Ripping the lid off a secret immigration deal

[.]

Originally Posted by Gypsy

Good on 'em. This bill is total insanity.

Nice blanket statement I'm actually looking forward to this bill. If you look into more of the stuff thats in it, you'll see they're replacing the employment sponsorship system with a merit points system. Which I especially like. IMO, the current employment sponsorship is too long, too much paperwork, and beareaucratic (sp?).

Oh, and it won't be easier for the illegals as everyone thinks it will. They won't get greencards. After they get their "Z" visas, they'll have to wait atleast 8 years to apply for Permanent Residency (i.e. GC), and be able to qualify under the merit points system. So in fact it'll be MORE difficult for an illegal than someone trying to come in legally. Its good that the government is doing something about it (might as well) because you see, those 12 million, they're not planning on going anywhere

NOW IS THE TIME for some serious immigration reform. The current system is just too impractical. It is too family based. Its harder for the regular people, like me, to come in, who just want to make some of themeselves in America. And its nice to see the government finally recognizing that.

[Pete]

After a bunch of e-mails to Burr's office he sent me a letter in reply dated June 14, 2007.

A portion of Senator Burr's letter to me - "I believe that we should only permit those into our country who respect our laws, our system of government, and way of life. Immigrants should demonstrate their intensions of becoming productive, law-abiding members of our sociaty as a condition for receiving citizenship."

This was before his "Yes" vote on cloture. I guess he missed the "Illegal" that comes before "Immigrant".

[The Reaper]

Choose, I think when you grow up and have to work, pay taxes, raise a family, etc., you might see that adopting 12,000,000 new children and their extended families, most of whom are not HS graduates and who need a lot of social services, may not be what is best for this country.

In fact, there is an immigration process, and people with PhDs have to wait to get into the US.

Why should a person who has illegally invaded this country already for economic reasons get an easier admission?

The amnesty program has been tried here three times in my lifetime, proposed by the same people, each supposed to be the last before we fix the problems. Each time, the numbers get larger. Here we are again.

Are you an American, BTW?

TR

[frostfire]

Originally Posted by Choose

So in fact it'll be MORE difficult for an illegal than someone trying to come in legally.

wrong. You see, they already here. Until their presence and related problems are solved, other forms of legal entry (work visa, family based, nurse schedule A, etc) are not going anywhere. Having talked to plenty of illegals (not just Mexicans, but also those from Europe, Asia etc.), there is no way in the world they're going to come out and adopt these Z-visa, pay the fines etc. They are comfortable where they are, and they know that the government do not have the resolve to deport them. They already have access to SS benefit, making baby-citizen, why pay $$$ to get permanent residence status, let alone citizenship. As stated here multiple times, they simply don't give a blip about the United States of America. Most of them told me they feel justified in doing so by bringing up how the frontiers took the land from the natives, so it is karma. That was when I decided talking further is a waste of O2.

OTOH, I do support the merit system. I believe that's the system used by Canada?

Originally Posted by Choose

Its good that the government is doing something about it (might as well) because you see, those 12 million, they're not planning on going anywhere

As you said, they're not going anywhere.

[Sionnach]

The Senate has dealt a blow to the shamnesty bill.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,287143,00.html

ETA: Choose, tell that to my educated, technically-skilled friends who have had to leave the country. You see, choose, because they came here legally, the shamnesty bill wouldn't help them. They, being a law-abiding residents, left the country when their H1B visas were no longer valid. Next time you post, you might want to attach a clue.

[Team Sergeant]

Originally Posted by Sionnach

The Senate has dealt a blow to the shamnesty bill.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,287143,00.html

Good news.

I sent both Senator Kyl and Senator McCain emails stating my opinion concerning this "criminal amnesty" bill. Neither will be getting my vote come re-election day.

Team Sergeant


Senator DeMint gets it............Team sergeant


Opponents appeared to sense that victory was within grasp. DeMint said the whole debate demonstrated why Americans are feeling a "crisis of confidence" in their government.

"This immigration bill has become a war between the American people and their government. ... This vote today is really not about immigration, it's about whether we're going to listen to the American people," he said.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,287143,00.html

[incommin]

The Bill is dead! The people in DC got the message. However, we still have some 12 million illegals running around, a border that is wide open, and business as usual.


Jim

[Goggles Pizano]

I have an urge to scream "DOWN GOES FRAZIER! DOWN GOES FRAZIER!"

