Climbing Skins

[alfromcolorado]

Originally Posted by HOLLiS

Skiing with a ruck on can be like trying to ski with a unruly monkey on ones back. I made some loops for going over the ski and hanging up the binding, they where for drag one going down hill. I later bought a sled, and the game changed. Down hill became a much more fun. Also the sled had a drag brake (if needed) I'll need to dig up some Crater Lake winter camping photos.

One other thing I did, depending on run out, just let the back slide down on it's own. This was for a heavy pack.

Not sure any of this would be utilized by the Military.

I always ski with a ruck on, backcountry or on slope. Practice makes perfect.

I don't do long multi-day trips though. My ruck usually comes in at about 35 lbs. in the backcountry. If my 4X4 won't get me in for a place to sleep I will slog in with a heavier ruck, camp and do day trips.

Not into hauling weight around anymore.

In Europe it is the heat because you can move with 35 lbs and stay in the Huettes. Much more civilized...

[x SF med]

Originally Posted by HOLLiS

Skiing with a ruck on can be like trying to ski with a unruly monkey on ones back.

Reminds me of my first WET... learning to ski with a ruck was different from anything else - and I knew a little about skiing...

There were a few Instructors who were evil as hell - see the moguls - ski them with Ramers LBE and a ruck. Have you ever had a Ramer binding release at 30 mph on a friggin buried VW van with a 70 lb ruck strapped to your back, while dressed in 1st Gen goretex. You stop suddenly when you hit a tree or reach the bottom of the hill (crowd of civilians waiting for a lift - bowling for ski bunnies, as it were) or a snowdrift off the slope.

Soldiers with rucks bounce and slide well...

[HOLLiS]

Originally Posted by alfromcolorado

I always ski with a ruck on, backcountry or on slope. Practice makes perfect.

I don't do long multi-day trips though. My ruck usually comes in at about 35 lbs. in the backcountry. If my 4X4 won't get me in for a place to sleep I will slog in with a heavier ruck, camp and do day trips.

Not into hauling weight around anymore.

In Europe it is the heat because you can move with 35 lbs and stay in the Huettes. Much more civilized...

About the same here, If I skied with a ruck, I try to keep the weight down. I don't like to go over 25 pounds. I have skied off of a few mountains and a lighter ruck is a necessity. I ski on "Telemark" equipment. Free heel skiing gives some benefits in skiing off-piste. In stead of the parallel turn, the telemark turns is great for crud, breakable crust. It is a little weaker on ice.

Again for camping and long trips a poke/sled is the way to go. One can haul a lot more with less effort. On one Crater Lake ski, I had ice climbing equipment, my wife's stuff, a heavy four season tent and my stuff. She just had a light pack with just the necessities.



X SF, I was not a fan of Ramer bindings, Silveretta seemed to have been a better set up. I can imagine the view for the chairs.

[JAB10th]

I have recently retired and I think I still have a pair of the purple skins. They worked well as long as you maintained them. Group dose not issue them any more now they are blue.

Hey Al how's it going ?
Biff

[Stras]

Originally Posted by alfromcolorado

Naughty boys teaching people to ski with skins on...

Well, if the powers that be would quit sending us Team Sergeants and SGMs from other SF Groups, we wouldn't have had to baby them.

They cried when we handed them a rucksack and sled.

Though Kenny B. did get the 4 day pass for breaking the TS. but that's a long story. TS was an "expert" skier from 1st Group. We will briefly mention his last ski run down a BLUE slope that ended with his yellow tobagen ride courtesy of the Ski Patrol.

[alfromcolorado]

Ah, the eternal "Telemark" vs. Alpine Touring debate...

I tele'd early on and ditched it for AT gear. I have found it much more efficient in any BC conditions AND you don't stick your knees out there and apart looking for trouble. My experience says free heel is not better off piste in any way.

But this argument could go on about as long as it already has in BC circles.

