Troops Punished After Refusing to Attend Evangelical Concert - Page 2

sf11b_p · 08-23-2010, 03:14

So two of eighty soldiers file a complaint with the base EO. Then one, Smith, goes to the Military Religious Freedom Foundation and tells their story. The founder, Michael "Mikey" Weinstein, states they were "spiritually raped by their commanding officers.". Then the story gets to Truthout purveyors of fine articles like, "History Does Not Lie - Unless It Is Being Invented by Republicans".

Well people took "Rangers" Jesse MacBeth and Micah Wright at face value with just their stories, at first.

I haven't found much, any really, compelling evidence that substantiate their statements of the events they claim. I think I'd like to see some, just in case there might be BS involved.

I found this statement in an AP article.

Quote:

Smith said a staff sergeant told 200 men in their barracks they could either attend or remain in their barracks. Eighty to 100 decided not to attend, he said.

"Instead of being released to our personal time, we were locked down," Smith said. "It seemed very much like a punishment." http://www.google.com/hostednews/ap/...AFrSgD9HNJ3C80

This seems closer to the truth since in BCT at Ft. Knox Saturday or Sunday (forget which) was the day we would have the barracks "GI" party... unless we decided to go to church or Chaplains hour (again forget which).

It wasn't punishment or coercion, it was just a choice.

**The Reaper** · 08-23-2010, 06:49

So the version of the story above, from an activist website (before being picked up by Time), is accepted at face value as the truth about what actually happened?

I would be shocked if a GO was stupid enough today, and his legal representation so poor as to allow this to take place as described.

Has anyone here ever seen an EO rep not pursue a case even if it was questionble?

It occurs to me that the majority of chaplains in the US Army are Protestant because the majority of the soldiers are Protestants. The majority of services conducted would also be Protestant for that reason. That does not mean that the Army requires Protestant worship, does not have priests, rabbis, imams, etc., or does not permit the worship of other gods.

I will reserve judgement while waiting for the other side of this one.

OTOH, I know of a PSYOP CO who had two troops bring complaints because they had "Jedi" on their dog tags, which is apparently a recognized religion. The CO said he didn't care what they worshipped, he just needed to know who to call to perform a burial ceremony. One recanted his status as a "Sith Lord" but the other refused to budge and wound up with a mental health referral.

TR

**Razor** · 08-23-2010, 09:01

I always found the group prayer a small price to pay for the donuts, juice and canopy time during the Chaplain's jumps.

**Team Sergeant** · 08-23-2010, 09:08

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razor

I always found the group prayer a small price to pay for the donuts, juice and canopy time during the Chaplain's jumps.

LOL, my thoughts exactly.

HOLLiS · 08-23-2010, 10:03

I think I read there is more to the story, actually non-story.

Besides donuts, the chance to be with real people who didn't yell at you with colorful metaphors.

Stras · 09-01-2010, 05:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razor

I always found the group prayer a small price to pay for the donuts, juice and canopy time during the Chaplain's jumps.

not to mention the free t-shirts for the JMs that supported the operation. Seems that the Chaplain had low faith in his creator, as he didn't want to accept the tandem jump with the MFF team.

You have free food, free eye candy, and no one has a gun pointed at your head forcing you to listen to the religious rhetoric. I'm sorry, but what is the problem?

greenberetTFS · 09-01-2010, 08:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stras

not to mention the free t-shirts for the JMs that supported the operation. Seems that the Chaplain had low faith in his creator, as he didn't want to accept the tandem jump with the MFF team.

You have free food, free eye candy, and no one has a gun pointed at your head forcing you to listen to the religious rhetoric. I'm sorry, but what is the problem?

I concur..............

Big Teddy

dr. mabuse · 09-01-2010, 08:18

OTOH, if it is true, I could sympathize, like being forced to stand behind POTUS and grin like I'm enjoying the photo op.

greenberetTFS · 09-01-2010, 08:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by craigepo

As a Christian, this type of pressure bothers me.

There is a Bible verse prohibiting "casting pearls before swine". This verse was not meant in a derogatory sense, but to illustrate that if people don't want to hear what a Christian has to say, the issue should not be forced.

Humans screw up a lot of stuff.

Exactly...........

Big Teddy

Saoirse · 09-01-2010, 08:47

I have to wonder, if they were forced to march to an islamic <slash> cultural event and decided that they were not willing to attend...what would the outcome be? Would they then be prosecuted as being islamaphobes? Racists? Disobeying a direct order? BUT...because these trainees were given an option, and they chose the "wrong one", it's "spiritual rape"? I found this story interesting and curious. No doubt, if the shoe was being worn on the other foot, there would be a shitstorm hitting the fan!

But..not for nothing, what is the issue with these two trainees, really? They get three hots, a cot, training, a paycheck and a free concert given by 3 lil hotties (albeit Christian Hotties). BTW, I do like their music, they are very talented young ladies.

Guy · 09-01-2010, 23:16

Quote:

Originally Posted by Razor

I always found the group prayer a small price to pay for the donuts, juice and canopy time during the Chaplain's jumps.

If a monkey was holding some sort service, I'd have gone just too get out of the SUCK!

Stay safe.

lksteve · 09-01-2010, 23:31

Quote:

Originally Posted by Guy

If a monkey was holding some sort service, I'd have gone just too get out of the SUCK!

Here ya go...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vOVMalnxL0M

And let the record show that during the one weekend in OCS I wasn't inspecting parking stripes in the lot by Building 4, I was right behind Richard in the line for cookies, kool-aid and redemption...they ran out of cookies and redemption before I got there...

MP2SF · 09-02-2010, 04:13

The soldiers in training marched to a post wide event. Then upon arrival, were told either attend the event or march back to the barracks for "lockdown" and, they can't use their "personal electronics". So, let me get this right, they had an option to stay or leave (and achieve more practice at D&C). If they left the event they could not use their "personal electronics". Why do IET soldiers have electronics? They should be studying basic soldiering skills and for their MOS, not using an ipod or cell phone. What is going on in TRADOC?

tst43 · 09-02-2010, 12:18

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pete

Whatever.......

But the big question "Dude, you were in training and they were GIRLS!!!!!!!!"

Man, the Army just ain't the same.

I couldn't agree more. However, if I found out I was being marched to a Dixie Chicks concert, then there might have been trouble.

In my day, we would have been on lockdown because someone yelled "Show your ......"

USANick7 · 09-02-2010, 16:25

I think there needs to be some serious revisiting on religion in society.

I get a little tired of people complaining when there is a religious theme but being completely fine if the band presented sang songs with lyrics that presented a much different world view.

I'm sorry but there is no such thing as a neutral position. Whether you like it or not your views on religion influence your decisions...that includes atheists, agnostics, Jedi's etc.

If the band had been purely secular and I as a Christian had found some of the lyrics offensive I might have chosen to do something else, but I probably wouldn't have complained like a petulant little brat.

What is this culture coming to?