Obama Backs Gay Marriage

[TXGringo]

Originally Posted by Broadsword2004

What is immoral about being gay or gays marrying though?

The same thing that's immoral about injecting heroin between your toes or selling yourself sexually for money or drugs. Are we going to legalize those activities for all?

To the gay marriage proponents on this thread: Should we legalize hard drug use? Should we legalize prostitution?

[ZonieDiver]

I got married... once. As I recall it was held in a church, a Catholic church no less, with a real, live priest officiating over the ceremony which included readings from the Bible, sacramental wine which had been turned into the 'Body and Blood' of Christ, and the presence of none other than God. (It scared the crap out of me; white as a sheet I was.)

All of this caused me to form the opinion that this marriage thing was part of RELIGION. I don't think government should stick its nose into religious activities. Government should recognize contracts, and allow people to enter into such contracts - joining together as two companies might merge. (Later on, government can preside over the disolution of the merger/union - dividing assets, protecting those invested in the union's interests (children), etc. MARRIAGE should be left to religions, and they should decide who gets to take part as they so believe.

'Dogs and cats living together' is kind of a straw man, when the affairs of consenting adults is the issue under discussion. Abusing children would also not be germane to such a discussion.

Will problems arise? Yes. Will they eventually be dealt with reasonably? Yes. Will some people be unable to accept the new ways? Yes. That's how it goes sometimes.

As for military issues, there are sure to be many. They will be solved. That's what we do. Maybe a start would be to 'pay by the job' - pay a 'living wage' for each rank, regardless of whether or not they were married/'partnered'. (Yeah, I know, but it still bothers me... 'Evening detail time. Married men, fall out.') Lots of complex issues here, I know... but all able to be solved, methinks.

[GratefulCitizen]

Originally Posted by Dusty

lol I'm just a straight, old-timey, honest FOG who evidently has become a dinosaur in my way of thinking about what's right and wrong and the difference between the two.

God help this Country and its Military.

Exactly.

The perverse behaviors and direction of society is a consequence of Godlessness, not the cause.
The solution will not be found in laws.

All of this started when (heterosexual) marriage became a method of "fulfillment" and "enjoyment" rather than an obligation related to the bearing and raising of the next generation.
If it's just fulfillment and and enjoyment, it makes sense that homosexuals want equal status.

When children are viewed as a "lifestyle choice" rather than a blessing, they become disposable.
Over 54 million innocent humans - made in the image of God - slaughtered in the past 40 years primarily for "lifestyle".

This is all intimately related to socialism.
Economics matter.

Why have kids to support you in your old age if you can just rely on the labor of other people's kids (social security).
Why have a husband if the state will support you and your kids (welfare).

If children don't matter, it's all about the fun.
If it's all about the fun, anything which satisfies sexual urges can be justified.

In the end, this culture of death (gay marriage, abortion, and aversion to having children) will destroy itself because it doesn't result in procreation.
This is why they try to steal other people's kids through brainwashing in the media and the public school system.

I suspect that this nation will survive the current chaos, and two or three generations from now the errors will be eschewed.
Until then, we will reap what we have sown, and many in the boomer generation will pay a dear price in their old age.

Have faith, Dusty; and keep fighting the good fight.

[TXGringo]

Originally Posted by GratefulCitizen

Exactly.

The perverse behaviors and direction of society is a consequence of Godlessness, not the cause.
The solution will not be found in laws.

All of this started when (heterosexual) marriage became a method of "fulfillment" and "enjoyment" rather than an obligation related to the bearing and raising of the next generation.
If it's just fulfillment and and enjoyment, it makes sense that homosexuals want equal status.

When children are viewed as a "lifestyle choice" rather than a blessing, they become disposable.
Over 54 million innocent humans - made in the image of God - slaughtered in the past 40 years primarily for "lifestyle".

This is all intimately related to socialism.
Economics matter.

Why have kids to support you in your old age if you can just rely on the labor of other people's kids (social security).
Why have a husband if the state will support you and your kids (welfare).

If children don't matter, it's all about the fun.
If it's all about the fun, anything which satisfies sexual urges can be justified.

In the end, this culture of death (gay marriage, abortion, and aversion to having children) will destroy itself because it doesn't result in procreation.
This is why they try to steal other people's kids through brainwashing in the media and the public school system.

