Shooting Drills

[TF Kilo]

I have some ideas... it's just a matter of getting it all together and a trailer to mount the whole shebang on. Planning on something along the lines of the mobile BEAR, but home fabbed.

[Gene Econ]

Originally Posted by NousDefionsDoc

I agree Gene, but I look at it this way" One hole (or really good groups) at 3, 5, 7 10 will probably spread to 6" (or better) under two-way range duress. And we have to have a goal to shoot for in training, so it might as well be a good one.

Doc:

Roger -- we do dot drills with guys as well but with a differrent intent if that makes sense. We prefer to emphasize recoil control, speed, precison, and mental agility although not necessarily in that order. My experience is that unless one is using some very small targets (dots), the close range work damages to ones marksmanship skills. So we use them for the purposes stated combined with steel at longer ranges so they can make the mental transition between a big target up close to a small target farther away. Ball and dummy some guys after they have shot dots sometime. He, he, he.

We don't do any formal weak hand training because the Army doesn't emphasize it and the amount of time needed to develop a weak hand into anything sustainable is significant. Just our decision to focus resources on things we view as most likely to occur.

We have to watch how our guys respond to drills as Joe will turn them into a competitive sport pretty fast and will begin to do tactically unsound things to 'win'. This actually makes a course pretty interesting for everyone as staying ahead of Joe really demands a huge amount of intuition and imagination.

Gene

[NousDefionsDoc]

Gene,
We're on the same page. This exercise works all those same attributes. When I said "modified" above, we took the weak hand out all together. Just shot another string of five.

This is a good drill IMO - another tool in the box.

[Gene Econ]

Originally Posted by The Reaper

I just picked up a Marlin Guide Gun in .45-70. Got some 525 grain hard cast bullets to load up for it when I get the chance.

As far as shooting drills go, I would venture that the drills for a bullseye shooter are not the same as those for an IPSC shooter which are not the same as for a LEO, which are not the same as for an SF soldier.

Training starts with an analysis of the skills required for the intended purpose, and then maps a route to acquire and ingrain the specific skills needed. Olympic class sprinters do not use the same routine as marathon runners. Practice does not make perfect, perfect practice does. And as I was recently told, look for TTPs that work 100% of the time, in 100% of the conditions. Dark, light, hot, cold, amped up, tired, kitted up, naked, it has to work all of the time. I am trying to get rid of some old habits, and it is not easy. HTH. TR

TR:

The one thing that will succeed every single time is a soldier who has embodied the following characteristics.

Total confidence that he will succeed.

Total trust in his training (skills).

Total trust in his equipment.

Total trust in his decisions.

Total trust in his buddies and his chain of command.

Now -- if a course results in guys with these characteristics, you don't have to worry about relying on TTPs for success and yes, they will study TTPs on their own as that is the type of guy you developed. So it is a win / win situation.

I think that guys get stuck in a certain way of running training. X amount of ammo fired in Y conditions to Z standards. And so on until at the end, the logic is that the guy went through every event to standards so he is trained. Normally, Army training is focused on failure so most of the time one gets failure. It is easier to focus the training on how to succeed but that part of the Army is 230 years of tradition uninhibited by progress.

I provide formal instruction on how guys can develop these mental skills, then use various drills to instill the characteristics described. The drills force them to incorporate these skills as Joes love to succeed. Thus, I do look closely at all shooting disciplines as every one of them emphasizes a different angle in developing these characteristics. We do formal marksmanship work as well but we mix this in throughout a day.

There isn't any set of drills that will bring success. However, by putting a very strong picture of what you want the shooters to become in their heads at the very beginning and then using drills to develop that picture -- you normally end up with success. Of course you will have to use the other side of the brain as well to set specific gates and standards for success. I don't compromise on standards.

Your hardest problem will be painting that picture and then coming up with challenges as the guys progress. Also, you need to gather a cadre of guys who believe in these techniques and methods.

Gene

[Gene Econ]

Originally Posted by TF Kilo

Speaking of targets... I need to fabricate a sturdy target stand.. the walmart special I got on a spur-of-the-moment purchase didn't quite survive zeroing the .454 rifle I bought the wife... LOL

Why not?

You putting steel on a target stand or are you blasting at five feet?

I made ten target stands for IPSC Steels using 2X2s and some plywood. Have shot them at 200 yards with 118 LR and none of them have been broken or have fallen over.

Not sure why your stands aren't standing up if you are shooting holes through paper.

Use 2 X 4's if needed and sand bag in the legs to keep the frame from falling over due to the wind.

Be very careful if you are going to comment on the power of a .454 to destroy a target frame.

Gene

[TF Kilo]

Originally Posted by Gene Econ

Be very careful if you are going to comment on the power of a .454 to destroy a target frame.

Gene

Please expand upon this premise. I'm interested where I need to be careful?






The wife was zeroing her 454 rifle.

25 M.

Standard normal bullseye target.

First round shot nails the steel stand. The stand was a wally world special I picked up when I was getting ammunition. 3/8" steel rod. Pseudo-T design, 2-4 target capacity... well about 2 targets, now.

Blew it in half. I remounted the top portion of the stand after prematurely chewing some ass. Got behind the rifle, and repeated what the wife had just done.

After telling the wife she's off the hook, moved up to 10m, and worked my way back from there zeroing it after that. Then handed it back to her for her to fine tune to her desires.

[Gene Econ]

Originally Posted by TF Kilo

After telling the wife she's off the hook, moved up to 10m, and worked my way back from there zeroing it after that. Then handed it back to her for her to fine tune to her desires.

TFK: Steel target stand eh? I guess I need to train my eyes to see better as I didn't note it in the early posts.

Use wood. With the big bores use 2 X 4 as they will take a few hits before going down. .30 caliber and below and you can go down to 2 X 2s.

A few outfits make some real solid steel stands for cardboard. Ususally about forty or fifty dollars per. These can take some hits as well and seem heavy enough to hold up in the wind if you use plywood to staple or glue the targets on to.

If we want to discuss ammo I think it best to start a thread in the ammo area.

Gene