Still buying your gas at Citgo?

SouthernDZ · 02-20-2007, 07:38

Monday, Feb. 19, 2007 1:10 p.m. EST Venezuela Wants Sub Fleet for Conflict with U.S.

Venezuela is spending $3 billion to build nine submarines, a fleet of undersea craft that would be the largest in the region -- and ready to be used against the U.S. in event of a conflict between the two countries.

The submarines will be the "diesel-electric variety," according to a communique issued by Vice Adm. Armband Laguna, quoted this month by Brazil's leading newspaper, O Estado de Sao Paulo.

They will weigh-in at approximately 1,750 metric tons apiece.

The navy is considering bids from Germany, France, and Russia, which is said to be the odds-on favorite, according to the Washington Times.

Venezuela, the Times wrote, could use a fleet of submarines to protect its interests in its exclusive economic zone, which in Caracas' view includes a large portion of the Caribbean Sea.

Protecting an area that large would require far more subs than the two over-30-years-old German U-Boats that the Venezuelan military now employs.
Moreover, the addition of the nine subs would give Venezuela the largest submarine fleet in Latin America, surpassing those of Peru, Brazil and Chile -- with six, five and four submarines, respectively.

Venezuela says it is beefing up its military capabilities -- including plans to develop an enlarged submarine fleet -- in preparation for what it called any "asymmetrical conflict" with the U.S.

The new submarine fleet is a small part of an arms buildup that the Times reports includes small arms, jet fighters and potentially air-defense missiles.

The buildup is being carried out in compliance with all international and regional nonproliferation treaties, Venezuela's ambassador to Washington, Bernardo Alvarez told the Times in a telephone interview.

Alvarez said that his government was contemplating the need to defend itself against the world's lone superpower, a nation with vastly greater military resources.

"We have simply been trying to upgrade our military equipment and maintain our defense while preserving balance in the hemisphere," Mr. Alvarez added. He also insisted that Venezuela's Latin American neighbors need not worry about the buildup.

According to the Times, Venezuela is reported to have already spent $3.4 billion on Russian arms, including assault rifles and fighter jets, and is said to be negotiating to buy a $290 million Russian air-defense system.

The Times noted that a Pentagon report estimated that Venezuela had spent about $4.3 billion on arms since 2005 alone, more than countries such as Iran, Pakistan and even China.

Venezuela also is pursuing an estimated $2 billion worth of military-transport ships and aircraft from Spain, a deal that the Times reports was delayed last year after the U.S. objected, noting that foreign companies must seek Washington's approval when de facto selling U.S. military technology.

Venezuela now is trying to work out a deal with Spain to swap out the U.S. parts in the 10 aircraft and eight vessels.

Venezuela already has done billions of dollars worth of business with Russia, purchasing 100,000 Kalashnikov assault rifles, 24 Sukhoi-30 fighters and about 35 helicopters.

More recently, Venezuela has its sights set on buying Russian air-defense missiles known as the Tor-M1 system, which consists of eight missiles in a battery mounted to a launch vehicle. The short-range system is designed for use against low-flying aircraft and incoming missiles.

The Times wrote that a Venezuela military official told the Associated Press last month that the missiles were wanted for "air defense" only -- a notion in keeping with Mr. Chavez's repeated warnings about the threat of a U.S. invasion, a threat the U.S. dismisses as fantasy.

Among Washington concerns is the fear that the Russian assault rifles could wind up in the hands of leftist rebels in neighboring Colombia or be used to further the Venezuelan leader's socialist agenda in the region.

"I can see why Chavez wants to militarize Venezuela. ... He's a military man, just like Bolivar was a military man," John Pike, director of Globalsecurity.org. told the Times, which noted that Simon Bolivar, whom Mr. Chavez idolizes, liberated several Latin American nations from Spain during the 19th century.

Waging war with the U.S., however "would be a foolish thing to do," he added, noting that even a minor skirmish would jeopardize Venezuela's oil sales to its largest customer.

Surgicalcric · 02-20-2007, 09:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by SouthernDZ

...The navy is considering bids from Germany, France, and Russia, which is said to be the odds-on favorite, according to the Washington Times...

