SOG question

02-12-2004, 09:59

Few questions: (Coming from Plaster's book)

I noticed a few of the guys were PFC's and SP4/5's. Were all members of SOG grads of the SF course? (I assume support guys were not)

Which relates to my next question of was the SF course much the same as it is now? Length and such or was during the war a shortened version added to get guys in the field?

When did 30 rnd mags come on line?

What was the length of tour?

Dick Meadows son was my PL, I see sr. was mentioned several times in the SOG book, but never any stories about him other than the Son-Tay raid. Any reason why he didn't get much written about him since he had a great rep?

I am truly amazed at some of the stuff those guys did (You included Mark), going into such zones seemed to be a death trap but you guys made it out..

Hoped some of the indigs made it out. Any more info on the overland route used by them?

Air.177 · 02-12-2004, 10:55

Ambush Master will be back online no later than Saturday. He'll know for sure. I wasn't there but I have grown up with him telling me all of the great old stories. The only question that I can attempt to answer is aboout the Mags. He was there in late 70-71 and he said that they did have a few thirty rounders, but that it was easier to move through the jungle with twenties. He also said that the thirties were so rare that an empty mag usually got stuffed into your webgear or shirt or somewhere rather than being dropped like the twenties. Hope that helps.

Also, If i am not mistaken, there is more about Meadows in Plaster's second SOG book.(The big one with all the pictures)

02-12-2004, 11:12

I have both books, mainly referring to the second one.

Thanks

CommoGeek · 02-12-2004, 12:56

A SGM in my old unit is a SOG vet. We briefly discussed it one day and he remarked that he still didn't know what was declassed and what wasn't so he kept his mouth shut. What little he did discuss was..... beyond comprehension.

Awesome men, awesome responsibilty, awesome results.

**Roguish Lawyer** · 02-12-2004, 13:02

I believe that Plaster's first book indicates that SOG was not an SF-only outfit, but that is only my recollection.

Air.177 · 02-12-2004, 13:17

RL-That's correct, SOG included SF, SEALs, Air force Helos and some Marine folks. As well as support in the form of transportation and fire support from whoever they could get it from.

All of the SOG guys that I have talked to have said that Plaster's books are spot on, so if it says so in there, then it came from a for real SOG guy or from recently declassified documents and can be trusted.

02-12-2004, 13:34

ok
Let's just focus on the RT teams and such then.

BMT (RIP) · 02-12-2004, 13:49

Guys, I will only write about what happened at CCS.

1. I know of at least one of our RT 10's came in country as a leg clerk typist. Jump school in country and the SOG school at Long Thanh.He ran some damn good targets for CCS.

2.The launch site at Quan Loi was supported by the 195th AHC and O1-E's both Army and Air Force.
Army flew radio relay and AF were FAC's.

3.The North launch site was supported by the 20th SOS and 155th AHC.When we moved to the Northern limits of our AO chopper units from Pleiku provided slick support.Army O1E's flew radio relay and AF O-2's flew FAC.

When I first arrived at CCS the ROE's were no TAC Air or arty and guhships had to use light warheads. We didn't want to scar the ground!!
Then we started putting in ARC LIGHT strikes into the Base Areas.
BMT

02-12-2004, 13:56

So were the CCS teams all SOG school qual'd or SF qual'd?

BMT (RIP) · 02-12-2004, 14:05

American team members were trained at LT and OJT. Very few were not SF qual'd.

BMT

CPTAUSRET · 02-12-2004, 14:21

BMT:

You mentioned "light rockets", when I first arrived in country (1965) all we had were 6 pound warheads, then we were issued 10 pounders, and eventually 17 pounders (the 17 pounders were equivalent to a 105), so a Cobra with 72 rockets could ruin your day:

Were the light rockets you referred to 6, or 10 pounders?

Terry

Air.177 · 02-12-2004, 14:50

While we are asking questions about the "old days".
CPTAUSRET-is it really possible to fit people into the ammo magazine on a cobra? I have heard stories of this happening, but the Cobra always seemed too small for that type of thing. Many Thanks

CPTAUSRET · 02-12-2004, 15:05

I presume you mean extracting someone in an emergency situation; in that case no, the ammo trays would have to be removed in a hurry, and I idoubt that there would be ample time to accomplish the removal:

The ammo bay doors, which are closed with dzus fasteners, can be popped open in a hurry, and someone could be extracted on the door:

Terry

CommoGeek · 02-12-2004, 15:10

I once heard a rumor of some guys riding in the ammo bays on a Cobra at Bragg and doing an MFF jump into St. Mere Eglise DZ in the early to mid-80's. Don't know how much of an urban legend that is, but if two Spec 4's can take a tank and have inert LAWS shot at it, I guess anything is possible.

NousDefionsDoc · 02-12-2004, 15:18

Quote:

Originally posted by CommoGeek
I once heard a rumor of some guys riding in the ammo bays on a Cobra at Bragg and doing an MFF jump into St. Mere Eglise DZ in the early to mid-80's. Don't know how much of an urban legend that is, but if two Spec 4's can take a tank and have inert LAWS shot at it, I guess anything is possible.

That didn't happen and I don't know anything about it or the people that did it.