Alec Balwin may be in a pickle?? - Page 2

WarriorDiplomat · 10-23-2021, 17:58

It smells of a lesson to Producers for neglecting the support BUT can be interpreted as this is what happens when you overwork, withhold pay and generally neglect the support of the production.

Either way couldn't have happened to a bigger a-hole

You gotta love Hollywood leftist derelicts like Baldwin and DeNiro lecturing society on virtue and ending gun violence and womens rights when these sexually sadist cover for pedophiles and drug fueled orgies then DeNiro has the gall to say that during his divorce when his 500 million dollar fortune was being split he cried he was broke

rubberneck · 10-23-2021, 18:04

Quote:

Originally Posted by Badger52

Condolences to the family of Mrs. Hutchins.
Apparently, das war alles upgefucked.

Somewhat new to biz armorer, none of the normal protocol of multiple checks before a shot, union crew (a bunch of 'em) had written resignations & walked off the set less than a day before over safety & Covid protocol violations (a friend in law enforcement says they call this "a clue"), and then...

That sort of complacency annoys me. From the time they were old enough to handle a firearm my children have understood the concept that even though someone just checked the firearm it's their responsibility to verify for themselves when it's handed to them. He owned that gun the second it was handed to him. The whole I was told it was a cold gun is just limp. It was his responsibility to ensure it was unloaded. I don't know if jail is the appropriate punishment but IMHO he was clearly negligent and a mother and wife is dead because of it.

EricV · 10-23-2021, 19:15

I don't get it. Why would they have real rounds with real bullets to begin with?? Shouldn't everything be blanks.

rubberneck · 10-23-2021, 19:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricV

I don't get it. Why would they have real rounds with real bullets to begin with?? Shouldn't everything be blanks.

It might not have been a real round. If that gun had had a squib at some point and no one checked the barrel the next time it was fired with a blank the bullet would have left with enough force to kill someone. In fact that's exactly what happened to Bruce Lee's son.

EricV · 10-23-2021, 19:30

Quote:

Originally Posted by rubberneck

It might not have been a real round. If that gun had had a squib at some point and no one checked the barrel the next time it was fired with a blank the bullet would have left with enough force to kill someone. In fact that's exactly what happened to Bruce Lee's son.

Amazing.

Old Dog New Trick · 10-23-2021, 19:31

I’m still waiting on the rest of the Hollywood elites like Sean Penn, Sylvester Stalone, Liam Neeson, Robert DeNiro and some others that have made a living with “guns” to come to his defense. Unusually quiet on the Western Front?

Someone was killed… point blank - negligence, incompetence, failure to follow very strict protocols, or was it an intentional act to set someone up for failure?

My spidy senses lean towards gross negligence on the part of the crew that was responsible for setting up the scene and Baldwin was the producer who should have known you don’t point a gun at another human being and pull the trigger.

Three people bare blame for an unintentional homicide and each shares in the responsibility for that equally.

Jail time and enormous amounts of money should be forthcoming to Mrs. Hutchins family.

Badger52 · 10-23-2021, 19:34

Quote:

Originally Posted by EricV

I don't get it. Why would they have real rounds with real bullets to begin with?? Shouldn't everything be blanks.

Couple reasons (I'm told), one of which is a Rx for disaster:

It might be desired to go off & fire some live rounds to familiarize the actor with the actual recoil they should be mimicking for the camera.

The other reason is that instead of just blanks, they may create actual dummy rounds, which are supposed to be done with bullet but WITHOUT primer or powder. Reloaders make these for themselves all the time for a variety of reasons. Why do this? The infamous (oooh, I'm intimidated) shot of the gun pointing right at the camera and looking at the rounds in the cylinder also with real bullets.

Doesn't sound like a standard blank with a wad; this is a round that killed Mrs. Hutchins and then passed through her and put the director in the hospital.
Sounds like Keystone Cops would've been a STRAC outfit by comparison.
Tragic.

And as CD pointed out, Jerkwad is on hook as producer as well.
The union crewmembers are sitting around with a beer reflecting on the literal bullet they just dodged.

EricV · 10-23-2021, 20:12

As a reloader, I Do have rounds with bullets but not powder or primers, and I can see why they might want a shot looking at a loaded revolver.

The recoil aspect is one I never thought of though. Wonder if Baldwin will clutch at straws and claim some body switched the rounds deliberately on him.

