With good jobs going away, middle class downsizes

[nmap]

Originally Posted by GratefulCitizen

In absolute size, China's economy may well surpass the US.
In power, not likely.

The Chinese will have their hands full tending to their own demographic implosion.
They are on borrowed time.

Let's hope you're right.

Sometime, pick a research university. Go visit the college of sciences. Walk around. Look at the students. I strongly suspect you'll find lots of students that aren't from the U.S. - many are from China. Some are from India. There don't seem to be too many Americans.

Will that investment in intellectual capital pay off for them? Time will tell.

Will they surpass the U.S. in terms of economic power? Again, we shall see.

[PedOncoDoc]

Originally Posted by nmap

Let's hope you're right.

Sometime, pick a research university. Go visit the college of sciences. Walk around. Look at the students. I strongly suspect you'll find lots of students that aren't from the U.S. - many are from China. Some are from India. There don't seem to be too many Americans.

Will that investment in intellectual capital pay off for them? Time will tell.

Will they surpass the U.S. in terms of economic power? Again, we shall see.

Foreign graduate/doctoral students seem to be preferntially selected in the ivory tower. They are removed from their family and culture, so they tend to work and take care of bodily functions; not much else. The career academicians know they are geting much more work from these people than they will from anyone else, and I've seen threats of pulling funding from foreign students if they don't pull 14-18 hours daily which would send these students packing. I've also seen foreign grads intentionally have children while in our country then ship the children off to live with the grandparents (perhaps to get around regulations in their own county). The American students (aside from the seeming sens of entitlement they all have), are trying to start/raise families and have a life outside of the lab - this takes away from the cheap labor's productivity which makes them less desirable candidates.

Should our universities be taking our students first and then open unfilled slots to foreign grad applicants? This would take serious reform of the petty games and politics in the ivory tower that none who are "in power" in these institutions want to see happen.

Admittedly, this is a bit of an over generalization, but it is MOO, YMMV.....

[Paslode]

Originally Posted by PedOncoDoc

Should our universities be taking our students first and then open unfilled slots to foreign grad applicants? This would take serious reform of the petty games and politics in the ivory tower that none who are "in power" in these institutions want to see happen.

You would think. But in the State of Kansas we passed legislation a year or two ago which subsidizes the education of non-citizens in the tune of 14-18 million TAX dollars (per year I believe) and a good portion of that goes to Two Year Colleges.

Minority and non-citizen status also get you to the front of the line when it comes to getting accepted to certain programs like nursing...


It has nothing to do with education, but my wife has $800 taken out for insurance each month......a non-citizen Iranian woman who's husband is barred from entering the US admits her son to the hospital and Medicaid (your tax dollars btw) pays for the entire stay.


I am beginning to think we should all renounce citizenship and come back into the country for a 'Fairer' shake......

[Richard]

I am beginning to think we should all renounce citizenship ...

Go right ahead - I'll keep mine.

Richard

[GratefulCitizen]

What are the best jobs going to be this year?
http://www.careercast.com/jobs-rated...obs-best-worst

The top 5:
1: Software engineer
2: Mathematician
3: Actuary
4: Statistician
5: Computer systems analyst

All of them are math-intensive fields.

If your kids are young, what are they studying?
If your kids are considering college majors, what are they choosing?

[Dusty]

http://www.nma.tv/hu-jintao-jets-washington-2/

[nmap]

Originally Posted by Broadsword2004

Well they are just the opinions of average Americans. Just because people may have the opinion that China will have a larger economy in twenty years doesn't mean it will and that because people think this, the burden of proof is to show otherwise. One could flip the argument and say the burden of proof is on folks to show China will surpass the U.S. economically within twenty years.

Proof of predictions about the future?

No matter how sophisticated the analysis, no matter how careful those involved, such predictions have been remarkably inaccurate in the past.

So I suppose I'll make my bets, take my chances, and wait for the events to play out.

[Sigaba]

Originally Posted by GratefulCitizen

What are the best jobs going to be this year?
http://www.careercast.com/jobs-rated...obs-best-worst

The top 5:
1: Software engineer
2: Mathematician
3: Actuary
4: Statistician
5: Computer systems analyst

All of them are math-intensive fields.

If your kids are young, what are they studying?
If your kids are considering college majors, what are they choosing?

You are suggesting that kids should chart their educational paths based upon what the best jobs are going to be this year.

Just how does that method of planning help them?

FWIW, the current Department of Labor occupational handbook is available here and projections for future job growth are there.

