Be Prepared

[Paslode]

How about a critque of prep....blow some holes in it so I can tweak it.

For Bugout.

Fixed my wife up with a BOB containing first aid supplies, band aids, gauze, antibiotic ointment, burn creme, sting pads, snake bite kit, alcohol pads, eyewash, pain killers, ice pack, scissors, tweezers, peroxide, amodeum. Energy bars, compass, fishing kit, (2) trash bags, (3) Ziplocks, 10' 550 cord, tender sticks, pocket chain saw, 5 Bics, MRE Matches, Nylgene Bottle, whistle, signal mirror, 3 light sticks, four compact ponchos, 4 space blankets, (8) AA Batteries, (2)CR123 Batteries, CRKT knife, (2)micro lights and a GPS with routed rally point and destination.

I still need to get her a MIOX.

I got pretty much the same setup.

On normal week days my city traffic travels North in the morning and South at 5:00PM. I am figuring you have 30 minutes maybe 45 if during a weekday to get on the road and avoid the herd. It takes 10 to 15 minutes to reach the HWY driving the speed limit of 35.

I am generally working South during the day, my wife is North and she works nights, the school is less than a mile away. The plan is that if a senario arises that requires abandoning the city she or me (depending on the time of day), grabs the can with the 9mm, the AR and my marked ammo can, they get the kids and head to a rally point about 50 miles South of the city. When they reach the rally point they wait 5 minutes, if she or me doesn't arrive they are to continue on non-stop to the destination or drive as far as they can, ditch the vehicle and then hoof it, avoiding populated areas and possibly traveling by night and resting by day.

Haven't quite figured out what to do with the Dog. She can find game, even catch it, but she barks to warn of apporching strangers.

[The Reaper]

Does she know how to use everything in the kit?

TR

[AF Doc]

Nice post.

Originally Posted by Paslode

When they reach the rally point they wait 5 minutes, if she or me doesn't arrive they are to continue on non-stop to the destination or drive as far as they can, ditch the vehicle and then hoof it, avoiding populated areas and possibly traveling by night and resting by day.

I'm curious, why a 5 min sync-up? In the advent that you need to escape the city--in the inevitable chaos that will exist--how likely is it that you will meet at a rally point within 5 minutes of each other? Does the 5-minute rally point help you in someway? If so, would 15 min be better? Does the 5 min rally point create a vulnerablity? If so, should it be eliminated? Would it be prudent to leave a signal/sign, e.g. blaze on a tree, to indicate that one of you has reached the rally point and continued on (so the following person doesn't wait around)?

GPS. What if your GPS is not working? Maps? Compasses?

Water. Looks like you plan to make water on site. What if that proves difficult initially? Or you are delayed en route? Do you need some water either cached or with you. (Me, I like having some water in hand.) Frankly, in a civillian emergency, I'd rather carry 10# of water than 10# of weapons and ammo.

Fire: I know everyone loves a Bic, but I'd add some hurricane/lifeboat matches in place of the MRE matches. You can practically light them underwater and they don't go out until they have finished burning down to the end. I remember one very wet camping trip where hurricane matches saved the day for me. My $0.02.

First Aid kit: maybe add some Benadryl or other antihistamine. If anyone is using regular medications (HTN, diabetes, seizure disorder, asthma) it might be a good idea to have a supply pre-packed and ready to go (you will need to rotate this out, however. No point in bugging out with out of date meds).
I don't remember seeing tape in your list. Tape has just under one thousand uses--have medical tape and 100mph/duct tape handy. Also consider some powdered rehydration solution for the kit -- especially important if the immodium doesn't kick in right away.

Just a few thoughts--never had to E&E or bug out myself. Concur x 100 with Reaper: knowledge is more important than gear.

[Razor]

I'm curious what the medical professionals think of having peroxide in a FAK. My simple understanding is that it kills not only germs, but also healthy tissue, and thus isn't the best choice for an antimicrobial. Maybe stick an ACE wrap or roll of Coban in your kit to help with pressure dressings/stabilizing a joint/securing a splint or a cold pack/holding a dressing in place? A 10cc syringe for irrgating wounds is also helpful, and doesn't take up much space.

Even if you're looking to limit the size of the bag, I'd stick a wool skullcap and pair of wool glove liners, plus a pair of heavy work gloves in your BOB. Keeping warm is important, and just the hat and gloves can go a long way in maintaining body heat. The work gloves protect not only your hands, but the wool gloves if necessary.

