Fear of overdose

[Team Sergeant]

City councilman Dan Picard of Middletown, Ohio spoken like a true moron.

If you want to help the addicts target the dealers. Fifty years prison time for dealing opioids, no parole.

Target the dealers, because America no longer has the balls to target the cartels.

[Flagg]

Originally Posted by Team Sergeant

City councilman Dan Picard of Middletown, Ohio spoken like a true moron.

If you want to help the addicts target the dealers. Fifty years prison time for dealing opioids, no parole.

Target the dealers, because America no longer has the balls to target the cartels.

How do we define "dealer"?

The macro data, such as 50x increase in active ingredient prescribed in just a narrow product range, suggests there is an accountability problem with legal manufacturers, distributors, physicians, and pharmacists.

[cbtengr]

Originally Posted by JJ_BPK

My brother died at age 49 as a result of his alcohol & drug addictions. Up until the day he died, he would not admit the problem,, it was someone else fault for his condition.

I don't have a solution, but I am leery of any test that would be used to deny medical care.

After the first "law",, it will be easy to add other afflictions,,
because they are similar,, and convenient,, and save money..

JJ I am sorry for your loss, drugs and alcohol claimed my older brother too. Perhaps it is time to redefine just what the war on drugs should be. Seems to me that a truce was declared by the Obama administration and it was decided that the drug laws and sentencing guidelines were to be ignored. The new AG is interested in enforcing the laws on the books and the left is going bonkers. Your point and the point of others regarding the denial of medical care is certainly a valid one. No easy answer here at least not one that we will all be able to stomach.

[JJ_BPK]

Originally Posted by cbtengr

Perhaps it is time to redefine just what the war on drugs should be.

I see the war on drugs as two ply TP..

On one side you have people that want to make money.. Good laws, good LEO's and good Judges can fix the problem.

On the other you have people that are either mentally or genetically weak.. This is the half that is not addressed at all.

[Team Sergeant]

Originally Posted by Flagg

How do we define "dealer"?

The macro data, such as 50x increase in active ingredient prescribed in just a narrow product range, suggests there is an accountability problem with legal manufacturers, distributors, physicians, and pharmacists.

When oxycodone was invented many doc's said it was a really bad drug and I would agree.

If you're at a point where you need that sort of pain reliever you should instead be in a drug induced coma and have the problem fixed.

Then again what is it like 50% of Americans are on some sort of psychotropic drugs anyway......... so who cares.

And we do have a system in dealing with the legal drugs, its called a court of law.

Let's start with the illegal drugs first and work our way to the legal ones.

[PSM]

My surgeon told me she prescribed oxy because it was less harmful to the body overall. It did absolutely nothing for me. I switched to plain old aspirin the morning after surgery and it did the job just fine.

Pat

[NurseTim]

Originally Posted by Brush Okie

Yes i remember those days. .8 to 2mg slow iv push titrated to breathing. Yea right. I always gave 2 mg for pt safety.

I always slammed 2mg to them. They were pissed as a hornet when they came up swinging.

[NurseTim]

Originally Posted by PRB

Save the life but make it painful in the pocket book......or find a way to make them pay, garnish wages etc.....

Really? Garnish wages? What from burglary, auto theft? Do they get a w-2 or a 1099 as a private contractor?

Maybe cut off all local, state, and federal benefits.

[trinity]

Originally Posted by NurseTim

I always slammed 2mg to them. They were pissed as a hornet when they came up swinging.

Yes, but you can get away from those swings a lot easier in an ER than you can in the back of an ambulance.

[PedOncoDoc]

I good look at the roots of the opioid epidemic - fault lies (as it often does) with the pharmaceutical company, the FDA, the push for aggressive pain management from the DHHS and federal mandate, and insurance tying medical reimbursement to patient satisfaction.

Here is an excellent article from last year that sums a lot of it up.

As someone who takes care of children with life-threatening illnesses and children with terminal cancer, I prescribe a lot of narcotics - interestingly, the oncologists typically aren't audited despite being heavy prescribers due to the nature of our practice.

[Team Sergeant]

Originally Posted by trinity

Yes, but you can get away from those swings a lot easier in an ER than you can in the back of an ambulance.

Been there done that........

Was working with a female paramedic in Fayetteville, got a call to pick up a drug dealer that just ingested his drugs to hide them from the arresting police.

We arrive, pick him up and of to the ER. Paramedic hits him with the narcan and tells me "Keep him on the gurney". He lifts his head and growls and I grab his forehead and shove him back into the gurney. He looks at me and is "done".

She looks at me as says, "You follow orders well." I was a brand new EMT.

[trinity]

Originally Posted by PedOncoDoc

Here is an excellent article from last year that sums a lot of it up.

Very good article. Here's another article about a 1980 letter that was misused to justify the rampant prescription of opiods early on.

[cbtengr]

Originally Posted by Team Sergeant

When oxycodone was invented many doc's said it was a really bad drug and I would agree.

If you're at a point where you need that sort of pain reliever you should instead be in a drug induced coma and have the problem fixed.

Then again what is it like 50% of Americans are on some sort of psychotropic drugs anyway......... so who cares.

And we do have a system in dealing with the legal drugs, its called a court of law.

Let's start with the illegal drugs first and work our way to the legal ones.

Could not agree more with you as to getting the problem fixed. I have been having issues with my neck for 21 months now. Was prescribed Oxycodone once for 30 days that was over 12 months ago. Recently the pain is getting very intolerable especially at night the neck doc prescribed Tramadol, my son the RN tells me the junkies do not like it when they get Tramadol, no more OXY for them at his hospital. I have issues at C3 C4 C5, doc says we can fuse your whole neck but we won't. I had a series of nerve blocks to determine where I could expect to get the most relief, C4 C5 was the winner, so Thursday morning at 0730 I will enter into a drug induced coma and get it fixed. For the life of me I do not get the buzz or the dependence for opioids, they make me feel not right in the head. The only addiction I ever suffered from by choice was nicotine and I gave that up 6 years ago.

[NurseTim]

Originally Posted by PedOncoDoc

I good look at the roots of the opioid epidemic - fault lies (as it often does) with the pharmaceutical company, the FDA, the push for aggressive pain management from the DHHS and federal mandate, and insurance tying medical reimbursement to patient satisfaction.

Here is an excellent article from last year that sums a lot of it up.

As someone who takes care of children with life-threatening illnesses and children with terminal cancer, I prescribe a lot of narcotics - interestingly, the oncologists typically aren't audited despite being heavy prescribers due to the nature of our practice.

I hold the American pain society largely responsible with their position that "Pain is what the patient says it is." And making the pain scale, now largely useless, the "6th vital sign".

[doctom54]

Originally Posted by NurseTim

I hold the American pain society largely responsible with their position that "Pain is what the patient says it is." And making the pain scale, now largely useless, the "6th vital sign".

The Joint Commission is just as culpable. As always it never hurts to follow the money.

At around the same time, the companies that manufactured these narcotics—including Purdue Pharma, Johnson & Johnson, and Endo Pharmaceuticals—began to aggressively market their products for long-term, non-cancer pain, including neck and back pain. They promoted their prescription narcotics to doctors through ads in highly regarded publications, and through continuing-education courses for medical professionals. They also funded non-profits such as the American Academy of Pain Management and the American Pain Society—the latter previously headed by Dr. Russell Portenoy, a co-author of the Pain study and a proselytizer for expanded narcotics prescribing. The American Pain Society published guidelines that advocated for doctors to expand their use of prescription narcotics to relieve pain.
http://www.newyorker.com/business/cu...-pill-epidemic