[1stindoor]

Originally Posted by GratefulCitizen

What are the best jobs going to be this year?
If your kids are young, what are they studying?
If your kids are considering college majors, what are they choosing?

I think this is an over generalization. "Best" by whose standards? I think looking at the Work Environment, Stress, Physical Demands, and Hiring Outlook is a good indicator but in the end I think it comes down to where your priorities lie and job satisfaction. I would much rather work a job that's low paying and gave me family time and fishing time...than work a higher paying job that took those two things away from me.

[Sten]

Originally Posted by GratefulCitizen

What are the best jobs going to be this year?
http://www.careercast.com/jobs-rated...obs-best-worst

The top 5:
1: Software engineer
2: Mathematician
3: Actuary
4: Statistician
5: Computer systems analyst

All of them are math-intensive fields.

If your kids are young, what are they studying?
If your kids are considering college majors, what are they choosing?

I am going to go with the I am going to support my daughter in what she is interested in doing. If she wants to be a bike messenger a stevedore or a Veterinarian its all good by me.

[GratefulCitizen]

Originally Posted by Sigaba

You are suggesting that kids should chart their educational paths based upon what the best jobs are going to be this year.

Just how does that method of planning help them?

FWIW, the current Department of Labor occupational handbook is available here and projections for future job growth are there.

The suggestion was that people should take a look; don't read too much into it.
Thanks for the links.

FWIW, historian was in the top ten for both 2010 and 2011.
http://www.careercast.com/jobs-rated...obs-best-worst

MOO-
People shouldn't be looking for a specific "job" to meet their long term economic needs.
Personal economic and finance skills are probably more important than specific occupational skills.


As 1stindoor and Sten suggested, there are other factors to consider when choosing an occupation.
I chose not to follow the paths opened by a math education and am quite happy with the results.

[Sigaba]

Originally Posted by GratefulCitizen

Entire post

Your two posts argue four points of view. Three of these views--one of which is yours-- disagree with what you wrote in your penultimate post.

So it isn't a case of reading "too much" into what you're trying to say but rather figuring out what you're trying to say.

[GratefulCitizen]

Originally Posted by Sigaba

Your two posts argue four points of view. Three of these views--one of which is yours-- disagree with what you wrote in your penultimate post.

So it isn't a case of reading "too much" into what you're trying to say but rather figuring out what you're trying to say.

Muse, speculate, explore; pick a verb.
Not trying to reach a conclusion.

[Detonics]

There's a lot of good detail about the economy in this thread. I tend to believe we're discussing symptoms and overlooking the cause of the malaise. If you look back through the last 6 or 7 POTUS, how many would fit the term "Globalist?"

If you see that in 1999 outsiders to the system such as Steven A. Holmes from New York Times business section wrote -speaking about backing unqualified borrowers- that "In moving, even tentatively, into this new area of lending, Fannie Mae is taking on significantly more risk, which may not pose any difficulties during flush economic times. But the government-subsidized corporation may run into trouble in an economic downturn, prompting a government rescue similar to that of the savings and loan industry in the 1980's. " What do you think the insiders knew?

Perhaps a better question is "How can you have a viable 'Global Economy' with widely disparate standards of living?" My belief is that you can't. You have to bring down the higher nations and bring up the poorer. Known in the modern vernacular as "redistribution of wealth." Look at the philosophy behind the Senate Bill 2433 - Global Poverty Act of 2007 by our current POTUS and I venture you'll find a clue to the true intention in play.

An America in solid financial shape, with average to low unemployment, victorious in its recent military engagements would never allow its sovereignty to be diminished. Not so with a country plagued by financial woes on myrad levels; considering cutting spending for a military actively engaged on several fronts and being systematically attacked from within.

Some fairly noteworthy folks from the past have summed things up better than I probably ever can:

“We shall have World Government, whether or not we like it. The only question is whether World Government will be achieved by conquest or consent.” –James Paul Warburg (1896-1969) son of Paul Moritz Warburg, nephew of Felix Warburg and of Jacob Schiff, both of Kuhn, Loeb & Co. which poured millions into the Russian Revolution through James’ brother Max, banker to the German government, Chairman of the CFR while speaking before the United States Senate, February 17, 1950

“This present window of opportunity, during which a truly peaceful and interdependent world order might be built, will not be open for too long – We are on the verge of a global transformation. All we need is the right major crisis and the nations will accept the New World Order” –David Rockefeller, Sept. 23, 1994