I agree with AF Doc--5 minutes isn't a long wait at an RP. Heck, moving through the woods on foot (in other words, no traffic jams/accidents/blocked roads to slow you down), a standard wait time at an RP (assuming you don't get flushed by a pursuing force) is 30 minutes. I'd even consider 1-2 hours, depending on your analysis of vehicle traffic routes, potential choke points, and the time required to collect kids and supplies and then travel to the RP. What is the importance of getting more than 50 miles outside the city that quickly?

[Paslode]

Originally Posted by The Reaper

Does she know how to use everything in the kit?

TR

90%, were working on the GPS and compass/maps and when the other MIOX arrives we'll go over that. The 5 and 7 year old have the MIOX down as far as adding salt, adding water, pushing the button, color coding on the strips and rotation for back up. We still have to do some education on turning a poncho into a shelter.

My wife is instruction oriented, so I am in the process of making a detailed list of instructions.

The weapons she knows how to use, but if time is critical every minute might count and they might get left behind. And as many of you have mentioned they can be used against you. Secondly you have to be willing to cross that line.....gotta think on that one a bit more.

Originally Posted by AF Doc

Nice post.



I'm curious, why a 5 min sync-up? In the advent that you need to escape the city--in the inevitable chaos that will exist--how likely is it that you will meet at a rally point within 5 minutes of each other? Does the 5-minute rally point help you in someway? If so, would 15 min be better? Does the 5 min rally point create a vulnerablity? If so, should it be eliminated? Would it be prudent to leave a signal/sign, e.g. blaze on a tree, to indicate that one of you has reached the rally point and continued on (so the following person doesn't wait around)?

GPS. What if your GPS is not working? Maps? Compasses?

Water. Looks like you plan to make water on site. What if that proves difficult initially? Or you are delayed en route? Do you need some water either cached or with you. (Me, I like having some water in hand.) Frankly, in a civillian emergency, I'd rather carry 10# of water than 10# of weapons and ammo.

Fire: I know everyone loves a Bic, but I'd add some hurricane/lifeboat matches in place of the MRE matches. You can practically light them underwater and they don't go out until they have finished burning down to the end. I remember one very wet camping trip where hurricane matches saved the day for me. My $0.02.

First Aid kit: maybe add some Benadryl or other antihistamine. If anyone is using regular medications (HTN, diabetes, seizure disorder, asthma) it might be a good idea to have a supply pre-packed and ready to go (you will need to rotate this out, however. No point in bugging out with out of date meds).
I don't remember seeing tape in your list. Tape has just under one thousand uses--have medical tape and 100mph/duct tape handy. Also consider some powdered rehydration solution for the kit -- especially important if the immodium doesn't kick in right away.

Just a few thoughts--never had to E&E or bug out myself. Concur x 100 with Reaper: knowledge is more important than gear.

I was second guessing the 5 minute sync today as well. What I was thinking was one vehicle would be good. If the situation is that urgent non-stop for her would be a priority, I ain't worried about me I'll get there one way or the other.

Water.....In the area of travel water is very abundant throughout, but I was thinking some bottled water would be a good very idea and empties could later be used for water storage.

Migraines are the only medical we deal with. Allergies are always a potential issue and I need to add that. First Aid kit is prepack. And out of curiosity how important is the expiration date? Other things I am familiar with have a safety factor built-in, usually 3 to 1 and that has more to do with liability. Rehydration salts...I do have them.

I did forget the tape....Gorilla Tape will be added. I have the blast match but it wasn't on the list.

Originally Posted by Razor

I'm curious what the medical professionals think of having peroxide in a FAK. My simple understanding is that it kills not only germs, but also healthy tissue, and thus isn't the best choice for an antimicrobial. Maybe stick an ACE wrap or roll of Coban in your kit to help with pressure dressings/stabilizing a joint/securing a splint or a cold pack/holding a dressing in place? A 10cc syringe for irrgating wounds is also helpful, and doesn't take up much space.

Even if you're looking to limit the size of the bag, I'd stick a wool skullcap and pair of wool glove liners, plus a pair of heavy work gloves in your BOB. Keeping warm is important, and just the hat and gloves can go a long way in maintaining body heat. The work gloves protect not only your hands, but the wool gloves if necessary.

