War On Terror's Other Cost: Undeserved Anger At All Muslims

[T-Rock]

KKK Plans To Build Center On Ruins of 16th St. Baptist Church

Ruins of the 16th St. Baptist Church in Which 4 Young Girls Lost Their Lives

August 2, 2010

African American leaders greeted with enthusiasm KKK plans to erect a church and cultural center on the site of the September 15th, 1963 bombing of the 16th St. Baptist Church in Birmingham, Alabama in which 4 young girls were killed.* Leaders of the Alabama Democratic Party as well as national progressive personalities applauded the plans to construct the house of worship as an expression of healing and reconciliation.* J Street, the "Pro Israel", "Pro Peace" organization joined in an expression of solidarity with the KKK.

Isaac Luria, J Street's official spokesperson, issued the following statement in response to opposition to the construction of the cultural center and church:

"I am proud as an American and as a Jew that our heritage is grounded in a strong belief in equality, justice, and religious freedom...I was taught that if freedom can be denied to a single person because of who they are, it can happen to anyone of us.It is time for those of us who share these beliefs to stand up as another religious minority looks to exercise its legal rights in the United States."

Mayor Michael Bloomberg of New York added in support of the project, "“What is great about America, and particularly New York, is we welcome everybody, and if we are so afraid of something like this, what does that say about us?* Montgomery should welcome this project as enthusiastically as New York would."

The fact that the Grand Wizard* refused to name the KKK a "terrorist" organization was apparently not sufficient to deter the project's proponents from endorsing it.

Profound and to the point...

Read the rest here > http://www.jstreetjive.com/2010/08/k...-ruins-of.html

[Green Light]

On 9/12 one had a one-time opportunity for all Americans to come together. All did. Except the Muslims. Did you see them marching in the streets in protest of the attack on our country? No. They just stayed home. We could have stood there, arm in arm as fellow countryment. But no.

I don't trust them because of their religion. I don't trust them because they never cried with us. They celebrated. A man cannot serve two masters. He will love the one and dispise the other. That's a quote, Richard.

They have not joined the right side so they must be on the wrong side.

[T-Rock]

I don't trust them because of their religion. I don't trust them because they never cried with us. They celebrated.

These scenes will be forever seared in my memory

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W6uOf...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oMOZv...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V3u3r...eature=related

[Defender968]

Originally Posted by Green Light

On 9/12 one had a one-time opportunity for all Americans to come together. All did. Except the Muslims. Did you see them marching in the streets in protest of the attack on our country? No. They just stayed home. We could have stood there, arm in arm as fellow countryment. But no.

I don't trust them because of their religion. I don't trust them because they never cried with us. They celebrated. A man cannot serve two masters. He will love the one and dispise the other. That's a quote, Richard.

They have not joined the right side so they must be on the wrong side.

Absolutely couldn't agree more, if theirs is a religion of peace why don't they publically denounce those who do evil in the name of their faith and their god? Why is it that the only clerics/imams we hear from are those that preach hate...why do we never hear from any who preach peace... I was raised Catholic and every time some idiot shot up or blew up an abortion clinic I heard how wrong it was from priests and bishops on the news and in my churches, I have yet to see an imam or cleric on TV denouncing the CONSTANT attacks on innocents by extremists both here and around the world, maybe they say it in their Mosques, it’s hard to say as non believers are not allowed to enter....I guess they don’t want to have to be constantly cleaning the floors of the blood of infidels after they remove their heads as dictated by the Koran...

[akv]

Originally Posted by Green Light

On 9/12 one had a one-time opportunity for all Americans to come together. All did. Except the Muslims. Did you see them marching in the streets in protest of the attack on our country? No. They just stayed home. We could have stood there, arm in arm as fellow countryment. But no. I don't trust them because of their religion. I don't trust them because they never cried with us. They celebrated. A man cannot serve two masters. He will love the one and dispise the other. That's a quote, Richard. They have not joined the right side so they must be on the wrong side.

