05-24-2004, 01:37
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#1
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Asset
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Santa Barbara
Posts: 8
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Advice on an Officer MOS?
As helpful as everyone's response was to Ross' post concerning college majors, I thought a few of you would have some thoughts on this question. It is really a three-part question that has to do with Ranger school as well, a subject I'm sure many users here are all too familiar with.
As former or current SF team members:
1.) Which Officer MOS do you feel would provide the greatest experience necessary to operate as an 18A? More specifically, would working in something like the Intelligence or Medical branches give more useful training than in the Infantry branch?
2.) Since it seems as though there are more applicants for an 18-A than there are open slots, is there an MOS that would increase my chances to be later selected for SFAS?
3.) Is Ranger School still an option for non-Combat Arms officers?
As a sidenote, I'd just like to extend my gratitude for those who have responded to this forum. While there seems to be ample information concerning the NCO SF MOS, it has been exceedingly difficult to find a good source of discussion about pursuing a military career as an 18A. If anyone can recommend any good books or websites that address this topic, I would be in your debt.
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Ferratus is offline
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05-24-2004, 05:39
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#2
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,780
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1. 11A.
2. No. You should be selected for SFAS regardless.
3. No idea. Why not go as a cadet?
Good luck.
TR
__________________
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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07-25-2005, 09:29
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#3
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Guest
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by The Reaper
3. No idea. Why not go as a cadet?
TR
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Just to chime in on the Ranger School issue and cadets....
Currently, Cadets from USMA, ROTC etc cannot attend Ranger School. The only time that the 60+ day course would fit into is the summer. Because we cannot recycle (that would cut into the academic school year, and lord knows we can't sacrfice math for military training....), we cannot attend....
But we sure can go to SFAS as a cadet!
Molon Labe
Never Quit
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07-25-2005, 09:50
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#4
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,780
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Molon Labe
But we sure can go to SFAS as a cadet!
Molon Labe
Never Quit
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Which is as complete and utter a waste of time as I have ever seen.
TR
__________________
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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07-25-2005, 15:34
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#5
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Castle Rock, CO
Posts: 2,531
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by The Reaper
Which is as complete and utter a waste of time as I have ever seen.
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what is the point in SFAS prior to commissioning...? is the intent to branch-detail officers at accession, then put them in the pipeline after 3-4 years?
__________________
""A man must know his destiny. if he does not recognize it, then he is lost. By this I mean, once, twice, or at the very most, three times, fate will reach out and tap a man on the shoulder. if he has the imagination, he will turn around and fate will point out to him what fork in the road he should take, if he has the guts, he will take it.""- GEN George S. Patton
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lksteve is offline
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07-25-2005, 15:43
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#6
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,780
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by lksteve
what is the point in SFAS prior to commissioning...? is the intent to branch-detail officers at accession, then put them in the pipeline after 3-4 years?
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Negative.
This is a drug deal between GOs to let cadets play soldier for a few weeks.
Cadets are not evaluated by commanders in multiple OERs prior to attending, selected by a board, or held to the same standards as officers attending SFAS.
Nevertheless, they are permitted to attend, while ROTC cadets and OCS candidates are not.
IMHO, it is a waste of slots.
TR
__________________
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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05-24-2004, 06:40
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#7
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Guest
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Quote:
Originally posted by The Reaper
1. 11A.
2. No. You should be selected for SFAS regardless.
3. No idea. Why not go as a cadet?
Good luck.
TR
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1. Concur
2. Concur
3. According to a speech by General Schoomaker, Ranger School is going to get a lot more emphasis for all branches.
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05-24-2004, 09:19
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#8
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Colorado Springs
Posts: 4,510
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If you follow TR's advice in #1, you're pretty much guaranteed #3 right after IOBC. More importantly, you should probably choose an MOS of which you'd be willing to make a career, as there's no guarantee you'll get into SF (always plan PACE).
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Razor is offline
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05-24-2004, 17:21
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#9
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Asset
Join Date: May 2004
Location: Santa Barbara
Posts: 8
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Thank you for the advice.
