War Two, we intentionally blasted cities in Europe and Japan full of civilians into rubble and then dropped large quantities of incendiaries on them hoping to create fire storms. We dropped two nukes on Japan. During our Civil War, Sherman burned and destroyed large portions of the United States with no military value. Targeting civilians was intended to break their will to resist, to destroy their support for the government, and to destroy them as a labor pool. What the Israelis are doing to the Palestinians in the Gaza have to be among the most benign "targetings" of civilians in the annals of warfare.
"Targeting" the civilian populace MAY put pressure on the Hamas government to release the hostage. I am sure that as soon as the hostage is returned and the guilty parties taken into custody, the power and water will be restored as quickly as possible.
Hamas has been targeting the Israeli civilians with rocket fire, suicide bombers, and raids. I would say that the Israeli response has been relatively reserved and surgical, to this point.
However, the difference in the behavior of these two governments could not be more different. The Israelis accept responsibility for their actions and take care to preserve the peace and to represent the interests of their citizens. The Hamas government instigates lethal attacks on the Israeli civilians and allows its militant wing to perpetrate crimes against humanity, then says that they have no control over the criminals when they are asked to do so.
I would not expect the same concern for Israelis should Hamas somehow win.
TR
Couldn't have said it better myself, Sir.
It occurs to me that going without power or running water for a few days, military or civilian, is hardly morally comparable to what Hamas is doing. Growing up, I spent quite a bit of time in a house with very limited electricity and no running water. It was not tremendously difficult.
Targeting civilians' electricity and water is hardly going to produce the same level of suffering as being captured and potentially being treated like our two soldiers recently snatched in Iraq.
However, the difference in the behavior of these two governments could not be more different. The Israelis accept responsibility for their actions and take care to preserve the peace and to represent the interests of their citizens. The Hamas government instigates lethal attacks on the Israeli civilians and allows its militant wing to perpetrate crimes against humanity, then says that they have no control over the criminals when they are asked to do so.
Said so very well!!
The differences between the two Gov't is the same differences between the two countries. One accept reponsibility for what it does the other doesn't.
A Gov't that can't control its people, how can it Govern itself?