Why does this not suprise me in the least.

And speaking of which, why does the new French Navy have glass-bottomed ships? So their sailors can see the old french navy...

Thank you, thank you... I'll be here all week.

Crip

Sionnach · 02-20-2007, 09:22

I stopped buying Citgo gas the first time Hugo stepped on his crank. I'll pay more before I knowingly provide material aid to a two-bit dictator in serious need of some pt.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Surgicalcric

And speaking of which, why does the new French Navy have glass-bottomed ships? So their sailors can see the old french navy...

Have you read Black5's story about the French general? Good for a laugh, and a great way to end a career

**The Reaper** · 02-20-2007, 10:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by Surgicalcric

Why does this not suprise me in the least.

And speaking of which, why does the new French Navy have glass-bottomed ships? So their sailors can see the old french navy...

Thank you, thank you... I'll be here all week.

Crip

The French Navy is the reason we were able to pin Cornwallis at Yorktown and win our independence.

TR

**Pete** · 02-20-2007, 11:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Reaper

The French Navy is the reason we were able to pin Cornwallis at Yorktown and win our independence.

TR

Even had some French Troops in the line on our side at Yorktown. IIRC they took one of the British batteries on the outer line the same night we took another on. Little rusty on Rev War stuff.

Pete

**Roguish Lawyer** · 02-20-2007, 11:14

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Reaper

The French Navy is the reason we were able to pin Cornwallis at Yorktown and win our independence.

TR

After WWII, I think we're more than even.

incommin · 02-20-2007, 11:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Roguish Lawyer

After WWII, I think we're more than even.

You left out WWI......

Jim

SouthernDZ · 02-20-2007, 11:24

The one and only time I worked alongside French troops (SF), I found them to be pretty much on par with other SF soldiers. The one thing we had in common was a distain for the French government.

**Pete** · 02-20-2007, 16:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by SouthernDZ

The one and only time I worked alongside French troops (SF), I found them to be pretty much on par with other SF soldiers. The one thing we had in common was a distain for the French government.

As a general rule the ones we ran into while in African countries with a French/Belg. history were Marines. I got the impression they had a distain for host country troops and Americans. Gave us and the host country troops something in common right from the start.

Pete

incommin · 02-20-2007, 18:34

Did the French Commando course thing and got to work with French Engineers.

Found them to be good capable soldiers......proud to be French soldiers but not completely happy with everything their government did........

Kinda sounds like the way things are here!

Jim

**Peregrino** · 02-20-2007, 19:40

Let the Socia--- Ooooops, I meant to say Democrats, keep going the way they're headed and nobody will be able to distinguish any difference between our respective governments.

As for Chavez - what do you expect? We keep buying his oil and he keeps using the money to secure his position. As for his regional ambitions; just ask the Colombians along the mutual border how secure they feel. Peregrino

Jgood · 02-22-2007, 08:42

Looks like the Dems want to help Hugo build up his military

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070222/...9gSCp83Wq3IxIF

She said her fact-finding mission to Venezuela was part of an effort by a new Democrat-controlled Congress to show that "Venezuela has many friends in this new Congress

incommin · 02-22-2007, 08:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jgood

Looks like the Dems want to help Hugo build up his military

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070222/...9gSCp83Wq3IxIF

She said her fact-finding mission to Venezuela was part of an effort by a new Democrat-controlled Congress to show that "Venezuela has many friends in this new Congress

The Dem party is full of socialist and communists..... so why wouldn't they help Hugo???????

Jim

Sionnach · 02-22-2007, 09:53

Sheila Jackson-Lee is as big a moonbat as Cynthia McKinney.

The truth, however, is pathetic...

Quote:

(Ms. Jackson-Lee) said that the F-16 jets, which are built in Texas, was an issue of concern to her constituents in Houston.

What Ms. Jackson-Lee really wanted to say is...

"I need to buy some votes so I can keep my position of power, and I'm willing to sell-out our entire nation in order to do so."

This, sadly, isn't limited to her party.