Autistic boy attacked

[darbs]

I can safely say that where I work it is rare that the victim receives any suspension for defending himself, unless he completely pounds his/her attacker.

I would only hope that as educators most school districts would handle every altercation individually, I can only speak for ours...

Afchic - PM in-bound...

[afchic]

Originally Posted by darbs

I can safely say that where I work it is rare that the victim receives any suspension for defending himself, unless he completely pounds his/her attacker.

I would only hope that as educators most school districts would handle every altercation individually, I can only speak for ours...

Afchic - PM in-bound...

Darbs thanks for the PM I agree100%

Unfortunately in our school district the victim is suspended ad well. My BFF's son was suspended when his nutso girlfriend slapped him in the hall way. Another friends son had the shit beat out of him, didn't defend himself because he was scared if getting in trouble and was suspended for a week.

O'fallon has a 0 tolerance policy, to include the victim.

[Richard]

O'fallon has a 0 tolerance policy, to include the victim.

What a crock - I'd be looking for another school.

Richard

[afchic]

Originally Posted by Broadsword2004

How does one get suspended for not doing anything...!?

Ask the superintendent. If you are involved you must have done something to provoke it, therefor you will be punished.

[darbs]

NORMAL550GIRL

Being suspended for not doing anything smacks of unconstitutionally barring a child's right to an education. I would definitely be getting a lawyer involved if I was that child's parent.

Excatly why the below snippett of my PM to Afchic applies;

...In Mchenry we take things on a case by case basis and only hand out the necessary consequenses to those that deserve it. After all, we want them to get their education, not be on "vacation" playing xbox...

With kids there are almost always some underlying circumstances. A big one is, "I heard that he/she was talkin' smack so I handled it." When in fact the victim is exaclty that a victim of a misunderstanding.


Not to sound callous but we have several Special Ed. students that while "Special Ed." are quite good at getting under the skin of the Reg Ed students. As Richard pointed out earlier in the thread there are more than likely underlying circumstances. It's possible the kid in the video that got cracked, while having "Downs" merely made a crack in front of the wrong guy and got cracked... I kind of doubt it, but a possibility...

Ducking for cover now...

[The Reaper]

If there is a policy that punishes the victim as well as the assailant without investigation, I see not reason not to retaliate with everything you have at any incident of assault or physical harrassment.

If I have to take five days off, I might as well have some bloody knuckles and a good war story to tell.

OTOH, I never got jumped very often.

TR

[Tampico]

The simple fact that they would target a special needs student is disgusting...teenagers these days.

[dennisw]

The first day of Jr. High for my youngest was rather eventful. At the time, he was rather small for his age . However, he was always a bit pugnacious and I taught him how to box. He looked like Opie Taylor and many a bully picked on him. His two closest friends were also rather small and my son would often end up taking their side in many a scuffle.

Anyway, a particular bully thought he would pick a fight with a new 7th grader and picked my son. After receiving a decent beat down, the bully was pretty docile during his remaining time in Jr. High. However, my son was suspended the first day of Jr. High. The VP called me to tell me about the suspension and was somewhat righteously indignant. I told him I understood that he was only enforcing their policy. I also told him my son was subject to a higher law in that when confronted with a bully the house rule was to defend himself. I told him the reason for this was that it was not always possible for teachers / parents to be present, and I wasn't going to have him running scared his whole life.

Apparently, word spread and he was never bothered again.

[greenberetTFS]

Originally Posted by afchic

In my opinion, being the parent of a child in the IL school system we have gone off the deep end.

If my child is attacked at school, if she defends herself, she will be suspended for the same amount of time as the person who struck her in the first place. She knows how to defend herself and she knows I will support her 100% if she does so.

She is not allowed to talk about racial charged subjects in the classroom, but the principle wears a Black Pride tshirt to registration day.

She is not allowed to discuss her Christian upbringing because it could offend someone.

You wouldn't believe some of the other stuff in the school handbook.

I know that there needs to be rules for the kids to follow, but at what point do we allow them to express themselves without fear of repercussion in a learning environment.