I anticipated 11A as the appropriate MOS, I just wanted to confirm that. As far as picking one that I would be willing to make a career out of, all of the three I mentioned were ones I was hoping to get into, including Infantry.
I appreciate your rapid responses to this question. I'll start looking into more information about 11A immediately to make sure it fits my military interests.
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Ferratus is offline
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06-16-2004, 04:21
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#10
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Asset
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Giebelstadt
Posts: 29
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Officer MOS
Looking at the list from this year there were quite a few different AOC's selected but 11A was predominant. You will see very few Medical Officers (70B) selected. Don't know if that was due to lack of applicants or type of person applying. Could be a little of both. Just my two cents.
Steve
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stschmidt is offline
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06-16-2004, 09:31
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#11
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Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,938
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Re: Officer MOS
Quote:
Originally posted by stschmidt
Looking at the list from this year there were quite a few different AOC's selected but 11A was predominant. You will see very few Medical Officers (70B) selected. Don't know if that was due to lack of applicants or type of person applying. Could be a little of both. Just my two cents.
Steve
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This is somewhat secondhand, but my understanding from a friend who was a Group Surgeon with 10th Group is that the Surgeon General of the Army generally opposes losing his doctors to another branch, after the time and money the Army invests in them. While SF can get priority over other Army-competitive branches, the Medical Corps may have a veto over branch transfers.
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Airbornelawyer is offline
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06-16-2004, 09:43
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#12
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,780
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Re: Re: Officer MOS
Quote:
Originally posted by Airbornelawyer
This is somewhat secondhand, but my understanding from a friend who was a Group Surgeon with 10th Group is that the Surgeon General of the Army generally opposes losing his doctors to another branch, after the time and money the Army invests in them. While SF can get priority over other Army-competitive branches, the Medical Corps may have a veto over branch transfers.
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Doctors do not Branch transfer, they merely complete the training and receive a beret and tab.
They have been permittted to attend and denied the opportunity to. Current policy is that they may go to all phases but the language phase (Phase V). The exception is that they are presently sent to SERE first, to determine their suitability for further SF training.
If they are not permitted to attend, then we are going to run out of SF qualified Docs to fill positions in the headquarters, and that would be a seriously bad thing.
TR
__________________
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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06-16-2004, 10:11
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#13
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Moderator
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 1,938
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Thanks for the firsthand info. When my friend finished his internship and got to Carson, he had problems with AMEDD releasing him to go to the Q and I don't think he ever did (though I've lost touch). He did go to the undersea medicine program at Panama City and a few other places.
The chief group surgeon at 11th Group was tabbed, but I don't recall any of the other medical officers being so.
Has having a CIB-wearing and Ranger-tabbed Surgeon General affected AMEDD's attitude toward its doctors getting their boots dirty?
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Airbornelawyer is offline
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07-25-2005, 05:13
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#14
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 215
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x
Last edited by DoctorDoom; 07-29-2013 at 08:56.
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DoctorDoom is offline
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07-25-2005, 08:15
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#15
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,780
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by DoctorDoom
I'm being told that the only way any department in MC would allow an O3 doctor go to SFAS and the SFQC is if it did not interfere with their residency training, in other words during the GMO year. Since AMEDD is doing away with GMO years in the Army, the word I've gotten was "it ain't gonna happen so don't even ask." Given the high requirements for general surgeons right now, and for all doctors in the Army, combined with the need for slots for candidates that will actually serve on ODA's, it makes sense. The Army doesn't spend all this time and money training us so we can get hurt, waste training slots, or otherwise gum up the works.
I was also told by my Department Chief that the FAST teams are the way doctors work with SF, and there's no reason to have SF qualified doctors except in certain specific positions in USASOC. He said that it makes much more sense for 18D's to fill the surgeon slots at USASOC and SOCOM, rather than expect enough bookworm types like us to apply and then actually make it through the Q course.
Could just be their way of telling me me nicely...
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BS.
If you want to go as a Doctor, and meet the requirements, follow my instructions. Call the USASOC Surgeon.
AFAIK, physicians going to assigmments in Group are occasionally permitted to attend the 18A Track SFQC, if you pass SERE and SFAS first.
TR
__________________
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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