I agree with AF Doc--5 minutes isn't a long wait at an RP. Heck, moving through the woods on foot (in other words, no traffic jams/accidents/blocked roads to slow you down), a standard wait time at an RP (assuming you don't get flushed by a pursuing force) is 30 minutes. I'd even consider 1-2 hours, depending on your analysis of vehicle traffic routes, potential choke points, and the time required to collect kids and supplies and then travel to the RP. What is the importance of getting more than 50 miles outside the city that quickly?

The wife likes peroxide, its in her kit not mine. Gloves came to mind today as well for various uses including warmth. Skull caps I didn't think of, and would be a priority in cold weather being that most of your body heat escape through the head. Probably add a few more hefty bags becasue they could be used to keep the feet dry and well as several other uses.

The importance of the 50 miles, once you get out of the city 50 miles South it gets rural and the traffic drops off to a trickle of what it is prior to that. If something bad happened during the week between 10:00 Am to 5:00 PM I would surmise those in the Downtwn area would make a mad dash to get home and there would be a chaotic mess.....which might allow a longer layover at the RP. But the idea is to beat the crowd heading to the Lake of the Ozarks and get further South and to get past any obstruction that could be incurred near Ft. Leonard Wood.


Probably never have the oppourtunity to make use of this, but if I do I will be a 1000 times ahead of most.

[AF Doc]

Originally Posted by Razor

I'm curious what the medical professionals think of having peroxide in a FAK. My simple understanding is that it kills not only germs, but also healthy tissue, and thus isn't the best choice for an antimicrobial.

I agree. The goals of wound care are to stop bleeding and promote healing. In my experience Peroxide has limited use here. It does clean up old blood and matted blood/hair nicely. It can be useful in removing blood encrusted dressings that are stuck to the skin. But that virtue is also a clue as to why it isn't recommended for wound care.

Most antiseptics have some toxicity for tissue, e.g. breaking down blood components. Damaging the tissues in a wound creates an environment for secondary infection and slows healing. Peroxide is fairly aggressive stuff. The foaming action--sure looks like it is working--can damage the early fibroblasts and epithelial cells trying to form granulation tissue. Granulation tissue formation is how most open wounds heal.

The most important step in wound care is to clean the wound. Thoroughly. Any foreign material is likely to create an infection. Clean, clean, clean. Irrigation with sterile saline is usually sufficient. Using a syringe may be helpful, but take care not to drive debris into the surrounding tissues with a jet of water. A soft brush or fine sponge can also be helpful in removing large particles of foreign material. Remember though, the goal is to remove contaminants without damaging healthy tissue.

IIRC--it's been a while since I worked in an ER--a 1:10 ratio of 10% Betadine to saline makes a safe and effective irrigation solution for wounds. (This is what is use on myself, my family, and my dogs. We are all alive to attest that it works. ) Full strength antiseptic can be used on intact skin, e.g. cleaning skin prior to surgery. I would not pour undiluted Betadine straight into a wound because of its toxic effects. Saline is preferable to water because of the osmotic effects of water, but sometimes you use what you have at hand.

Sorry if I went overboard on this post. In short, I'd recommend a little bottle of Betadine. Leave the peroxide at home.

[charlietwo]

Aside from individual/familial coordinations for a blowout, have there been any efforts made towards networking those who have prepared themselves? I'm not necessarily suggesting any sort of major formation or community, but perhaps people who are within a certain radius of various regions could have a larger rally point in a defensible, concealed position.

This comment could be outside of the realm of this thread, and if so, I apologize.

[Paslode]

Originally Posted by charlietwo

Aside from individual/familial coordinations for a blowout, have there been any efforts made towards networking those who have prepared themselves? I'm not necessarily suggesting any sort of major formation or community, but perhaps people who are within a certain radius of various regions could have a larger rally point in a defensible, concealed position.

This comment could be outside of the realm of this thread, and if so, I apologize.

I found some coordination efforts on the ar15.com site awhile back while browsing, but alot of it is from hoarders, barricaders and fort builders, and not anything I would want to participate in.

I could see where you QP guys could make it work because you all have skills to bring to the table, you know how to work as a team, you trust and rely on each other and your like a family.

For civi's like me unless it is close friends and family I would steer clear of it, and even with close friends and family I can see it as being difficult at a best because of the ME culture, lack of skills, lack of resources and their reliance on other sources to provide what they need in life.

Kind of like my wifes sister family of five. 2 Attourneys, 3 kids. If I had 30 days of supplies for my family of 5 and they arrived with the clothes on their back, no food, no water, no gear, no weapons, no usable skills, no nothing.....I wouldn't want to throw them under the bus, but that would put a drain on resources and could put my families chances of survival in jeoprody.