My partner and I met a tele Scot on the Haute Route and he linked up with us. We had to wait on him quite a bit... But I think he was advanced intermediate. I had to fix his ski pole after one particular steep section...

I usually have about 35 lbs if climbing is involved. I have a very nice Arcteryx (sp?) ruck that hangs on the back quite well...

If my lady friend wants to go in heavy... Well, let's just say I support some forms of women's rights...

Originally Posted by HOLLiS

About the same here, If I skied with a ruck, I try to keep the weight down. I don't like to go over 25 pounds. I have skied off of a few mountains and a lighter ruck is a necessity. I ski on "Telemark" equipment. Free heel skiing gives some benefits in skiing off-piste. In stead of the parallel turn, the telemark turns is great for crud, breakable crust. It is a little weaker on ice.

Again for camping and long trips a poke/sled is the way to go. One can haul a lot more with less effort. On one Crater Lake ski, I had ice climbing equipment, my wife's stuff, a heavy four season tent and my stuff. She just had a light pack with just the necessities.



X SF, I was not a fan of Ramer bindings, Silveretta seemed to have been a better set up. I can imagine the view for the chairs.

[alfromcolorado]

Originally Posted by Stras

Well, if the powers that be would quit sending us Team Sergeants and SGMs from other SF Groups, we wouldn't have had to baby them.

They cried when we handed them a rucksack and sled.

Though Kenny B. did get the 4 day pass for breaking the TS. but that's a long story. TS was an "expert" skier from 1st Group. We will briefly mention his last ski run down a BLUE slope that ended with his yellow tobagen ride courtesy of the Ski Patrol.

Yeah, some of them needed to be "broke" in a bit.

[alfromcolorado]

Originally Posted by JAB10th

They worked well as long as you maintained them.

Yeah, what's up with this having to maintain gear shit?

Doing fine Biff, how about you?

I am working down in Jarhead land and there ain't no decent skiing for days!!

[BulletcatchR]

Originally Posted by Stras

I used the purple skins at Carson. Don't remember who made them, but they worked really well. They were great for training the new guys how to downhill ski. kept them slow enough to get the mechanics down as we graduated them from the bunny hill to steeper slopes. then when they were ready, we took the skins off and let them loose.

I've seen purple bottom skins around, not messed with them tho.
I've been using the USGI surplus ten dollar strap on skins the last couple years to keep myself from getting into trouble. I might not do much anymore but if there is snow and I am not hurt I'll ski to mailbox 1/2 mile or so and patrol around alittle on the way home. I brought the "cheap" USGI skins because I didn't want to ruin my "nice" ones, I will occasionally cross a gravelled or salted road and ski the roads before they get plowed so my gear has a LOT of gouges and scabs on it.
I run Asnes surplus skis with Ramer surplus bindings, a decent but heavy BC freeheel rig for under 100 bucks with telescoping poles. I don't mind the heavy because I am PTing my knees, skiing has been the only enjoyable way I can get my wind up to puke level without trashing my knees too much. As long as I chill on the downhill runs.

As mentioned elsewhere, the USGI strap on skins can be modified (side straps and associated pads cut off) and used with glue. Keeping the fore and aft strapon attachment straps makes for a secure setup and workable backup for when the glue fails.


If I leave the house for anywhere but the mailbox I'll wear a pair of Bushwhackers with the strapin bindings and take my snowshoes along for the hills. Back in the day I could cut down my hills but as I get older the trees and brush I need to dodge seem to get bigger. hehe.

I was wondering since we have the attention of skiiers if anyone knows the nomenclature or NSN of the USGI 'strap in' ski binding I used from the 80's, a Berwin Binding style rig. I have a few pairs around for 'guest' skis and they are getting beat. These are the bindings that I trained with as a leg in the 80s, but with differrent heavier skis.

I learned on mohair strapon skins, the braking effect had saved my ass from peril many a time. I once spent two hours face down in the snow with my feet pidgeontoed in 'beartrap' cable bindings. I was 11-12 YO and still remember how humiliating yet relieving it was when rescued... Of all the shit I can't do skiing is one that hurts most.


