04-04-2005, 18:10
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#31
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LA
Posts: 1,653
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If I had to spend one more day with the "TS" and "TL" I had for RS, I would be in Leavenworth. Almost was anyway. Neither one of them made it. 
__________________
Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
Still want to quit?
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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04-05-2005, 00:35
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#32
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Bangkok
Posts: 856
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by NousDefionsDoc
But knowing what we know now...
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oh, man.
got that right.
I have one word for the young'uns in the pipeline right now: agility.
that is it.
agility.
either you have this quality, or you do not. I think that it sums up, in a word, the essence of a successful SF soldier.
a man with agility knows that the fear of the unknown is entirely in his own mind.
__________________
1st Platoon "Bad 'Muthers," Company A, 2d Ranger Battalion, 1980-1984;
ODA 151, Company B, 2d Battalion, 1SFGA, 1984-1986.
SFQC 04-84; Ranger class 14-81.
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magician is offline
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04-05-2005, 06:46
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#33
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Fayetteville
Posts: 13,080
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RS and teams
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Originally Posted by NousDefionsDoc
If I had to spend one more day with the "TS" and "TL" I had for RS, I would be in Leavenworth. Almost was anyway. Neither one of them made it. |
It is better working with people you know while on an operation.
The bad part as I see it during the "Q" course is that you form friendships with people. That can carry over into the school side of things. A person could be having a hard time and really not cut out for SF but because you are "Friends" you pull him along and help him get through. He then becomes a problem on a Real Team.that the Team Sergeant has to deal with.
If a student team, as individuals, has what it takes they'll do fine in RS.
Just my two cents.
Pete
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Pete is offline
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04-05-2005, 08:52
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#34
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Vermont
Posts: 3,093
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Pete
It is better working with people you know while on an operation.
The bad part as I see it during the "Q" course is that you form friendships with people.
Pete
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Good point Pete, however the ability to separate professional and personal relationships has always been a strong point with folks with whom I have worked. Some of my longest and best friendships have been with soldiers with whom I have worked regardless of rank. When it came time to the nut cutting neither relationship ever impeded the task at hand. You might have felt like crap afterwards, but in the end everything seemed to work out.
Jack Moroney
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Wenn einer von uns fallen sollt, der Andere steht für zwei.
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Jack Moroney (RIP) is offline
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04-05-2005, 10:03
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#35
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Ft Bragg, NC
Posts: 1,126
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by NousDefionsDoc
Consider yourself lucky. If it was me, I wouldn't even talk to you.  |
LMFAO, That is priceless.
I nominate that as quote of the year.
__________________
If ever time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.
Samuel Adams
It is the duty of the patriot to protect his country from its government.
Thomas Paine
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Max_Tab is offline
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04-05-2005, 10:21
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#36
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Wherever my ruck finds itself
Posts: 2,972
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SFMS and Arabic Oh boy...
I am still trying to figure out how they, J-SOMTC, is going to maintain the current pass rate for the 18D's while shortening the course by 6 weeks, keeping the same amount of material, and adding language, especially Arabic.
just a students .02
Crip
__________________
"It's better to die on your feet than live on your knees."
"Its not who I am underneath, but what I do that defines me" -Batman
"There are no obstacles, only opportunities for excellence."- NousDefionsDoc
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Surgicalcric is offline
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04-05-2005, 11:21
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#37
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Vermont
Posts: 3,093
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Surgicalcric
I am still trying to figure out how they, J-SOMTC, is going to maintain the current pass rate for the 18D's while shortening the course by 6 weeks, keeping the same amount of material, and adding language, especially Arabic.
just a students .02
Crip
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They are probably going to embed you in NYC with an arabic speaking taxi cab that monitors the police frequencies as you shuttle from one gangland shooting to another. Piece of cake.
Jack Moroney
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Wenn einer von uns fallen sollt, der Andere steht für zwei.
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Jack Moroney (RIP) is offline
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04-05-2005, 20:54
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#38
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Texas
Posts: 514
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Surgicalcric
I am still trying to figure out how they, J-SOMTC, is going to maintain the current pass rate for the 18D's while shortening the course by 6 weeks, keeping the same amount of material, and adding language, especially Arabic.
just a students .02
Crip
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Talked this over w/ my roommate tonight, who just started the 18D course today. The cadre told them this morning that the Medical MOS course was going to be the same 12 months it has been before, and that it is not being shortened.
Perhaps they are going to shorten the overall pipeline for the 18D's by cutting out something else, although I cannot fathom what it would be (perhaps the new "Orientation Phase" being mentioned in the Feb 2005 issue of Special Warfare?).
Anyway, just reporting what the course cadre told the class that started today.
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El Diablo sabe mas por viejo que por diablo.
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D9 (RIP) is offline
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04-06-2005, 08:59
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#39
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Asset
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: west virginia
Posts: 11
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by NousDefionsDoc
Just my opinion, but an immersion program is useless without an understanding of grammar and the basics of the language. I would do an immersion program after language school and one year of working in the AOR. It will provide a big leap in skills, after the basics are mastered.
Sink or swim doesn't work with languages, both sides learn to compensate to much just to get past the frustration.