[charlietwo]

Originally Posted by Paslode

For civi's like me unless it is close friends and family I would steer clear of it, and even with close friends and family I can see it as being difficult at a best because of the ME culture, lack of skills, lack of resources and their reliance on other sources to provide what they need in life.

Kind of like my wifes sister family of five. 2 Attourneys, 3 kids. If I had 30 days of supplies for my family of 5 and they arrived with the clothes on their back, no food, no water, no gear, no weapons, no usable skills, no nothing.....I wouldn't want to throw them under the bus, but that would put a drain on resources and could put my families chances of survival in jeoprody.

Therein lies the troubles... definitely not looking forward to the chaotic times ahead.

[Pete]

Originally Posted by Paslode

........Kind of like my wifes sister family of five. 2 Attourneys, 3 kids. If I had 30 days of supplies for my family of 5 and they arrived with the clothes on their back, no food, no water, no gear, no weapons, no usable skills, no nothing.....I wouldn't want to throw them under the bus, but that would put a drain on resources and could put my families chances of survival in jeoprody.

Well somebody has to eat the old rice and Spam stocks.

[Paslode]

Originally Posted by Pete

Well somebody has to eat the old rice and Spam stocks.

That might be food for thought

Originally Posted by charlietwo

Therein lies the troubles... definitely not looking forward to the chaotic times ahead.

You and your kind passed SERE and a whole slew of other preparation to adapt and survive in a mulitude of senarios. I think I can add educators to your list of skills as well.

It is nothing to look forward to, but from my seat you got the world by the balls so to speak.

Anyway.....see anymore holes in my plan?

[The Reaper]

Winter is coming and it is predicted to be a cold one.

Is everyone prepared for cold, snow, ice, power outages, or whatever inconvenient events that might occur at home, the office, on the road, in the car, etc.?

Vehicles prepped for the winter? Starting problems? Been driving around with a weak battery? Fluids topped off? Good brakes and tires?

Alternate heat sources, food, water, emergency cooking, shelter, etc. available at home?

Do you have everything in your home that you need to get by for a couple of weeks?

The time to address it is now.

TR

[Plutarch]

I had a minor issue this evening. Not an emergency, but it did make me consider my commo situation.

I was supposed to have dinner with family members this evening when they returned home from a trip. I was doing chores around the house while waiting for their call.

I checked my messages a few times, and they hadn't called. I figured they were still out on the road. As dinner time approached, I went ahead and called them.

That is when I realized that my cell phone isn't working. It has full power, and full bars for reception, but won't make or recieve calls. It just flashes 'calling' and does nothing. When I checked my messages, it would say 'no new messages' as usual.

I don't have a landline, and realized that I had no way to get in touch with my relatives. ( I have a landline phone to contact 911 if need be )

I was able to reach them later via email. They told me that they had left me several messages, and that my rack of ribs was now cold


Any ideas how I can better prepare in this area? Pigeons? Was commo skipped over? Couldn't find it in the thread, sorry if I missed it.

[SF_BHT]

Originally Posted by Plutarch

I had a minor issue this evening. Not an emergency, but it did make me consider my commo situation.

I was supposed to have dinner with family members this evening when they returned home from a trip. I was doing chores around the house while waiting for their call.

I checked my messages a few times, and they hadn't called. I figured they were still out on the road. As dinner time approached, I went ahead and called them.

That is when I realized that my cell phone isn't working. It has full power, and full bars for reception, but won't make or recieve calls. It just flashes 'calling' and does nothing. When I checked my messages, it would say 'no new messages' as usual.

I don't have a landline, and realized that I had no way to get in touch with my relatives. ( I have a landline phone to contact 911 if need be )

I was able to reach them later via email. They told me that they had left me several messages, and that my rack of ribs was now cold


Any ideas how I can better prepare in this area? Pigeons? Was commo skipped over? Couldn't find it in the thread, sorry if I missed it.

Ever thought of a vontage line?

Cell service is not a 100% guarantee. Did you power down the phone and power it up. Sometimes that will reconnect you with the system. I have that problem sometimes and when I do it I get my MSG in a min or two.

[Plutarch]

It must be an internal problem with the phone. When I tried to power down, it locked up on the lit up 'powering off, goodbye' screen. I can't turn it off or on now.

Oh well, I can use it a nightlight till the battery dies I guess. Off to the phone store tomorrow. I'll look into the Vonage option also, thank you.