Sir,

I see the clips of Palestinians cheering 9/11 and my first thought is lets just pull our troops back and turn the whole place into a glowing parking lot. But Sir, where does this end? My question is who exactly is "They"? At the core of our legal system, is a belief which though maddening at times, states we would rather see guilty men walk then innocent men convicted of crimes, such beliefs make us a great nation. Operating under the assumptions we put America's interests first, the people of Palestine, Iraq, and Afghanistan are currently relevant in that enhanced modernization and stability in the Middle East will reduce the chance of nuclear proliferation and further more devastating attacks on our shores.

I was a NY'er in 2001, by my recollection the city was in a state of shock for weeks. People were good to each other for the most part yet there was a lot of fear. Frankly most people I saw with olive skin or Middle Eastern features were scared of retaliation, and the ignorance/backlash of mobs. There was an Afghan Kebab House draped with US flags, Sikh taxi drivers hoping folks would know the difference, and a third generation American of Lebanese Christian descent friend of mine reading a Sports Illustrated was kicked off a flight home to Memphis because some lady said he made her nervous? In this environment would you expect American Muslims to take to the streets arm in arm to show solidarity, perhaps the brave ones. I wonder how Japanese Americans would have been received in Times Square on December 8, 1941? Many of them went on to serve our country bravely in combat while their parents were interned.

If "They" are AQ terrorists or insurgents, or frankly anyone planning or taking up arms against America, they gotta go period. But is "They" law abiding Americans who call god a certain name, or folks in rural Afghan villages who are human currency for the Taliban, or folks like the Bangladeshi cadets Mr. Young mentioned, how are they the enemy?

We have seen instances of Muslims denouncing radical Islam, AQ, terror tactics etc, and they are brushed aside as crocodile tears, Taqiyah or disingenuous by those who advocate The Heart of Darkness solution.

We are Americans, not Soviets or Nazi's their eternal infamy has already shown us the dangers of this path; personally this issue brings the following two quotes to mind. My fear is our enemies cause us to abandon our values and turn on ourselves.

"Your enemy is never a villain in his own eyes. Keep this in mind; it may offer a way to make him your friend. If not, you can kill him without hate — and quickly."
— Robert A. Heinlein

He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you.
—Friedrich Nietzsche

[T-Rock]

Hitler's Jews of Mein Kampf are Muhammad's Kafir of the Qur'an...

[Thomas Paine]

Originally Posted by T-Rock

Hitler's Jews of Mein Kampf are Muhammad's Kafir of the Qur'an...

Powerful. Poignant. Too bad most Americans don't even know what a Kafir is.

LINK:
www.politicalislam.com/blog/kafir

[ZonieDiver]

Originally Posted by greenberetTFS

AKV,

My father,bless his soul,was Sicilian and was drafted at 37 years old in 1942,he was married and had one child,my self,big teddy........He could have easily gotten out of serving his country because of his age and dependent status but he didn't,his only request was not to have to serve and fight in the European front because he had significant family n Sicily,believe it or not,the Army honored his request.......... He was a Combat Medic who served in the Pacific from Guadacanal to Okinawa..........He HATED the Japanese and with good reason,he saw more shit than most men are required to see......... Heavy duty experiences that left him with memories he tried to forget,but never,ever to forgive.........My point is those like Saoirse, who have suffered, and find this request appalling and so it should be!............. Its like putting a Japanese Memorial on the very site of the USS Arizona !!!!! And yes,Richard I saw your post,I thank GOD my father never had to....... I'm an old man who looks at WTF is happening regarding this particular issue and I just thank GOD,and if you should happen to get a little tear in your eye from remembering that hallowed day,well thank God for you your still an American............... (Excuse my grammar and spelling I'm sure I'll be taken to task by my brother QP's,but as always, in a PM as not to embarrass me in front of the Forum)........

Big Teddy

Not by me, Big Teddy. Never!

[ZonieDiver]

Originally Posted by T-Rock

Hitler's Jews of Mein Kampf are Muhammad's Kafir of the Qur'an...

Personally, I think you missed, or deflected, AKV's point.

[Thomas Paine]

Originally Posted by ZonieDiver

Personally, I think you missed, or deflected, AKV's point.

