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View Poll Results: Swift Boat Vets: Good or Bad for Bush?
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Good
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76.19% |
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Bad
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4 |
19.05% |
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No impact
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4.76% |
08-23-2004, 19:46
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#16
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: between the desert and the sea
Posts: 460
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As always, I appreciate what you have to say on the matter QRQ 30.
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There were two main groups of vets -- other than those who stayed on active duty.
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It sounds like two very hostile sub-groups.
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pulque is offline
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08-23-2004, 19:49
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#17
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,829
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Quote:
Originally posted by pulque
Bush fired him. Bush fired the man because somebody in the media thought it was unfair?
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I doubt if the POTUS hired, or fired the individual in question.
Did you know that a Bush campaign worker was a member of SWVFT before you saw it in the news?
I doubt if the campaign runs a TS background check on every prospective employee.
TR
__________________
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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08-23-2004, 19:51
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#18
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,829
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Quote:
Originally posted by Roguish Lawyer
But I wanted to tell you that I believe that Fort Walton Beach must have the largest concentration of Tattoo/Piercing shops I have ever seen -- and I live not far from Hollywood!!!
RL
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Hey, hijacker, FWB is a VERY big Spring/Fall Break destination.
TR
__________________
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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08-23-2004, 19:53
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#19
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Consigliere
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland (at last)
Posts: 8,845
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Quote:
Originally posted by pulque
Bush fired him. Bush fired the man because somebody in the media thought it was unfair?
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The campaign needs to eliminate any hint of a connection between it and the vets group; otherwise it could be found to have violated some campaign finance laws, or at least there could be a lot of bad press so suggesting.
It doesn't matter of there is not real "connection" as a practical matter -- i.e., if the guy is just coincidentally a member of the two organizations and not involved in any coordination activities. He needed to go just to torpedo the issue before it became a problem.
I don't believe for a second that there is coordination going on here. On the other hand, I do believe it is happening on the Kerry side, but we see no reporting of it.
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Roguish Lawyer is offline
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08-23-2004, 20:03
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#20
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: between the desert and the sea
Posts: 460
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Quote:
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Originally posted by The Reaper I doubt if the POTUS hired, or fired the individual in question.
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Do you think the POTUS is unaware of Kenneth Cordier's situation?
However, you have shown me that it is important to decide carefully what should be considered about the candidates, including movies and ads.
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Did you know that a Bush campaign worker was a member of SWVFT before you saw it in the news?
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negative. I rely on news for information. but I also read forums and web journals to gain perspectives on information.
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pulque is offline
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08-23-2004, 20:14
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#22
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: DFW Texas Area
Posts: 4,741
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Quote:
Originally posted by QRQ 30
Pulque: This is one time I have to say: "You weren't there"
Kerry owes 2 1/2 million veterans of Vietnam a SINCERE apology.
I have been spit upon and called names by the Likes of Kerry.
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I totally concur !!!
Kerry not only owes us, but this country an explanation !! Did he, as he admitted during Congressional Testimony commit WAR CRIMES ??? Or did he SIMPLY tell a LIE !!!
Did he "Aid and Abet" the ENEMY with his testimony ?? Therefore making him TREASONOUS and an enemy himself, or did he simply TELL A LIE ???
Any answer, positive or negative, to any of the above does not make for a pretty picture for a Negative to the FIRST MANDATES a Positive to the next etc !!
Based on what this guy has been spewing, I do not believer that he nor his handlers can quell the questions that are arising, and will continue to arise !!
pulque,
You had better tread lightly on this ground, for you truly do not comprehend with whom you are engaging !!!
__________________
Martin sends.
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Ambush Master is offline
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08-23-2004, 20:23
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#23
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Auxiliary
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Ft. Lee, VA
Posts: 61
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Quote:
Originally posted by The Reaper
Hey, hijacker, FWB is a VERY big Spring/Fall Break destination.
TR
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Between that, the neverending influx of young Airmen with too much free time on their hands, and a rather significant population of bikers - they seem to do quite well.
I am getting dangerously close to 30 and still haven't found a need to decorate myself in such a way - seems like a waste of beer / ammo / gas money to me.
__________________
"Ignorantque datos, ne quisquam serviat, enses"
-Lucanus (A.D. 39-65), De Bello Civili
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Adam White is offline
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08-23-2004, 20:31
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#24
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,829
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Quote:
Originally posted by pulque
Do you think the POTUS is unaware of Kenneth Cordier's situation?
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Frankly, prior to this, I would not have expected the POTUS to be able to pick him out of a line-up, much less know the details of his affiliations.
Do you think Michael Moore is a Kerry supporter?
ghuinness:
DAYUM!!
ONE of the top 25 donors is a Repub, and he is not even in the top nine.
So much for the party of the common man.
TR
__________________
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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08-23-2004, 20:41
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#25
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: between the desert and the sea
Posts: 460
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Quote:
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Originally posted by The Reaper Frankly, prior to this, I would not have expected the POTUS to be able to pick him out of a line-up, much less know the details of his affiliations.
