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Old 04-07-2004, 09:51   #1
QRQ 30
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Tet 2004

Folks: I have no problem comparing the events in Iraq today with what I saw in RVN in Tet 1968. The Iraqi have come out of their holes. They have given up their anonymity. We can and will crush the muthers.

In 1968, the US Armed Forces soundly crushed the VC and NVA. The VC ceased to exist and the NVA were onb their way north with their tails between their legs. WE FUCKING WON!! and don't ever forget.

Then the likes of J*** F**** and John Kerry happened upon the scene. They breathed new life into the NVA and caused our demise. Amazingly Kerry is again on the scene. We will crush the Iraqi revolt. Let's hope the likes of Kerry don't screw it up!!! AGAIN!!
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Old 04-07-2004, 11:09   #2
Roguish Lawyer
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In Nick Rowe's book on his captivity, he makes crystal clear that that VC were well aware of the anti-war movement and made cultivating it a major part of their strategy against us.

On Fox News last night, there was a story about Iraqis telling TV reporters about ambushes before they happened, and the cameras actually recording the attacks on U.S. soldiers! This confirms that QRQ is right, IMO.

BTW, those reporters ought to be shot.
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Old 04-07-2004, 11:19   #3
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Quote:
Originally posted by Roguish Lawyer
On Fox News last night, there was a story about Iraqis telling TV reporters about ambushes before they happened, and the cameras actually recording the attacks on U.S. soldiers! This confirms that QRQ is right, IMO.

BTW, those reporters ought to be shot.
One of the few times I'll chime in on here, just here to read mostly. But that is definitely correct. If we ever saw reporters that weren't with us milling around or already set up with a tripod in the middle of the street, etc. while we were doing something in Falluja, we'd either avoid the area or be even more aware of the surroundings and ready to pounce.
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Old 04-07-2004, 12:32   #4
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On Fox News last night, there was a story about Iraqis telling TV reporters about ambushes before they happened, and the cameras actually recording the attacks on U.S. soldiers! This confirms that QRQ is right, IMO.

Isn't it illegal for someone to do that domestically? Or is that just in Massachuecetts?

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Old 04-07-2004, 13:19   #5
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Solid are you thinking something like this

Found on Findlaw.com

Lying in wait : holding oneself in a concealed position to watch and wait for a victim for the purpose of making an unexpected attack and murdering or inflicting bodily injury on the victim
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Old 04-07-2004, 13:23   #6
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Nope, it's a law that prosecutes an individual if they do not act to prevent a crime. It's like passive participation. I believe there was a Seinfeld episode on it, but that's not where I got my information from. I'll do my best to find it.

Sorry for not explaining myself better,

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Old 04-07-2004, 13:26   #7
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Quote:
Originally posted by Roguish Lawyer
In Nick Rowe's book on his captivity, he makes crystal clear that that VC were well aware of the anti-war movement and made cultivating it a major part of their strategy against us.

On Fox News last night, there was a story about Iraqis telling TV reporters about ambushes before they happened, and the cameras actually recording the attacks on U.S. soldiers! This confirms that QRQ is right, IMO.

BTW, those reporters ought to be shot.
I would think that that would make them accessories to crimes against US troops, if there is such a thing.

Shooting is too good for them.
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Old 04-07-2004, 13:31   #8
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I thoroughly concur.
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Old 04-07-2004, 14:33   #9
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From http://OpinionJournal.com

Best of the Web Today - April 7, 2004
By JAMES TARANTO
Vietnam's Lesson: Win http://pennlive.com/newsflash/iraq/i...ent&&news&iraq

"Muqtada al-Sadr, the firebrand anti-U.S. Shiite Muslim cleric, warned the United States on Wednesday that Iraq would become another Vietnam-like conflict if Washington did not transfer power to 'honest Iraqis,' " the Associated Press reports from Baghdad.

So Sadr agrees with Ted Kennedy http://www.opinionjournal.com/best/?id=110004916 .

What is the "lesson of Vietnam" that we keep hearing about? For foreign foes like Sadr, and Saddam Hussein before him, it is that America can be beaten in any war by appealing to fickle public opinion. For domestic "dissidents" like Kennedy, it is that it is perfectly acceptable, even "patriotic," to oppose an American war effort even after the decision has been made to go to war. But the Washington Times http://www.washtimes.com/national/20...4311-9361r.htm points toward a different Vietnam lesson:

*** QUOTE ***

"Let the Iraqis kill [Sadr]," said retired Air Force Lt. Gen. Thomas McInerney. "We should not kill him, but we may have to. He's trying to create an uprising. This is their Tet offensive. We're going to kill a lot of them just like we did at Tet."