He didn't miss the point. He was making a different one altogther.

AKV is right that we aren't Nazis. But it seems he's happy to accept the "good" Nazis.
How did we fix Nazism? We destroyed the ideology through military might.

This was has been going on for 1,400 years.

The success of Israel in the 6 day war caused a long period of self-doubt in the Muslim world...as they believe "Allah controls all" So why did he allow them to get their ass kicked? Because they weren't on the "right path."

What will it take to stop this islamist, totalitarian, supremacist ideology?

I don't know. But giving them a big fat hug and making them feel good about themselves isn't the answer.

T-Rock is seeing things with crystal clear vision.

[T-Rock]

Personally, I think you missed, or deflected, AKV's point.

I see his point, it's noble and honorable - but I'm speaking of Islamic doctrine that oppresses the "Kafir" - the supremacist ideology of what the devout Muslim is to do if they are truly following the example of their prophet. Devout practitioners of Islam have been oppressing and exploiting the "Kafir" for the better part of 1400 years - tolerance and mutual respect is great as long as it is mutual...why defend the Muslims right to exercise Islams doctrine of supremacy and supercessionism ?

"Muslim chroniclers described the ongoing jihad (holy war), involving the destruction of whole towns, the massacre of large numbers of their populations, the enslavement of women and children, and the confiscation of vast regions. This picture of catastrophe and destruction corresponds to the period of gradual erosion of Palestinian Jewry. According to [the Muslim chronicler] Baladhuri (d. 892 C.E.), 40,000 Jews lived in Caesarea alone at the Arab conquest, after which all trace of them is lost…" ~Bat Ye'or~

[XavierR]

Originally Posted by Thomas Paine

How did we fix Nazism? We destroyed the ideology through military might.

We did not destroy Nazism, it still exists. There are pro Nazi rallies across the country every year. We permit them to participate in these rallies, and express their beliefs. Many of which call for the extermination of people based on religion or skin color. We do not, however, permit them to start killing jews, blacks or hispanics. This is where we draw the line.

I am all for allowing Muslims to express their beliefs. If they believe that their religion requires them to attack others though, they need to find another country. Many chose religious paths other then what we call extremism and literal interpretation. This is similar to how I and many Christians chose to behave differently then Charles Martel when he ordered 1200 captured Muslims executed for not converting to christianity (A World Lit Only By Fire, William Manchester).

I do not personally know any Muslim who was happy when they heard the news on 9-11. Most of them have expressed genuine anger at the fact that their religion was used as an excuse.

My personal and religious values go against religious prejudice, as does my oath to the Constitution.

Islam is a very confusing subject, I do not yet really understand my feelings on it. Its mixture of politics and religion is troublesome, especially in a multicultural society, yet we can not allow our fears of Islam force us away from our foundations of freedom.

[XavierR]

Originally Posted by T-Rock

These scenes will be forever seared in my memory

[youtube videos of Palestinians celebrating the 9-11 attacks

I don't see these as religious celebrations. I believe that the Palestinians saw 9-11 as a strike back against a seemingly untouchable oppressor rather then a religious victory. Many Palestinians have been kicked out of their homes and treated as second class citizens by Israel, paid for by the United States. I can understand their anger against the United States, regardless of religion. I equate it to watching a school yard rival getting beaten by someone else.

[The Reaper]

Originally Posted by XavierR

I do not personally know any Muslim who was happy when they heard the news on 9-11.

How old were you on 9/11?

Cause I saw mobs of them celebrating in the streets, worldwide.

TR

[XavierR]

Originally Posted by The Reaper

How old were you on 9/11?

Cause I saw mobs of them celebrating in the streets, worldwide.

TR

I was in middle school at the time, so yes quite young. I do not remember any celebrating in or around Seattle. I may have missed it however. I do remember the reports from Palestine and Iraq.

With regards to those that I know personally, I did have a few muslim peers at school at the time. Most however are relationships that have been built up since then, through high school and college. None of whom have I ever seen express an emotion other then anger after any of the more recent terrorist attacks. I have heard many of them reference 911 as a blow against Islam.

- Xavier