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I don't know, there is a school in middlebury, Vt. Great language school but the name escapes me right now. I believe this is where the bulk of the CIA,FBI, and DIA students go for language training. I was looking into it, to prep for SF. As far as Basic understanding of grammar being greater than Immersion I'd have to disagree to an extent. I Set foot in Iraq with no prior knowledge of the Arabic language, and after 4 months was the unofficial 'tank platoon translator' Now i did learn many, many bad habits, and mostly slang. But i still believe in a 'throw them in and they'll learn to swim' principle. Unless of course someone's life is on the line, or when prior planning is an option..
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soulsedition is offline
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04-06-2005, 09:19
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#40
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Moderator
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 3,045
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Jack Moroney
They are probably going to embed you in NYC with an arabic speaking taxi cab that monitors the police frequencies as you shuttle from one gangland shooting to another. Piece of cake.
Jack Moroney
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I just about busted a gut on that one Colonel! 
__________________
"Are you listening or just waiting to talk?"
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.
"Fate rarely calls upon us at a moment of our choosing."
Optimus Prime
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Kyobanim is offline
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04-06-2005, 09:29
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#41
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Vermont
Posts: 3,093
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by soulsedition
I don't know, there is a school in middlebury, Vt. Great language school but the name escapes me right now. I believe this is where the bulk of the CIA,FBI, and DIA students go for language training. I was looking into it, to prep for SF. As far as Basic understanding of grammar being greater than Immersion I'd have to disagree to an extent. I Set foot in Iraq with no prior knowledge of the Arabic language, and after 4 months was the unofficial 'tank platoon translator' Now i did learn many, many bad habits, and mostly slang. But i still believe in a 'throw them in and they'll learn to swim' principle. Unless of course someone's life is on the line, or when prior planning is an option..
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I totally agree with NDD, not only because he is a medic and knows things, but a great deal of communication skill is not limited to grammar but body language. Body language is picked up through a knowledge of the culture of the country, which, by the way often varies from region to region. It is not enough to talk like a duck, you have to look like one and walk like one to be totally effective in the flock. Having had to be able to pass myself off at a distance for something other than a US troop, while my grammar and vocal skills were not the best I was able to look like and walk like the duck even though I might have sounded more like a duck hawk.
Jack Moroney
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Wenn einer von uns fallen sollt, der Andere steht für zwei.
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Jack Moroney (RIP) is offline
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04-06-2005, 09:34
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#42
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Area Commander
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,355
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by soulsedition
I don't know, there is a school in middlebury, Vt. Great language school but the name escapes me right now.
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Middlebury College. Probably the best civilian language programs in the country. Lots of rich crunchy chewy girls, too.
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"Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it with thy might; for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave whither Thou goest." - Ecclesiastes 9:10
"If simple folk are free from care and fear, simple they will be, and we must be secret to keep them so." - JRRT
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jatx is offline
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04-06-2005, 09:51
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#43
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Wherever my ruck finds itself
Posts: 2,972
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by D9
Talked this over w/ my roommate tonight, who just started the 18D course today. The cadre told them this morning that the Medical MOS course was going to be the same 12 months it has been before, and that it is not being shortened.
Perhaps they are going to shorten the overall pipeline for the 18D's by cutting out something else, although I cannot fathom what it would be (perhaps the new "Orientation Phase" being mentioned in the Feb 2005 issue of Special Warfare?).
Anyway, just reporting what the course cadre told the class that started today.
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My word came from the Asst Dean of JSOMTC. The word he gave was the SOCM portion of the course was being shortened by 6 weeks with the new pipeline with more preventive and sick-call medicine being added to.
Dunno bro. Guess we will find out when we are there...
Hows the back?
__________________
"It's better to die on your feet than live on your knees."
"Its not who I am underneath, but what I do that defines me" -Batman
"There are no obstacles, only opportunities for excellence."- NousDefionsDoc
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Surgicalcric is offline
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04-06-2005, 13:42
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#44
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Castle Rock, CO
Posts: 2,531
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Quote:
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Originally Posted by Surgicalcric
I am still trying to figure out how they, is (sic) going to maintain the current pass rate for the 18D's while shortening the course by 6 weeks, keeping the same amount of material, and adding language
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you've packed a rucksack before, yes? same principle applies...
i've been on the other end of POI changes...someone has a bright idea, sounds good, be nice to do, etc., etc., etc...the next thing you know, a seventeen week POI (IOBC in this case) grows to 26 weeks...then some personnel guy sees it and hits the fan because there are too many people in the pipeline and manning levels reach some sort of critical (for the personnel types) threshold...as an instructor and student, you wind up adapting as you go, enduring change as you instruct or go through the course and in the end, the product (the trained soldier) almost always is capable of passing muster...as a Marine buddy of mine used to say (regarding the Corps) Semper Gumbie...
__________________
""A man must know his destiny. if he does not recognize it, then he is lost. By this I mean, once, twice, or at the very most, three times, fate will reach out and tap a man on the shoulder. if he has the imagination, he will turn around and fate will point out to him what fork in the road he should take, if he has the guts, he will take it.""- GEN George S. Patton
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lksteve is offline
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04-06-2005, 14:52
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#45
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Mississippi
Posts: 140
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one of the guys from my unit just got back from SFAS and said like 50% of his class was selected. do you gents think this had anything to do with SF needing more bodies, and going along with SFQC being shortened?
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Dustin03 is offline
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