Let me tell you if someone strikes my child and she gets in trouble for defending herself we will be going to see a lawyer.

Totally agree with afchic........

Big Teddy

[greenberetTFS]

OTOH, I never got jumped "very often"./quote/TR.........

I never got jumped at all!........."I wasn't a bad ass,but the bad ass's didn't f**k with me either".........

Big Teddy

[greenberetTFS]

Originally Posted by NORMAL550GIRL

Darbs: getting in a "crack" --if by that you mean a smart-mouthed comment-- doesn't warrant a physical response. I'm not sure if that's what you meant in your post, about SE kids being irritating....

There are irritating people in the world, and a teen can't learn that the correct way to deal with that is a "beat-down."

Right on N550G,I'm in your corner on this one.........Most of the guys know I've got 2 sons that were labeled Mentally Handicapped when they started school in the late 60's ........My youngest son Robert's IQ was 79,My oldest son Michael's was 91.....They didn't have any provisions for them when we lived in Cape Coral,Florida,that was because the state was heavy populated with retirees and they voted down "all" school programs,including teacher salaries(first statewide teachers strike)....... They attended school in the same class as the other kids,and were teased a lot but never hit or beat up.........We left Florida and went back to the Chicago suburbs and were then able to have them attend the SE program......They both got thru Grammar and High School and both are now working jobs in maintenance and on a assembly line.....Easter Seal Foundation help our sons with special training in speech therapy,math and english........ The middle son Tony's IQ is 148,he's in Mensa,BA and MA degrees in English and American Literature and is currently the Director of Sales,Penn State Press..........All three of my sons were also "special" in Hockey,they all made the All Star teams in their various divisions every year from Mites to Adult........

Big Teddy

[afchic]

Originally Posted by The Reaper

If there is a policy that punishes the victim as well as the assailant without investigation, I see not reason not to retaliate with everything you have at any incident of assault or physical harrassment.

If I have to take five days off, I might as well have some bloody knuckles and a good war story to tell.

OTOH, I never got jumped very often.

TR

TR that is exactly what I have told my daughter. I would rather deal with a suspension than a hospital stay.

[GratefulCitizen]

Originally Posted by The Reaper

If there is a policy that punishes the victim as well as the assailant without investigation, I see not reason not to retaliate with everything you have at any incident of assault or physical harrassment.

If I have to take five days off, I might as well have some bloody knuckles and a good war story to tell.

OTOH, I never got jumped very often.

TR

That's exactly the advice my father gave to my sister...in a school where he was one of the teachers.

Grew up in school systems where both instigator and victim were punished to some degree, so I adapted to the "rules".
Learned that it was best tolerate minor problems, wait until they were unaware and near a coach/teacher, and ambush them with a full-on assault.

Teacher/coach would break up the conflict before many return shots could be delivered.
Learned a simple rule: if you're in a fair fight, your tactics suck.

[ksboi]

First with a name like Big Teddy I do not see anyone picking on you. Also my brother is a special needs child. He has problem in math and english but he is a whiz at computers and he is very artistic. My mother put him martial arts class and is doing very well, but a bully at school hit him in the bathroom so my brother defended himself and was suspended from school for it. My mother raised hell drove down from work and went to the superintended and basicly threaten to kick his butt and the kids parents.

[darbs]

Originally Posted by NORMAL550GIRL

Darbs: getting in a "crack" --if by that you mean a smart-mouthed comment-- doesn't warrant a physical response. I'm not sure if that's what you meant in your post, about SE kids being irritating....

There are irritating people in the world, and a teen can't learn that the correct way to deal with that is a "beat-down."

Jeez... I put my foot in my mouth...


My apologies, NORMAL550GIRL, I'm by no means disagreeing with you. Teens should know or have some ability of self control by the time they get to high school, but we all know that's not the case.

NCLB has labeled (or lumped) all kids with learning disabilities, behavior disabilities, social disorders, ADHD and any other handicaps listed in NCLB I may have left out as "special ed.".
That really puts the education system, IMHO in a corner as the BD kids, while in some cases very smart, have violence issues. It's a great big sh!t sandwich if you ask me...