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Sorry for not being clear - I'm asking about after-the-fact. My original statement was that there are ties. I stand by that. Conspiracies bore me.
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Do you think Michael Moore is a Kerry supporter?
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I know he has lost some fans because of the perception that he is a Kerry supporter.
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pulque is offline
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08-23-2004, 20:41
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#26
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,829
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Looked scary till I got to here.
Look what was buried in the Total Cash on Hand line:
Presidential Race:
................Total Raised .......... Total Cash on Hand
All ........... $582,430,013 ........ $151,739,491
Dems ....... $351,717,262 ......... $40,958,599
Repubs ..... $228,743,338 ........ $110,435,980
Based on data released by the FEC on Wednesday, August 18, 2004.
Looks like the Dems are spending money against the SWVFT ads they cannot afford.
Time for the Dems to try to raise some more money, quickly.
I look forward to seeing the numbers after the Republican National Convention.
TR
__________________
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
Last edited by The Reaper; 08-23-2004 at 20:46.
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The Reaper is offline
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08-23-2004, 20:50
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#27
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: between the desert and the sea
Posts: 460
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Quote:
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You had better tread lightly on this ground, for you truly do not comprehend with whom you are engaging !!!
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AM, received and understood.
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pulque is offline
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08-23-2004, 21:06
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#28
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Quiet Professional
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Free Pineland
Posts: 24,829
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Quote:
Originally posted by pulque
Sorry for not being clear - I'm asking about after-the-fact. My original statement was that there are ties. I stand by that. Conspiracies bore me.
I know he has lost some fans because of the perception that he is a Kerry supporter.
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I think that you are wrong on the first count, and nothing personal, but if you really believe the denials of your second statement, you are one of the stupidest people I have ever argued with.
Perception that he is a Kerry supporter? That fat bastard made a propaganda film rivaling Goebbels' finest to help unseat a sitting President in wartime.
John Kerry has desecrated the honor of American servicemembers, stole honor from a checkered four month performance in Vietnam, was present at an assassination plot against elected representatives of this country, aided and abetted an enemy of the United States, voted against the military and military funding at every opportunity, and in general, been about as far from being a leader of this country as I can imagine.
I saw a former anti-war demonstrator bragging the other day about how many servicemembers' lives they saved. They literally caused the deaths of thousands of Americans by providing aid and comfort to the NVA. The NVA knew once popular opinion changed, that they could win a war of attrition. The media was complicit in this, making major efforts to portray the war in the worst light possible, like the "debacle" of Tet. Actually, we eliminated the PAVN during the Tet Offensive (actually, a violation of a ceasefire they negotiated). In the end, the NVA killed hundreds of thousands of their own people in concentration camps they established after winning the war. And thousands of VN vets have taken their own lives after being lied about, rejected, and spit on upon their return. The question should be, "How many of his fellow vets has he really killed?"
Kerry is a member of that gang. Blood is on his hands, and I have no respect for him. Should he be elected, I will leave the military rather than work for that sorry piece of offal. Then you can step up and defend it for a while.
Have a very SF day.
TR
Edited to correct typos.
__________________
"It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat." - President Theodore Roosevelt, 1910
De Oppresso Liber 01/20/2025
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The Reaper is offline
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08-23-2004, 21:08
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#29
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Auxiliary
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: CA, USA
Posts: 72
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I think the "He-Said"; "He-Said", elements are going to hit a saturation level, when the the "Crime Scene Investigation-SW ASIA" fasination, finally wears off the public's awareness. And, those not ensconced in the respective party camps, will call it a "push".
But what the SBVFT's ads may accomplish is nullifying the , "John Kerry, Reporting for Duty" DNC strategy, replacing it with, "What the Hell are We going to do now?" scrambling.
That reforming will be reactionary, and will be internally contentious to the DNC, causing more confusion on how to paint Kerry.
I also found intresting how such a small market ad was such a force multplier, once the poll numbers came into Kerry HQ, compelling some type of reaction. Shows how those polls drive the campaign decisions.
Kerry's Clan could have choosen to ignore the small market ad entirely, but those poll number shook their faith. That was an error on their part. Now that President Bush has called for an halt -- The Dems are left with whining and hand wringing.....
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Seth is offline
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08-23-2004, 21:18
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#30
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Guerrilla
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: between the desert and the sea
Posts: 460
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Originally posted by The Reaper
Quote:
I think that you are wrong on the first count, and nothing personal, but if you really believe the denials of your second statement, you are one of the stupidest people I have ever argued with.
Perception that he is a Kerry supporter? That fat bastard made a propaganda film rivaling Goebbels' finest to help unseat a sitting President in wartime.
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In my experience, Michael Moore has lost some fans of left lean because of the perception that he is a Kerry supporter.
I know that the ads are not aimed at me. In fact, there is no need for me to participate in this discussion any longer.
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Should he be elected, I will leave the military rather than work for that sorry piece of offal.
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Ive been wondering about that.
Have the most SFingest day that you wish to, Sir.
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pulque is offline
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