*** END QUOTE ***

As the late Bob Bartley http://www.opinionjournal.com/column.../?id=110004251 noted in November, Tet was a U.S. victory that was misunderstood as a defeat:

*** QUOTE ***

After erosion of their position during 1967, the Communists threw all of their South Vietnam guerrilla forces into attacks in more than 100 cities across the length and breadth of the country. Most spectacularly, since it came before the eyes of the Saigon press corps, a 19-man sapper squad penetrated the U.S. Embassy compound. They failed to enter the chancery building, despite early reports, and the last of them was killed or repulsed after a six-hour battle.

General William Westmoreland appeared in the shattered compound to proclaim a great victory. His televised appearance came against a backdrop of destruction throughout the country, and the American elite decided to believe not the general but their own eyes. A widely cited Wall Street Journal editorial proclaimed that "the whole Vietnam effort may be doomed, it may be falling apart beneath our feet." Walter Cronkite turned against the war, editorializing on the need for negotiation. With this home-front reaction, Tet was the turning-point in the war, the anvil of Communist victory and American defeat.

Yet in fact, Westmoreland was right, subsequent analysts have uniformly concluded. The Communist offensive was decisively repulsed. There was no general uprising in favor of the North. The South Vietnamese army did not buckle, though operating at 50% strength because of imprudent holiday leaves. The indigenous Viet Cong were destroyed, leaving the rest of the war to be conducted by troops recruited in the North.

*** END QUOTE ***

A lesson we would draw from Vietnam is that losing a war has costs that go far beyond the immediate defeat. Losing in Vietnam bred an excessive caution in foreign policy that led, among other things, to Jimmy Carter's impotent response to Iranian terrorism, Ronald Reagan's withdrawal from Lebanon after the Marine barracks bombing, George Bush's failure to finish the Gulf War, and Bill Clinton's retreat in Somalia and desultory pursuit of al Qaeda.

Sept. 11 was supposed to have changed all that, and it did--but not completely. In October 2002, after the resolution authorizing Iraq's liberation passed with strong bipartisan support, we proclaimed http://www.opinionjournal.com/best/?id=110002460 McGovernite isolationism dead. Obviously we were too optimistic. So this time let's be hortatory instead of prognosticative: For the good of the country, McGovernite isolationism must die. A decisive victory in the Iraqi "Tet," if it is widely understood as such, will deliver a crushing blow and help to liberate America from Vietnam's enfeebling legacy.

It's a Quagmire--for Sadr http://www.nytimes.com/2004/04/07/in...rtner=USERLAND

The New York Times' John Burns, who was briefly taken hostage by Sadr's forces in Kufa, Iraq, files this report:

*** QUOTE ***

If Moktada al-Sadr has chosen a grand mosque in this Euphrates River town for a last stand against American troops, as many of his militiamen have claimed in recent days, he appears to be relying more on the will of God than anything like military discipline to protect him.

Many hundreds of militiamen in the black outfits of Mr. Sadr's Mahdi Army were visible on Tuesday on roads approaching the golden-domed mosque and inside the sprawling compound leading to the inner sanctuary. But they seemed unmarshaled, at least to the layman's eye--more milling about than militant. . . .

Some of the militiamen were in their 50's and 60's, but most were young, some no more than 12 or 13. Weapons training among them appeared virtually nonexistent; Kalashnikovs with loaded magazines and safety catches off were nonchalantly waved in the air.

*** END QUOTE ***

It sounds as if those here who are shouting "quagmire" may soon end up with egg on their faces.

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Old 04-07-2004, 15:51   #10
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IMO it seems that the important thing is that the US (and secondarily foreign) populations understand that the situation in Iraq remains in the US' favor. If public opinion is allowed to change sides (or further change sides) as a result of a renewed offensive (no matter what the reality of the situation is), the war WILL become a quagmire, at least politically. This is the kind of situation which makes me, at least, wish that the government had the kind of control over the media that the tin-foil crew says they do. I think that the public all too readily allows the media to interpret reality for them in lieu of interpreting situations themselves.

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Old 04-07-2004, 17:20   #11
QRQ 30
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I am glad RL has the patience to look up sources to verify what I know. Grn. Giap and another prominent NVA General printed in their memoirs that they were beaten in 1968 and headed back to the North to quit. Then they heard/saw the peace movement in the U.S. and realized that they need only protract mthe war and we public opinion would eventuale cede victory to the North.

IMNSHO Jane Fonda, John Kerry and others not only have the blood of those that died because of the peace movement on their hands but the blood of 83,000 brave americans who died for nought and the blood of the hundreds of thousands, if not millions of those killed in the killing fields of Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia.
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Old 04-07-2004, 17:41   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by QRQ 30
IMNSHO Jane Fonda, John Kerry and others not only have the blood of those that died because of the peace movement on their hands but the blood of 83,000 brave americans who died for nought and the blood of the hundreds of thousands, if not millions of those killed in the killing fields of Vietnam, Laos and Cambodia.
And how about destroying American credibility in the world for decades, if not longer? I wonder what that price will turn out to be . . .
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