I suspect that this nation will survive the current chaos, and two or three generations from now the errors will be eschewed.
Until then, we will reap what we have sown, and many in the boomer generation will pay a dear price in their old age.

Have faith, Dusty; and keep fighting the good fight.

You alluded to this in a previous post, and I'm glad you elaborated on it. Couldn't agree more.

[Sigaba]

Originally Posted by TXGringo

The same thing that's immoral about injecting heroin between your toes or selling yourself sexually for money or drugs. Are we going to legalize those activities for all?

To the gay marriage proponents on this thread: Should we legalize hard drug use? Should we legalize prostitution?

TXGringo--

First, you are making apples and oranges comparisons of questionable utility. If you're going to equate legalizing gay marriage with legalizing heroin, it is your responsibility to establish that the comparison is valid. As of yet, you've not done your due diligence.

Second, you are seeking to impose your value system upon other Americans without offering a show of proof that your value system is sustainable.

Third, before you start insisting that members of this BB answer your questions, how about giving some thought to the possibility--as slight as it may be--that the discussion of gay marriage, as well as other controversial topics, on this BB predate your arrival here. That is, before asking rhetorical questions about legalized prostitution and the selling of drugs--also both topics of debate--why not use the search button to learn more about other members, their experiences, their viewpoints, and how this topic has been debated in years past?

[GratefulCitizen]

Originally Posted by Broadsword2004

Kids are supposed to support you in your old age? Isn't that kind of a selfish reason for having kids?

The behavior must be modeled.
Take care of your own parents/grandparents in their old age, and your kids are more likely to imitate.

You reap what you sow.

[TXGringo]

Originally Posted by Sigaba

TXGringo--

First, you are making apples and oranges comparisons of questionable utility. If you're going to equate legalizing gay marriage with legalizing heroin, it is your responsibility to establish that the comparison is valid. As of yet, you've not done your due diligence.

Second, you are seeking to impose your value system upon other Americans without offering a show of proof that your value system is sustainable.

Third, before you start insisting that members of this BB answer your questions, how about giving some thought to the possibility--as slight as it may be--that the discussion of gay marriage, as well as other controversial topics, on this BB predate your arrival here. That is, before asking rhetorical questions about legalized prostitution and the selling of drugs--also both topics of debate--why not use the search button to learn more about other members, their experiences, their viewpoints, and how this topic has been debated in years past?

First, the general consensus seems to be that gay marriage is an issue of adult consent. So is drug use. And prostitution. Therefore, they're congruous topics. I doubt anyone else had a hard time figuring that out, but if you want to nitpick, so be it. My point is that those activities are illegal for reasons that go beyond adult consent. I believe the same idea applies to gay marriage, at least in some states.

Second, I inquired whether the members in favor of gay marriage would apply their same reasoning to drug use or prostitution. Please explain how I "imposed" anything on anyone. With regards to sustainability, a man and woman have the ability to reproduce. Like GratefulCitizen pointed out, two men do not. Nor do two women. Therefore, I'd say my value system has sustained itself since, well, creation.

Thirdly, how exactly does one ask a rhetorical question and insist upon answers at the same time?

I didn't insist that just any member chime in. I was asking for answers from certain members who have opined on THIS thread. Experiences alter beliefs. Viewpoints change. I'm not asking about which damn boots to buy. I believe this is the first time a sitting President has openly supported gay marriage. I'm not interested in what the other members thought 3 years ago, I'm interested in what they think now.

In conclusion, and with all due respect, I believe your post accomplished jack-shit with regards to this thread. How about addressing my question? That wasn't rhetorical...

[Sigaba]

Originally Posted by TXGringo

Entire post.

On the contrary, my previous post accomplished its primary objective thanks to your reply.

You made the decision to disregard the guidance to use the search button. You decided not to consult the archives to generate answers to your own questions. By taking this path, you are insisting upon yourself by asking questions rather than finding answers for yourself. By taking this path, you are displaying an undergraduate's sensibilities of entitlement by expecting others to do your work for you.

Again, I urge you, make an effort to use the search button. For example, if you were to run a search using "legalize drugs" as keywords, you will find 47 posts in seventeen threads in less than a quarter of a second. Or, if you prefer, you can perform a similar search using "gay marriage" as your keywords.