I found this link searching for information about the USGI Ramer bindings, I've been using those for a few years now without the cable brakage I heard about, has anybody put hard use and abuse to these bindings? I have tried to bust these 'on the bench' and am satisfied. I tend to switch boots and adjust the cables, so that might be why I'm not getting the breakage I had read about. there is no way I am sure that the Ramer's I read about were the USGI model so I ask here.

TNX!

c361

Stan

[mffjm8509]

Originally Posted by creations_bane

its good to hear that they have been put to use, does anyone know if these are still issued?

I was issued a pair again when I returned to 10th last year and used them the past couple of weeks during CWT. They only work with the older skis as Group is moving to a wider, shorter ski and require a wider skin.

mp

[HOLLiS]

Originally Posted by mffjm8509

I was issued a pair again when I returned to 10th last year and used them the past couple of weeks during CWT. They only work with the older skis as Group is moving to a wider, shorter ski and require a wider skin.

mp

Skinny ski will work depending on attachment. Stickies skins are GTG. The extra length is just wrapped up over the tail of the ski. I like that, it makes removing the skin with skis on much easier.

I had a alpine touring rig (short wide ski) and Telemark (Longer skinny ski). I had wide skins and skinny skins. I did not like skins that was a wide as the ski, messes with the edges. Again the skins where mohair adhesive skins.

[alfromcolorado]

Originally Posted by HOLLiS

Skinny ski will work depending on attachment. Stickies skins are GTG. The extra length is just wrapped up over the tail of the ski. I like that, it makes removing the skin with skis on much easier.

I had a alpine touring rig (short wide ski) and Telemark (Longer skinny ski). I had wide skins and skinny skins. I did not like skins that was a wide as the ski, messes with the edges. Again the skins where mohair adhesive skins.

With the new shaped skis it is best to buy a skin made for the measurements of the ski. That way they cover the bottom of the ski as much as they need to for optimum traction and don't cover any of the edges allowing their use if needed.

I quit cutting them myself since it is easier and not really any more expensive to buy them the best fit.

Problem with fitting "shaped" skins to shaped skis is that they don't fold up as nicely for going back in the back. Don't forget your skin bag...

[HOLLiS]

Originally Posted by alfromcolorado

With the new shaped skis it is best to buy a skin made for the measurements of the ski. That way they cover the bottom of the ski as much as they need to for optimum traction and don't cover any of the edges allowing their use if needed.

I quit cutting them myself since it is easier and not really any more expensive to buy them the best fit.

Problem with fitting "shaped" skins to shaped skis is that they don't fold up as nicely for going back in the back. Don't forget your skin bag...

Only problem that I experiences in using a skiing skin on a wide ski. While skiing behind another skier. The skin would be in the rut left by the other ski and the wide ski would not, the skin would not have traction. Easy fix was to ski off track.

My first set of randonee skis were something like 80-60-70 and 180cm long. Wider skin would add more traction. Traction needed depends on snow/ice condition. I was thinking if you have multiple pairs of skis. The skinniest ski needs to be fitted. My tele skis where 200 - 210 Cm lengths and Randonee 180 - 200 in lengths.

[alfromcolorado]

Originally Posted by HOLLiS

Only problem that I experiences in using a skiing skin on a wide ski. While skiing behind another skier. The skin would be in the rut left by the other ski and the wide ski would not, the skin would not have traction. Easy fix was to ski off track.

My first set of randonee skis were something like 80-60-70 and 180cm long. Wider skin would add more traction. Traction needed depends on snow/ice condition. I was thinking if you have multiple pairs of skis. The skinniest ski needs to be fitted. My tele skis where 200 - 210 Cm lengths and Randonee 180 - 200 in lengths.

Most people I know have wide skis now. I guess I will have to inspect people's skis before launching now...

[Conrad Y]

Who needs skins. Just put some sticky wax from Norway on there and call it good.