[Snaquebite]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...062800963.html

The failure marked the second time in a month the bill was pulled from the Senate floor, and this time, Democratic leaders of the Senate indicated it would not be back

DeMint's got it:

"This immigration debate has become a war between the American people and their government," proclaimed Sen. Jim DeMint (R-S.C.), who led a small group of Republican senators who used every parliamentary maneuver they could find to stymie progress on the bill over the past month. "It transcends anything about immigration. It has become a crisis of confidence."

Kennedy is an idiot....

"We know what they're against. We just don't know what they're for," Sen. Edward M. Kennedy (D-Mass.), one of the bill's main architects, thundered about his opponents. "Are we going to respond to the voices of fear? That is the issue."

[Gypsy]

Originally Posted by Choose

Nice blanket statement

Yep, sure was. LEGAL immigration methods need an overhaul, but this bill ain't it. Thankfully The People were heard...

[smp52]

Originally Posted by Sionnach

The Senate has dealt a blow to the shamnesty bill.

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,287143,00.html

ETA: Choose, tell that to my educated, technically-skilled friends who have had to leave the country. You see, choose, because they came here legally, the shamnesty bill wouldn't help them. They, being a law-abiding residents, left the country when their H1B visas were no longer valid. Next time you post, you might want to attach a clue.

I find it interesting that the orginal reason for immigration reform in the 60s was to open a pipeline for educated professionals around the world to find their way into the United States.

Today, it is this very group that faces the most restrictions and cumbersome bureaucracy to make their way here into the USA. My wife just got here and it took her 14 months. No paperwork issues, just a damn slow process. She has a master's degree, too, took all the required medical immunizations, paid fees, and I've had to declare my income as a part of sponsorship paperwork. There are guidlines under which USCIS does not allow people to immigrate here - you have to be above the poverty standards set.

ALL of this goes out the window with illegal immigration. I do not know what will happen to the millions illegally here. It poses some major practical issues, however, they cannot be handed citizenship. A slow and long approach of enforcing current laws on the books and making entry documentation efficient is the way to go. I don't see any lawmakers talking about that seriously.

You can also immigrate to the US by becoming a doctor or nurse, as they are a special "category".

[smp52]

Originally Posted by Martin

You can also immigrate to the US by becoming a doctor or nurse, as they are a special "category".

Those fields are domestically understaffed and in need for more bodies. But overall, we should be increasing American human capital by having educated/professional people here, especially in a globally competitive world. and making sure the path for such people (whose first choice is always the United States) is a controlled yet clean process. Plus, good nurses and doctors are hard to come by almost anywhere.

[The Reaper]

Originally Posted by Broadsword2004

One thing that would be nice if it could be implemented and if it would work mostly as planned would be that Fairtax system I think.

The Fairtax system, from my understanding, if it could be implemented (which is debatable but I am hopeful) would force all American residents (illegal or not) to pay taxes because whenever you buy any product, you pay the tax. It would also abolish the IRS. People also would never have to "do their taxes" again.

But thus the tax burden of all those illegals would be eased up, as they'd be paying taxes.

The other idea I have (if the Fairtax can't be done) would be to design a system where unless you pay taxes, you don't vote. I don't know how it would be enforced, but a system where you absolutely have to be a taxpayer to vote that is enforced would immediately prevent all illegals and welfare recipients from voting.

You need to apply a little analysis here, BS, before posting.

What happens to most of the money illegals earn here?

HINT: They do not spend it in the US.

Not sure how you can effectively tax money being sent back to Mexico.

TR

[blue02hd]

Originally Posted by Choose

I'm actually looking forward to this bill. If you look into more of the stuff thats in it, you'll see they're replacing the employment sponsorship system with a merit points system. Which I especially like. IMO, the current employment sponsorship is too long, too much paperwork, and beareaucratic (sp?).

NOW IS THE TIME for some serious immigration reform. The current system is just too impractical. It is too family based. Its harder for the regular people, like me, to come in, who just want to make some of themeselves in America. And its nice to see the government finally recognizing that.

Choose, I find your comments totally out of line and inappropriate for the audience you are addressing. MoveOn.org may listen however. When Canadian Immigration Reform becomes an issue, then maybe your voice would have weight. Respect is a two way street. If you are not willing to respect our current laws, then exactly how are you going to follow them?

Forgive me for pointing this out, but half the problem we are currently facing remains the fact that the American voice is not heard. A voice which you do not have. Today finally, it has rang clear.

This bill was not in the interest of the United States. Thankfully we had some politicians listen and act.