[Richard]

Originally Posted by Broadsword2004

Just want to make sure I am reading you correctly here Sir, but by "empirical" did you mean "imperial?"

Yes. It had been a long day helping AP Art students finalize and submit their portfolios to the College Board for evaluation, many who were operating under high stress creativity generated by the fear brought about from a procrastinating high school senior year. Thanks!

Richard

[TXGringo]

Originally Posted by Sigaba

On the contrary, my previous post accomplished its primary objective thanks to your reply.

You made the decision to disregard the guidance to use the search button. You decided not to consult the archives to generate answers to your own questions. By taking this path, you are insisting upon yourself by asking questions rather than finding answers for yourself. By taking this path, you are displaying an undergraduate's sensibilities of entitlement by expecting others to do your work for you.

Again, I urge you, make an effort to use the search button. For example, if you were to run a search using "legalize drugs" as keywords, you will find 47 posts in seventeen threads in less than a quarter of a second. Or, if you prefer, you can perform a similar search using "gay marriage" as your keywords.

Actually, I opted to search "gay marriage drug use." 10 whopping posts from 4 threads. Half of those posts are from this thread.

Then I searched "gay marriage prostitution." 6 posts from 2 threads. 4 of those posts from this one.

Am I not making myself clear? I want to know what members who posted on THIS thread in support of gay marriage think about legalizing drug use or prostitution. Again, since they made their point "adult consent," I want to know how they apply that argument to the issues of legalizing drugs or prostitution.

By taking this approach, you are insisting upon yourself by talking pretty without answering the question. You are displaying the sensibilities of a libtard elitist intellectual who can't or won't address the issue, but prefers to beat around the bush. I couldn't reach them, nor will I be able to reach you. Last post on this matter.

P.S. "libtard" is my redneck Uncle from East Texas' word. I like it.

[Richard]

Originally Posted by TXGringo

Actually, I opted to search "gay marriage drug use." 10 whopping posts from 4 threads. Half of those posts are from this thread.

Then I searched "gay marriage prostitution." 6 posts from 2 threads. 4 of those posts from this one.

Search functions pretty much work in a GIGO sense. I suggest you try using separate search strings and see what you come up with - e.g., gay marriage, drug use, drug legalization, drugs, prostitution, etc. I think you'll find the results much different.

Originally Posted by TXGringo

Last post on this matter.

Your decision. Check your PMs.

Richard

Originally Posted by TXGringo

The same thing that's immoral about injecting heroin between your toes or selling yourself sexually for money or drugs. Are we going to legalize those activities for all?

To the gay marriage proponents on this thread: Should we legalize hard drug use? Should we legalize prostitution?

Yes to both.

[afchic]

Originally Posted by WCH

Yes to both.

Agreed

[GratefulCitizen]

Originally Posted by Broadsword2004

Well sure, my point is that one should not just have kids on the idea that they will be an insurance policy.

That is exactly what social security was supposed to be (hence the comparison).
Somebody's kids will be doing the labor.

If you don't plan on being left to die when you can't fully support yourself, someone has to aid you.
Is it more selfish to receive that aid from children you raised or from children somebody else raised?

Those children will go on to produce much more for the world than aiding their parents in old age.
Raising kids is anything but a selfish endeavor.

That being said, there is a big difference between having kids and raising kids.

One of Thursdays headlines in the Briefing section of The Dallas Morning News read something to the effect of "Obama makes history, first president to openly support gay marriage."

Nothing about the accumilation of trillions upon trillions in debt; now I would have thought that historic.

I am not so sure what the big deal is about gay marriage. Two people can have any kind of union they want, IMO. They do not need some kind of governing body to sanctify their relationship. Besides, if it is real love, they shouldn't really be looking for or carring about their ability to have a leagalized union, or what the POTUS thinks, or anyone else for that matter. I know, perhaps a bit naive on my part.

And if the basis of this is for the collection of benefits, or filing jointly on tax returns, then I don't see it happening any time soon. There is just too much money at stake, and it would be the equivelent of one huge tax break; something this administration does not favor (which tells me this is just an attempt to shore up votes from this segment of the population).

These folks are just better off, again IMO, enjoying their special union between eachother and taking out a large life insurance policy, with their life partner as beneficiary, so that if something were to happen, the partner is taken care of.