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View Poll Results: Hemorrhagic Control Agents?
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Yes - Quickclot
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13 |
48.15% |
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Yes - Traumadex
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7 |
25.93% |
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Yes - Other
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3 |
11.11% |
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No - Bad JuJu
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4 |
14.81% |
04-20-2004, 14:25
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#31
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Auxiliary
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: Canada, when I have nowhere else to be.
Posts: 91
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You're right, my question was worded poorly. I agree, all tourniquets must come off eventually.
I was interested in learning about how the complications of a long duration tourniquet were assessed and managed pre and post Tq removal, which Doc T kindly provided.
Thanks.
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Maple Flag is offline
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04-20-2004, 18:56
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#32
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 215
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x
Last edited by DoctorDoom; 07-29-2013 at 10:41.
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DoctorDoom is offline
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08-15-2004, 16:22
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#33
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LA
Posts: 1,653
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Doc T,
Are your EMS guys using HCAs in the field?
__________________
Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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08-15-2004, 16:44
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#34
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Guest
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no...I am not aware of any groups using them except experimentally... following protocols and such.
doc t.
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08-15-2004, 18:03
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#35
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LA
Posts: 1,653
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Thank you. I was wondering what the clean up was like.
__________________
Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
Still want to quit?
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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08-15-2004, 18:21
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#36
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Consigliere
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland (at last)
Posts: 8,825
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4-month-old poll with only 5 votes? Sounds like we need to recruit some more 18Ds . . .
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Roguish Lawyer is offline
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08-15-2004, 19:28
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#37
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Guest
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Quote:
Originally posted by NousDefionsDoc
Thank you. I was wondering what the clean up was like.
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at a conference I heard a talk about the different agents...the gentleman giving the talk said he wouldn't want quick clot used on him with any other alternative available... he stated on the animals it destroyed too much in its path...muscle, nerve, etc...
so again....probably the LAST alternative but better than nothing.
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08-15-2004, 19:30
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#38
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LA
Posts: 1,653
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Must have worked for traumadex...
__________________
Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
Still want to quit?
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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08-15-2004, 20:16
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#39
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Guest
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lol...nope...they have to come clean on that kind of stuff at the start of any talk....
but good try. I take it you voted for quick clot?
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08-15-2004, 20:19
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#40
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LA
Posts: 1,653
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Its all I've got, but I would use it.
__________________
Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
Still want to quit?
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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08-15-2004, 21:08
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#41
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,806
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Concur.
This is meatball trauma management, frequently by un/under-trained personnel, not professional care at a Level 1 Trauma Center.
Hmm, die in 15 minutes from exsanguination, or use a dangerous clotting agent or a tourniquet till they can get me out of here?
I have seen the former with a friend of mine, he sucked up 13 bags of IV solutions till he was circulating pink Kool-Aid and died enroute to a hospital, I'll take my chances with the latter, please.
Just my untrained .02.
TR
__________________
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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08-15-2004, 22:59
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#42
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Guest
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Quote:
Originally posted by Doc T
he wouldn't want quick clot used on him with any other alternative available...
so again....probably the LAST alternative but better than nothing.
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you all seem to read what you want rather than what is written...
again... he said he would not use it if there was an alternative, not that he wouldn't use it at all....
and as i wrote...better than nothing.
His point was its not an alternative to pressure or possibly a tourniquet because the damage seen may ultimately lead to an amputation based on the treatment. As was written earlier in this thread, it should be a last line of treatment..not the first.
doc t.
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08-17-2004, 08:27
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#43
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Guerrilla Chief
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 880
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for more accurate literature, get hold of this months Police magazine (not sure of the exact name) We published a review on all of the products. I can email a longer version of the article to anyone that wants to read it. It was not funded/influenced by any company.
I have used traumadex in the OR....worked very well. The reported problems both as listed here as well as from their own video/literature...I would stay away from it. Traumadex is relatively inexpensive, inert and functional as advertised (I have no affiliation with them)
__________________
'Revel in action, translate perceptions into instant judgements, and these into actions that are irrevocable, monumentous and dreadful - all this with lightning speed, in conditions of great stress and in an environment of high tension:what is expected of "us" is the impossible, yet we deliver just that.
(adapted from: Sherwin B. Nuland, MD, surgeon and author: The Wisdom of the Body, 1997 )
Education is the anti-ignorance we all need to better treat our patients. ss, 2008.
The blade is so sharp that the incision is perfect. They don't realize they've been cut until they're out of the fight: A Surgeon Warrior. I use a knife to defend life and to save it. ss (aka traumadoc)
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swatsurgeon is offline
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08-17-2004, 08:28
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#44
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Guerrilla Chief
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Posts: 880
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last post wasn't clear....the problems with the video/literature was with quik-clot........
__________________
'Revel in action, translate perceptions into instant judgements, and these into actions that are irrevocable, monumentous and dreadful - all this with lightning speed, in conditions of great stress and in an environment of high tension:what is expected of "us" is the impossible, yet we deliver just that.
(adapted from: Sherwin B. Nuland, MD, surgeon and author: The Wisdom of the Body, 1997 )
Education is the anti-ignorance we all need to better treat our patients. ss, 2008.
The blade is so sharp that the incision is perfect. They don't realize they've been cut until they're out of the fight: A Surgeon Warrior. I use a knife to defend life and to save it. ss (aka traumadoc)
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swatsurgeon is offline
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02-12-2005, 09:50
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#45
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LA
Posts: 1,653
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QuikClot
I have known this man for 20 years. He was an SF Medic and my mentor as a PA during my rotation before graduation. This is all I need to know about this HCA.
__________________
Somewhere a True Believer is training to kill you. He is training with minimal food or water, in austere conditions, training day and night. The only thing clean on him is his weapon and he made his web gear. He doesn't worry about what workout to do - his ruck weighs what it weighs, his runs end when the enemy stops chasing him. This True Believer is not concerned about 'how hard it is;' he knows either he wins or dies. He doesn't go home at 17:00, he is home.
He knows only The Cause.
Still want to quit?
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NousDefionsDoc is offline
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