In our district, like most, we have a very diverse SPED department and all those kids are in the same building with the regular ed. students. Which makes for a long day some times. I have learned recently that some districts have off site campuses as part of the district for kids with severe LD or BD. While those with disabilities that are able to function amongst the reg. ed. population without major incidents but have a LD go to special ed. classes in the reg. ed. building.
In cases of violence when students have had their 3d, 4th, 5th physical altercation there are options to send them to a offsite county run or private alt school. However, with today's economy and the cost to the district to pay for a placement at a alt school; because NCLB laws make the district liable for the cost, it becomes nearly impossible to expel a kid.
We have several cases right now of that exact nature. Students that have multiple altercations(some are VERY LD/BD and violent) with students and staff, but due to their IEP(Individual Educational Profile) we can't expel them so we have to keep them here, where they don't belong. Quite frankly I'm not so sure it shouldn't be the parents responsibility in some cases to pay for alt placements? (MOO)

In our (there are three of us) role here where I work, we're used as a extension of the Dean's office. The front line if you will in regards to dealing with, not just campus security issues, but student behavior and expectations. We're in the unfortunate position of dealing with the kids when they are at their worst most times. All jacked up because they feel they were treated poorly by a fellow student or staff member. Or maybe they're acting out because things at home are not going well. (Mom and Dad are splitting up, Dad's a drunk and beats Mom and them nightly, they're homeless or whatever the unfortunate circumstance)
They allow us the opportunity to keep kids out of the Dean's office by making on the spot corrections and when necessary referring them to the Dean for more severe consequences if needed. It's a pretty good system. There are many tools at our disposal especially for those kids involved in school activities, "what would your coach say if they saw you acting that way?" It generally reels them in pretty quickly...
Quite honestly, if they hired some schmuck security guard from a pool of guards from a security company like "Guardsmark" that all he did prior to working here was count 2 x 4's at Menards, it wouldn't do much good here. All that guy wants is to get paid and make sure nothing "bad" happens on his watch. I feel things would be much worse if they didn't have someone with an interest in making the kids in the community better individuals.

In regards to the Children with "downs" it is in my experience that they are handicapped to varying degrees and while we still haven't heard what happened in the case in this thread. It could be possible that the boy that got punched, while handicapped, may have incited the boy that punched him. That was all I meant, it's not right by any means but it does happen.

A chemistry teacher here, that retired last year had a great theory in regards to I.Q. levels in relationship to (and in this case) criminal/violent behavior.
You have a line with three points, point A, the middle point B and at the other end point C.
At one end, pt. A, there are the highly intelligent/intellectual/outstanding character values etc.
As you get toward the middle, or pt. B the I.Q. becomes more average and the level of character drops,
As you move along the line to pt. C, intelligence drops and obvious signs of no character values appear and criminal activity/violence increases.
You then take both ends of the line, bring them together forming a circle and what meets when you put the two points together? The highly intelligent, and high crime involved/violent individuals.
*I've yet to find the study on-line but in my very simple mind, this does make sense to some degree. Of course by adding in handicaps like "downs" (or other disabilities), it complicates things in this particular theory doesn't it.

It's been a several years since the school here has changed the policy in regards to blanket suspensions for fighting. When they used to bounce kids evenly no matter the circumstances my kids were told exactly what TR and GreenBeretTFS mentioned. "If you're getting 5 days off, you better get better get "yours".
And as I explained to Afchic in a PM, my kids are no angels but they do not start fights. They have been instructed that if they are ever in the unfortunate situation and have to defend themselves then so be it as long as there was no other choice and they did not instigate the fight and to always tell the truth no matter the consequence. The school here knows I have my kids on a leash and that should they ever deserve the consequence they earned at school they will be punished at home as well, 10X. But they will never be punished at home for defending themselves.
I'm a bit relentless when it comes to their character. There are many mornings that I have to ask them as they're walking out the door, "Does your appearance command respect?". I also remind them often in so many words that, it's more important to have character than to be one...

Thanks for letting me be part of this thread. I realize it's a privilege interact with you all here. I learn more and more just lurking about, you are truly the cream of the crop!