Gonna be

time watching this all unfold over the coming weeks. I wonder if it will completely kill the movie too.

Old Dog New Trick · 10-23-2021, 20:53

Can anyone here recall James Arness, Denis Weaver, Charlton Heston, John Wayne or hundreds of war and Indian movies where “ANYONE” was killed by a prop gun?

I can’t!

Why is this a 21st century issue?

Millions of rounds have been fired in movies before CGI and those other movies seemed very realistic to me.

Last hard class · 10-23-2021, 22:02

I'm not familiar with the law as pertaining to the producers' liability. But I think it unlikely as an actor, he will be held responsible for this. Union movies have a set of protocols regarding the use of firearms. The weapon probably belonged in the prop department. They should have an armorer responsible for the chain of custody for all weapons. Real or not. This person may be in props or might be in stunts. As Badger stated, this particular one may have also been used outside of the movies purpose. Could have been loaned to the movie. This was a small budget movie so I expect someone was wearing multiple hats. They clearly cut some corners. It's Hollywood, so I suspect the blame will work its way downhill. You know, like the way it works in the military when these things happen.

BTW: Many movies utilize a military advisor who may be part of the equation. There are multiple SOF guys who hold these positions. At least they claim SOF. It's a good bona fides to get in to the union. Hopefully not one on this movie.

LHC

7624U · 10-23-2021, 22:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by Old Dog New Trick

Can anyone here recall James Arness, Denis Weaver, Charlton Heston, John Wayne or hundreds of war and Indian movies where “ANYONE” was killed by a prop gun?

I can’t!

Why is this a 21st century issue?

Millions of rounds have been fired in movies before CGI and those other movies seemed very realistic to me.

More Foley sound artists back in the day, all gunshots added after filming only relied on black powered blanks with puffs of smoke, not a large charge making the weapon having its own report and cycling from the high powered gas blanks or bulleted wood blanks like now days would be my guess. Modern Blanks will still kill your ass if close.

I have a feeling it was a blank but someone put a projectile over it like this or he did it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dR0AiqJ1voQ

Last hard class · 10-23-2021, 22:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by 7624U

More Foley sound artists back in the day, all gunshots added after filming only relied on black powered blanks with puffs of smoke, not a large charge making the weapon having its own report and cycling from the high powered gas blanks or bulleted wood blanks like now days would be my guess. Modern Blanks will still kill your ass if close.

I have a feeling it was a blank but someone put a projectile over it like this or he did it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dR0AiqJ1voQ

Yep

LHC

Badger52 · 10-24-2021, 03:43

Quote:

Originally Posted by Last hard class

Union movies have a set of protocols regarding the use of firearms. The weapon probably belonged in the prop department. They should have an armorer responsible for the chain of custody for all weapons. Real or not. This person may be in props or might be in stunts.

Yep. I'll be shocked if all the union people who resigned & walked off the set over safety violations the previous day aren't deposed, each & every swingin' one.

JJ_BPK · 10-24-2021, 08:58

Interesting read.

As the bits are revealed the plot thickens..

Not a 2L, but this seems to do a good job of explaining the legal side..

The noteworthy part is some of the background details are being filled in.

Quote:

https://www.foxnews.com/opinion/alec...onathan-turley

Quote:

There are already witness statements that would fill out such a negligence narrative for trial.

One crew member is quoted as saying "There were no safety meetings. There was no assurance that it wouldn’t happen again. All they wanted to do was rush, rush, rush."

Another said there were three accidental discharges and the set was "super unsafe."

Yet another witness said, "Corners were being cut – and they brought in nonunion people so they could continue shooting."

Quote:

Originally Posted by FoxNews

Jonathan Turley is the Shapiro professor of public interest law at George Washington University and a practicing criminal defense attorney. He is a Fox News contributor.

Old Dog New Trick · 10-24-2021, 12:51

Dave Halls - First Assistant Director - keeps coming up in the news as someone you don’t want on your set. History of unsafe and hazardous movie sets!

Alls the armor has to say is there were three guns on the table (outside) for three different scenes and Dave Walls grabbed the one and only wrong one called it a “cold gun” and handed it to Baldwin before anyone had noticed - there was so much dis-function on the set that morning to begin with that it should have been completely shut down but (fill in blank) wanted to keep shooting and so we did.

A minute later the fatal shot was fired!